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  1. #16
    BANNED Beaddle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    You know I literally said this

    .
    okay


    But go ahead keep trying to justify why your favorites are legit and what you don't like didn't met the imaginary merit measurement whatever makes you feel happy
    its not about my favourites and even if they were, they are my favourites because they were objectively the best created done films and there are some solid good film making measurement to support that. this is why I love to talk about directors style and talent than playing studio loyalty,

    generic derivative movies are never my favourite films, I can find them fun but those are not the criteria for Oscars in a fair world.


    I still don't expect you to understand where am coming from, since you once told me, a movie with great practical effects is still worse than a movie with 90s video game cgi because the movie with 90s video game cgi had much higher rotten tomatoes scores and made more money.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by titanfan View Post
    As a comic book movie fan, I'm also giving a big "WTF" to Joker being nominated for best adapted screen play. Adapted off of what?!?!?! The character in the movie is nothing like the Joker in comic books or in previous movie incarnations, other than having the same name.
    I've tried to avoid all spoilers on the Joker and just saw it recently. I totally understand now all the comments about this movie not using the actual character but his name only. Great performance by Phoenix and he deserves the Award. I just knew they were going to pull the sympathy card for Arthur Fleck. Show him actually murdering innocent people like the comics. What a cop-out.

  3. #18
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    Imma' about to drop it hot, so brace yourselves.

    The reception of Joker's and some other movies best picture nominations just points to the rank hypocrisy and dishonesty in fandom. Now, i like Joker but apart from Joaquin Phoenix's performance, it didn't really bring anything new to table (like say Black Panther which was a first in many different ways) seeing as it was derivative of several movies that came before. That being said, I understand the film's nomination because it had a strong social-political message like most Oscar nominations but we don't see the complaints about the film's politics because Todd Philips and Joaquin Phoenix are white men and it's dealing with issues that white people can "understand". We don't really need to look too far back to see the hyperbolic reaction towards BP best picture nomination. That being said, Joker got a massive awards push from WB around the time of its release up onto Oscar season, so while some people might complain about it, that's the way the season goes and I FULLY expect Joaquin Phoenix to get the Best Actor award.

    Beyond that, I don't know how Adam Sandler, Jennifer Lopez, Lupita Nyongo and Eddie Murphy got snubbed. Heck, even Willem Dafoe and Robert Pattinson deserved consideration for their performances in the Light House. I'm not sure why Leonardo Dicaprio, Anthony Hopkins or even Meryl Streep are getting nominations over and over again. I'm also not sure how Cynthia Erivo got a nomination for Harriet, that movie was straight up, watered down trash. Finally, I don't know what the Oscars have against A24, they tend to snub their movies a whole lot...these are things that I expect guys like Scorsese and co to be talking about instead of some inane ranting against Marvel movies not being cinema or something. But they won't because they are part of the establishment now.

    Peace out!
    Last edited by Username taken; 01-14-2020 at 12:10 AM.
    "Obviously not all conservatives are racists/bigots but all racists/bigots claim to be conservative"- Unknown

  4. #19
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post
    okay



    its not about my favourites and even if they were, they are my favourites because they were objectively the best created done films and there are some solid good film making measurement to support that. this is why I love to talk about directors style and talent than playing studio loyalty,

    generic derivative movies are never my favourite films, I can find them fun but those are not the criteria for Oscars in a fair world.


    I still don't expect you to understand where am coming from, since you once told me, a movie with great practical effects is still worse than a movie with 90s video game cgi because the movie with 90s video game cgi had much higher rotten tomatoes scores and made more money.
    If your talking about Black Panther mutiple people have told you repeatedly why the story was Oscar worthy and the deeper themes that movie tackled. You just ignore them and start talking about Bad CGI and reverse racism.

  5. #20
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post

    its not about my favourites and even if they were, they are my favourites because they were objectively the best created done films and there are some solid good film making measurement to support that. this is why I love to talk about directors style and talent than playing studio loyalty,

    )
    This is going to be last response on this because it starts to go into personal area on not the topic but you put out there literally every post from you is on studio loyalty. This why people have these big circular convos with you Marvel/Disney equal BAD. Everything else equal GOOD. You can never have a real discussion on merit because you are bias against one thing and then make your point right you other thing on pedestal even though other thing has just as much flaws. It is fine that people have differing opinions but we literally know how every topic with you is going to go. It is literally why you are riding hard for New Mutants when objectively fan or not that movie has so much red flags and if it was made by Marvel outright you would be criticizing the hell out of it. Anyways moving my next response is going to be on the actually topic

    On topic It would be have nice to Robert Downey get nominated for Avengers but category is stacked this year

  6. #21
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    This is going to be last response on this because it starts to go into personal area on not the topic but you put out there literally every post from you is on studio loyalty. This why people have these big circular convos with you Marvel/Disney equal BAD. Everything else equal GOOD. You can never have a real discussion on merit because you are bias against one thing and then make your point right you other thing on pedestal even though other thing has just as much flaws. It is fine that people have differing opinions but we literally know how every topic with you is going to go. It is literally why you are riding hard for New Mutants when objectively fan or not that movie has so much red flags and if it was made by Marvel outright you would be criticizing the hell out of it. Anyways moving my next response is going to be on the actually topic

    On topic It would be have nice to Robert Downey get nominated for Avengers but category is stacked this year
    Back on topic yea I woulda liked RDJ to get one too but looking at the nominees I'm fine with him not.

    Knives out and Uncut Gems getting no love at all from the Oscars still doesnt sit right with me. But whatever I love JoJo Rabbit so I'm glad to see it's getting so much love atleast.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midvillian1322 View Post
    If your talking about Black Panther mutiple people have told you repeatedly why the story was Oscar worthy and the deeper themes that movie tackled. You just ignore them and start talking about Bad CGI and reverse racism.
    To be fair only fans of MCU told me it was Oscar worthy, as for the themes, there have been other comic movies that tackled much much deeper themes beyond Disney's derivate formulaic take of the themes in black panther. they were not nominated. Most MCU fans told me Infinity Wars was more deserving.

  8. #23
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post
    To be fair only fans of MCU told me it was Oscar worthy, as for the themes, there have been other comic movies that tackled much much deeper themes beyond Disney's derivate formulaic take of the themes in black panther. they were not nominated. Most MCU fans told me Infinity Wars was more deserving.
    Again you didn't say anything. What were the themes of Black Panther then? And tell me why you feel they didnt work instead of saying the usual nothing. Forget the surface material of the film about the morality of isolationism. Specifically what Coogler way saying with the characters of Tchalla and Killmonger and the comparison between the two. Then why you feel it doesnt work? Simple
    Last edited by Midvillian1322; 01-14-2020 at 01:27 AM.

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Black Panther "derivate formulaic take of the themes"
    Joker "completely original but yet "inspired" by the Taxi and King of Comedy"

    I am not attacking Joker to be clear I am just pointing out what people will overlook and try to a spin on stuff in a effort to try to bash things. This is annoying because I really think Joker should get its credit and we shouldn't be talking about this right now but it is unavoidable to talk about the treatment of one thing without point how they treat the other thing.

  10. #25
    BANNED Beaddle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    Imma' about to drop it hot, so brace yourselves.

    The reception of Joker's and some other movies best picture nominations just points to the rank hypocrisy and dishonesty in fandom. Now, i like Joker but apart from Joaquin Phoenix's performance, it didn't really bring anything new to table (like say Black Panther which was a first in many different ways) seeing as it was derivative of several movies that came before. !

    How was Black Panther a first? is it true that the difference between black panther and and blade is, Black panther had mostly and all black cast and blade didn't. I thought it was more of the lead character, who got their first. Black Panther is not the first Marvel black hero, so it is not a first.

    That being said, I understand the film's nomination because it had a strong social-political message like most Oscar nominations but we
    Peace out
    Why were other movies with stronger political message denied?

    Beyond that, I don't know how Adam Sandler, Jennifer Lopez, Lupita Nyongo and Eddie Murphy got snubbed. Heck, even Willem Dafoe and Robert Pattinson deserved consideration for their performances in the Light House. I'm not sure why Leonardo Dicaprio, Anthony Hopkins or even Meryl Streep are getting nominations over and over again. I'm also not sure how Cynthia Erivo got a nomination for Harriet, that movie was straight up, watered down trash. Finally, I don't know what the Oscars have against A24, they tend to snub their movies a whole lot...these are things that I expect guys like Scorsese and co to be talking about instead of some inane ranting against Marvel movies not being cinema or something. But they won't because they are part of the establishment now.

    Peace out!
    It could very well be possible this has nothing to do with race, unlike the obviousness of Black Panther's nomination.

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Black Panther "derivate formulaic take of the themes"
    Joker "completely original but yet "inspired" by the Taxi and King of Comedy"

    I am not attacking Joker to be clear I am just pointing out what people will overlook and try to a spin on stuff in a effort to try to bash things. This is annoying because I really think Joker should get its credit and we shouldn't be talking about this right now but it is unavoidable to talk about the treatment of one thing without point how they treat the other thing.
    So you said I was bias but you are quick to say Joker is Taxi and King of Comedy. Will it also be fair and balance to say Black Panther is Lion King, Some X-men movies and Thor 1?

    I call it good similarities or likeness because contary to popular believe, fiction is still limited. many writers do end up with the same story outlines, however some stories can be derivate or watered down to the another story with similar plotlines. Black Panther is good example caused by the Disney constrains, Joker isn't as joker embodies the same amount of content that king of comedy and taxi driver have because unlike Disney, WB does not have to water down their fiction or over simply it. something Disney has admitted they do. Again, this is what the oscars love. when stories are not watered down.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midvillian1322 View Post
    Again you didn't say anything. What were the themes of Black Panther then? And tell me why you feel they didnt work instead of saying the usual nothing. Forget the surface material of the film about the morality of isolationism. Specifically what Coogler way saying with the characters of Tchalla and Killmonger and the comparison between the two. Then why you feel it doesnt work? Simple

    What are the themes in black panther that is so present based in the entire dialogue of the movie that was enough for Oscars.

    https://static1.squarespace.com/stat...ck+Panther.pdf

    I read the screenplay, I am not saying it is not Oscar worthy, what I am saying is there are stronger stories that never got nominated, , the themes are just glossed upon, not necessarily discussed. I can show you another screenplay that has more depth to this, which is a criteria for oscars.
    Specifically what Coogler way saying with the characters of Tchalla and Killmonger and the comparison between the two. Then why you feel it doesnt work? Simple
    By this reason, Chris Helmsworth and Tom Hiddleston should have gotten Oscar nominations for their work in the first Thor film. Christian Bale and Liam Neeson should have been nominated for Oscars for Dark Knight 1, Patrick Stewart and Ian Mckellen would have gotten life time achievement awards for their roles in X-men films.

    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    This is going to be last response on this because it starts to go into personal area on not the topic but you put out there literally every post from you is on studio loyalty. This why people have these big circular convos with you Marvel/Disney equal BAD. Everything else equal GOOD. You can never have a real discussion on merit because you are bias against one thing and then make your point right you other thing on pedestal even though other thing has just as much flaws. It is fine that people have differing opinions but we literally know how every topic with you is going to go. It is literally why you are riding hard for New Mutants when objectively fan or not that movie has so much red flags and if it was made by Marvel outright you would be criticizing the hell out of it. Anyways moving my next response is going to be on the actually topic
    I did have a real conversation or try to have one at least , I went for the heart of the films. it was you that I felt was not interested in a real discussion about movie quality as you kept on using rotten tomatoes and box office, which is not part of any real discussion about movies that is taken seriously. let alone oscars, when best pictures winners like Green Book, Forrest Gump and Gladiator are in the 70s rt range. captain marvel is more worthy of oscars than all these films.

    How can you say I am bias when I have said, the superhero movies in spite of the studios that made them that will stand less chance of oscars are the movies that are the most co-operate produced than director driven, bizarrely light hearted with less adult content and have too much CGI and are more action comedy than drama driven.that is not bias, there is real obvious evidence that supports that based on the oscars own criteria of what movies they like. I am not to blame that the comic movies you prefer over movies like Joker fall into these category.

    On topic It would be have nice to Robert Downey get nominated for Avengers but category is stacked this year
    Speaking of what I said above, this almost proves what I am saying. RDJ never stood chance, Endgame has a pixar like screenplay , for life action films, it will be hard for any actor to win any awards. If Endgame had done the demon in the bottle storyline for RDJ which is a marvel comic story not a pixar kind of story, then I think he would have stood a chance for Oscar nominations, that is the criteria for oscars. Oscars love it when actors play very drunk, cynical and depressed people. Endgame took that type of story line away from RDJ.

    Pheionix 's Joker story line is driven by his heavy mental issues, RDJ role in endgame is quite light compared to that. He cannot get nominated for Oscars in a superhero film. sadly.
    Last edited by Beaddle; 01-14-2020 at 07:58 AM.

  12. #27
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    Yah even though Avengers Endgame was very entertaining, the characters were more like caricatures, to me, assembled to serve the plot. Tony is the same guy at the beginning and the end of the movie, except for the whole life and death thing. Dramatic moments were present but they were not earned by acting and character development.
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  13. #28
    King of Wakanda Midvillian1322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post
    What are the themes in black panther that is so present based in the entire dialogue of the movie that was enough for Oscars.

    https://static1.squarespace.com/stat...ck+Panther.pdf

    I read the screenplay, I am not saying it is not Oscar worthy, what I am saying is there are stronger stories that never got nominated, , the themes are just glossed upon, not necessarily discussed. I can show you another screenplay that has more depth to this, which is a criteria for oscars.


    By this reason, Chris Helmsworth and Tom Hiddleston should have gotten Oscar nominations for their work in the first Thor film. Christian Bale and Liam Neeson should have been nominated for Oscars for Dark Knight 1, Patrick Stewart and Ian Mckellen would have gotten life time achievement awards for their roles in X-men films.



    I did have a real conversation or try to have one at least , I went for the heart of the films. it was you that I felt was not interested in a real discussion about movie quality as you kept on using rotten tomatoes and box office, which is not part of any real discussion about movies that is taken seriously. let alone oscars, when best pictures winners like Green Book, Forrest Gump and Gladiator are in the 70s rt range. captain marvel is more worthy of oscars than all these films.

    How can you say I am bias when I have said, the superhero movies in spite of the studios that made them that will stand less chance of oscars are the movies that are the most co-operate produced than director driven, bizarrely light hearted with less adult content and have too much CGI and are more action comedy than drama driven.that is not bias, there is real obvious evidence that supports that based on the oscars own criteria of what movies they like. I am not to blame that the comic movies you prefer over movies like Joker fall into these category.



    Speaking of what I said above, this almost proves what I am saying. RDJ never stood chance, Endgame has a pixar like screenplay , for life action films, it will be hard for any actor to win any awards. If Endgame had done the demon in the bottle storyline for RDJ which is a marvel comic story not a pixar kind of story, then I think he would have stood a chance for Oscar nominations, that is the criteria for oscars. Oscars love it when actors play very drunk, cynical and depressed people. Endgame took that type of story line away from RDJ.

    Pheionix 's Joker story line is driven by his heavy mental issues, RDJ role in endgame is quite light compared to that. He cannot get nominated for Oscars in a superhero film. sadly.
    Lol you didnt answer the question at all. Tchalla and Killmonger are the entire movie. Coogler wrote both of them to represent soemthing. That is the entire premise of the movie. Specifically what was that and why is it not done well? Thor and Loki have nothing in common with it since. They cant since its 100% about Black people and unique to African America experience. So stop dancing around and using buzz words. It's real simple. What was Coogler conveying with Killmonger vs Tchalla and why you felt it wasnt down well.

  14. #29
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    Here’s what I said a year ago, Black Panthers nom was a joke because they didn’t get a single writing, acting, or directing nom. There was no other film up for best picture that the Academy didn’t deem good enough for any of the other major awards. It was basically just there to be there

    Joker as a best acting nom, best directing nom, and best adapted screenplay nom.

  15. #30
    Extraordinary Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    Yah even though Avengers Endgame was very entertaining, the characters were more like caricatures, to me, assembled to serve the plot. Tony is the same guy at the beginning and the end of the movie, except for the whole life and death thing. Dramatic moments were present but they were not earned by acting and character development.
    That is exactly how I felt about the characters in The Irishman.
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