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  1. #31
    Fantastic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    That comment coming after what happened in Legion #3 today.
    That's exactly why I wrote that post. Because I always HOPE for dc to come up with another story...but they never do.

  2. #32
    Incredible Member Chubistian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    I'd be careful with that wish. Not all changes are good. Just ask Ric.
    I highly doubt that Ric will last though. It's more of an overused trope than a real change. But, at the end of the day, and with exceptions of course, I tend to prefer risky decisions that do fail than the vicious cycle of the status quo
    "The Batman is Gotham City. I will watch him. Study him. And when I know him and why he does not kill, I will know this city. And then Gotham will be MINE!"-BANE

    "We're monsters, buddy. Plain and simple. I don't dress it up with fancy names like mutant or post-human; men were born crueler than Apes and we were born crueler than men. It's just the natural order of things"-ULTIMATE SABRETOOTH

  3. #33
    Extraordinary Member Caivu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    - For at least one person (and I'd honestly love for it to be Barbara or Kate, if she somehow figured it out) to bluntly acknowledge that Alfred wasn't the saint that everyone made him out to be.
    Uh... did I miss something? What did he do?
    Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
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  4. #34
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    For Red Hood to finally get a story I can enjoy. It's sad how indifferent I have become towards him lately.
    We're getting unkillables and the 3 jokers. It's looking nicely, if you're not enjoying RHATO currently :3.
    This is a signature. It has letters on it, and those letters form words. Words like these. I will not quote anything because I'm uninspired but, I read a lot: I could!

    And this is my Tumblr. Sometimes I post stuff there.

  5. #35
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chubistian View Post
    I highly doubt that Ric will last though. It's more of an overused trope than a real change. But, at the end of the day, and with exceptions of course, I tend to prefer risky decisions that do fail than the vicious cycle of the status quo
    Exactly. Ric was bullcrap from the start. Just an overused trope to create an illusion of change so they could recycle ideas and just have him do more of the same with boring formulaic creators. Grayson. Now that was a change.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 01-15-2020 at 12:06 PM.

  6. #36
    Also goes by Westbats Westbats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stars & Stripes View Post
    Remembering that Harper exists, even if she's just a non-costumed ally of the Batman Family.
    Something I'd love to happen this year is reset my counter on my phone; I've kept track of how long it's been since Harper last appeared in any book. As of January 15, 2020, it's been 854 days since Harper Row last appeared in any panel (last being Detective Comics 964 ).

    I think every character should get an opportunity for one more story. The fact that Harper never showed up in Last Knight on Earth was kinda disappointing, I still have hopes that James Tynion IV will have her cameo in a panel considering that Tynion's first arc on Batman shares a similar topic to Snyder's, and that he is Harper Row's co-creator.
    I'm currently reading Batman, Detective Comics, Nightwing, Batgirl, Batman: Curse of the White Knight, Justice League, Magnificent Ms. Marvel, Daredevil, Red Hood and The Outlaws, Batman and The Outsiders, Young Justice, and Dial H for Hero.

  7. #37
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caivu View Post
    Uh... did I miss something? What did he do?
    The stand out one is the Superheavy saga where he stops all the kids from reminding amnesia Bruce that he's their father, including the ten-year-old because he wants his son Bruce to be happy with Julie, his personal vision of an ideal healthy Bruce, and take care of other orphans.

    Then, he shared many Robin costumes to random kids, including Duke Thomas, and tutor them through phone anonymously, one of them ended up dying trying to disarm a bomb, and the Robin accidents keep happening to the point where the government ban them and so dragged the real Robins back so they can teach them for real... and as far as I know none of them ever know Alfred did this.

  8. #38
    Mighty Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    For at least one person (and I'd honestly love for it to be Barbara or Kate, if she somehow figured it out) to bluntly acknowledge that Alfred wasn't the saint that everyone made him out to be.
    Thought I was the only one who didn't like the canonization of Alfred (that's been going on for a while). I'm admittedly more interested in editorial and fans not treating him always right (in terms of morality, but also in terms of reading situations correctly, etc.). I'm much keener on it being Dick or Jason or one the ones that is actually Bruce's child (and closer to the situation) being the one to feel it/address it, rather than Barbara or Kate. Especially Kate, who's a late-comer and not seen as much history of this. Though maybe distance makes one see more clearly - it could work well that way, too.

    The stand out one is the Superheavy saga where he stops all the kids from reminding amnesia Bruce that he's their father, including the ten-year-old because he wants his son Bruce to be happy with Julie, his personal vision of an ideal healthy Bruce, and take care of other orphans.
    That one actually works really well for me. I think it highlights the unhealthy nature their relationship has taken on. I've said before that (more modern) Alfred values Bruce first, and values the others as Bruce-adjacent or as Bruce's family rather than directly as themselves. This is a great illustration of that. I hate the relationships he has with them are that way now, but I find it consistent with his characterization in more recent years (decades?) as Bruce has been made the focal point of his life.

    Then, he shared many Robin costumes to random kids, including Duke Thomas, and tutor them through phone anonymously, one of them ended up dying trying to disarm a bomb, and the Robin accidents keep happening to the point where the government ban them and so dragged the real Robins back so they can teach them for real... and as far as I know none of them ever know Alfred did this.
    Yeah, this one was weird to me. Never liked the We Are Robin concept (though I like several of the characters(, and it didn't make a huge amount of sense to me in terms of character motivation from Alfred, but I didn't read much of the surrounding material, so maybe it works better in context. Duke did find out about Alfred, right? So he never told anyone?
    Last edited by Tzigone; 01-15-2020 at 05:10 PM.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Westbats View Post
    Something I'd love to happen this year is reset my counter on my phone; I've kept track of how long it's been since Harper last appeared in any book. As of January 15, 2020, it's been 854 days since Harper Row last appeared in any panel (last being Detective Comics 964 ).

    I think every character should get an opportunity for one more story. The fact that Harper never showed up in Last Knight on Earth was kinda disappointing, I still have hopes that James Tynion IV will have her cameo in a panel considering that Tynion's first arc on Batman shares a similar topic to Snyder's, and that he is Harper Row's co-creator.
    I understand that she wasn't exactly everyone's favorite character, but the degree that she's been largely ignored since retiring from being Bluebird is just kinda silly. Maybe a recurring role on the Young Justice cartoon and (possibly? hopefully?) showing up on the CW Batwoman show may help raise her profile.

  10. #40
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    That one actually works really well for me. I think it highlights the unhealthy nature their relationship has taken on. I've said before that (more modern) Alfred values Bruce first, and values the others as Bruce-adjacent or as Bruce's family rather than directly as themselves. This is a great illustration of that. I hate the relationships he has with them are that way now, but I find it consistent with his characterization in more recent years (decades?) as Bruce has been made the focal point of his life.
    The problem is nobody's calling him out for it so I don't know if the writers even realize how he's portrayed

    Anyway... I'm not seeing it happening because everyone in the family loves Alfred.
    Last edited by Restingvoice; 01-15-2020 at 05:47 PM.

  11. #41
    Incredible Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    The stand out one is the Superheavy saga where he stops all the kids from reminding amnesia Bruce that he's their father, including the ten-year-old because he wants his son Bruce to be happy with Julie, his personal vision of an ideal healthy Bruce, and take care of other orphans.

    Then, he shared many Robin costumes to random kids, including Duke Thomas, and tutor them through phone anonymously, one of them ended up dying trying to disarm a bomb, and the Robin accidents keep happening to the point where the government ban them and so dragged the real Robins back so they can teach them for real... and as far as I know none of them ever know Alfred did this.
    Pretty much this. Combine that with the shade he threw at Jason's time as Robin and that whole "Selina's the only person I've seen make you happy" bullshit and you've got a selfish ass who's more concerned with enabling Bruce's unhealthy obsessions than he is with the people who are most likely to be hurt by them. He gets put on a pretty high pedestal for someone who's arguably a worse person than Bruce.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    Thought I was the only one who didn't like the canonization of Alfred (that's been going on for a while). I'm admittedly more interested in editorial and fans not treating him always right (in terms of morality, but also in terms of reading situations correctly, etc.). I'm much keener on it being Dick or Jason or one the ones that is actually Bruce's child (and closer to the situation) being the one to feel it/address it, rather than Barbara or Kate. Especially Kate, who's a late-comer and not seen as much history of this. Though maybe distance makes one see more clearly - it could work well that way, too.
    See, I feel like it's gotta be someone who's more on the outside like Babs or Kate. The ones who would not only see it but be the most likely to say something about it. Bruce and the Robins are all too close to him. The only one I could see maybe speaking up is Tim.

    Like...with him being dead, it feels like a really petty time for them to bring any of it up but I just want one person to acknowledge it.

  12. #42
    Mighty Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    The problem is nobody's calling him out for it so I don't know if the writers even realize how he's portrayed

    Anyway... I'm not seeing it happening because everyone in the family loves Alfred.
    I agree with your assessment of how many at DC and the characters (and many fans) don't see a problem. I'm just saying it works for me in the sense that it seems in-character. Though not in the sense that I like this characterization. But I'm stuck in the past (decades ago, sometimes) for many characters in terms of what's acceptable/preferable to me. Being so stuck in the past makes it hard for me to say where I what I want to go forward from in terms of going forward from now. Alfred's dead, but I really don't think it'll stick, and can't even muster myself to care that much (partially for not believing it will stick but partially because I'm haven't been reading and I tend to forget it happened - was much the same with Roy). So, going forward, I guess I hope for greater emotional health for the Batclan. The thing is, I don't think it's good, from a meta/narrative sense to correlate it with Alfred's death. I mean, it kinda works, in the sense that Bruce got so much more emotionally damaged at the same time history was rewritten to make Alfred ever-more a parent. Another such correlation would be make it very easy to attribute causation and blame Alfred for Bruce's emotional unhealth. I would almost have to go that way (all the while, thinking the early correlation, at least, was completely unintentional) and if I thought the second was unintentional, would have to laugh at the end result. I would think it alienate Alfred fans, though. Then again, maybe most simply wouldn't think of it that way.

    But the previously mentioned not making the rest of the Clan appendages to Batman or Batman-like would be great, that's for sure. I want Dick Grayson to get back his awesome, as he's my favorite. But it's going to take a lot longer than a year to get back to the state of him being respected by his peers and taken seriously by the broader fandom. They airheaded-manchild-cuddlebug-bimbo rep has been hard on him. Even the Ric-hate (and I do hate it), hasn't overshadowed it.

    What I do want is to see more Bruce. Not Batman-without-a-mask as Bruce tries to use Bruce Wayne to do Batman's job of cleaning up Gotham and goes all alpha male, intimidating people. Not Brucie, who eats hamburgers with fork and goes to parties all the time. But Bruce, who has friends and does social things that he likes and isn't wholly consumed by mask or mission.

  13. #43
    Also goes by Westbats Westbats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stars & Stripes View Post
    I understand that she wasn't exactly everyone's favorite character, but the degree that she's been largely ignored since retiring from being Bluebird is just kinda silly. Maybe a recurring role on the Young Justice cartoon and (possibly? hopefully?) showing up on the CW Batwoman show may help raise her profile.
    I find it a bit funny that everyone assumed that by removing Harper, DC would add Cassandra and Stephanie back into the mix. While Cassandra has played a significant role in Batman and The Outsiders, I still would have preferred her being in the Batgirl series like with what Tynion set up in his Detective Comics finale. And Stephanie has been drastically underused, only in Young Justice, which I have a serious concern with. If Stephanie Brown is a hero on Earth 3, what exactly is Bendis trying to say about Stephanie on Earth Prime?

    But back to the main point: I would love to have Tynion and Snyder write a course-correcting series to follow up Batman and Robin Eternal, tell us what was so important in Miranda Row's history that Harper and Cullen's father shut down any conversation about it. I want to see Harper's readjustment to a civilian life, see her kick Lonnie Machin's butt after The Victim Syndicate and King Clayface incidents, I want to see her have to go back into action.

    I want to see Bluebird 2.0
    I'm currently reading Batman, Detective Comics, Nightwing, Batgirl, Batman: Curse of the White Knight, Justice League, Magnificent Ms. Marvel, Daredevil, Red Hood and The Outlaws, Batman and The Outsiders, Young Justice, and Dial H for Hero.

  14. #44
    Extraordinary Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    More of what I hope;
    Someone in editorial tells Bendis, "No. Stop. Don't do that!" (see latest Legion of Super Heroes for why)
    Steph and Cass become the Bat Sisters (both as Batgirl)

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaresh View Post
    We're getting unkillables and the 3 jokers. It's looking nicely, if you're not enjoying RHATO currently :3.
    I really hope those are going to be good.

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