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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Default Alleged Colin Tremorrow version episode 9 details emerging

    Granted, still with a grain of salt like the rumors about a month ago, but apparentally this would've involved:

    -The film starting with Kylo Ren attempting a galaxywide communications blackout to keep the Resistance in check
    -Luke continuing to train Rey as a ghost but also causing problems for Ren (Keeping to his TLJ speech "See you around, kid" "Strike me down and I'll always be with you" etc).
    -The movie opening with them capturing a Star Destroyer, with Rose heavily involved
    -Visits to Coruscant and Mortis
    -Darth Plageuis shows up instead of Palpatine, but is known by Tor Valum, not Hugo Damask as the EU made him.
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  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Based on plot alone, that does not sound significantly better than the movie we got.

    -- Luke's force ghost training Rey goes down better than TROS in some ways. As does him sabotaging and haunting Kylo. But a force ghost having that much agency does not feel right since it raises the issue (which TLJ already did) that if they can do that much why do they need living apprentices? Leia training Rey would have been a better way, and would have worked had Carrie Fisher survived, then Abrams would not have had to scrounge around as he did.
    -- Having Rose be a part of stuff is a good idea.
    -- Reviving Darth Plagueis and giving him a name other than Darth Plagueis is a bad idea. In a choice of two weak ideas, reviving Palpatine is better even with all the can of worms it opens. The other option, trying to make Kylo Ren work as a character without an older mentor to guide and rebel against (which is his repetitive arc across all three movies) does not seem to have been on the table.
    -- Would have loved to have visited Coruscant but on the other hand, I am happy they didn't, since the prequel-hatred that infests the ST would have sucked and denied any nostalgia that would have had.

    Overall the problem is that TLJ ended the trilogy a movie early with the major character arcs concluded to an extent that going forward (as Trevorrow seemed to have tried to have done) didn't provide enough stuff for a compelling movie, leaving the lesser evil of JJ Abrams having to undo and walkback TLJ.

    Ultimately the ST was cursed with poor preparation from the start, and with the bad luck of the death of Carrie Fisher, which denied any chance for there to be actual closure. The only way to have fixed it would have been to have Carrie's movie be TLJ and Luke's movie be the finale with his death being the actual finish of the ST.

  3. #3
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Based on plot alone, that does not sound significantly better than the movie we got.

    -- Luke's force ghost training Rey goes down better than TROS in some ways. As does him sabotaging and haunting Kylo. But a force ghost having that much agency does not feel right since it raises the issue (which TLJ already did) that if they can do that much why do they need living apprentices? Leia training Rey would have been a better way, and would have worked had Carrie Fisher survived, then Abrams would not have had to scrounge around as he did.
    -- Having Rose be a part of stuff is a good idea.
    -- Reviving Darth Plagueis and giving him a name other than Darth Plagueis is a bad idea. In a choice of two weak ideas, reviving Palpatine is better even with all the can of worms it opens. The other option, trying to make Kylo Ren work as a character without an older mentor to guide and rebel against (which is his repetitive arc across all three movies) does not seem to have been on the table.
    -- Would have loved to have visited Coruscant but on the other hand, I am happy they didn't, since the prequel-hatred that infests the ST would have sucked and denied any nostalgia that would have had.

    Overall the problem is that TLJ ended the trilogy a movie early with the major character arcs concluded to an extent that going forward (as Trevorrow seemed to have tried to have done) didn't provide enough stuff for a compelling movie, leaving the lesser evil of JJ Abrams having to undo and walkback TLJ.

    Ultimately the ST was cursed with poor preparation from the start, and with the bad luck of the death of Carrie Fisher, which denied any chance for there to be actual closure. The only way to have fixed it would have been to have Carrie's movie be TLJ and Luke's movie be the finale with his death being the actual finish of the ST.
    I think it was not an accident that the Original Trilogy heroes left in the reverse order that they arrived. In the original STAR WARS, Leia appeared first, then Luke, and then Han. They departed in the exact opposite order.

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  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    I think it was not an accident that the Original Trilogy heroes left in the reverse order that they arrived. In the original STAR WARS, Leia appeared first, then Luke, and then Han. They departed in the exact opposite order.
    Heh...let's not give these guys any credit.

    George Lucas would do internal rhymes-within-rhymes because he was raised on Soviet montage, but the ST guys...none of them have the brains to do that.

    Like Luke Skywalker dying in TLJ wasn't planned or expected by anyone other than Rian Johnson and Hamill himself felt that Luke should survive and die only in the last one.

  5. #5
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    The stuff with Luke sounds better. Its always going to be rather jarring that there was absolutely no resolution to Luke and Kylo's conflict. Its just forever out there in the ether, once again probably left to a comic book or something to tell. Plaugeis a surprise villain instead of Palpatine doesn't necessarily sound automatically better, but in theory would be way less of a problem than Palpatine's return ended up being due to the method of return being completely ignored and it ruining Anakin's story arc.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 01-14-2020 at 04:51 PM.
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  6. #6

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    Someone posted in another thread that Rey and Poe were gonna has a romantic arc. Can someone else confirm this?

  7. #7
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Heh...let's not give these guys any credit.

    George Lucas would do internal rhymes-within-rhymes because he was raised on Soviet montage, but the ST guys...none of them have the brains to do that.

    Like Luke Skywalker dying in TLJ wasn't planned or expected by anyone other than Rian Johnson and Hamill himself felt that Luke should survive and die only in the last one.
    I do think the symmetry was planned. When Leia dies, the only one in her presence is R2-D2. When we first glimpsed Leia in 1977, she was also alone with R2-D2.

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  8. #8
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    I do think the symmetry was planned. When Leia dies, the only one in her presence is R2-D2. When we first glimpsed Leia in 1977, she was also alone with R2-D2.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    Leah's death is because of Carrie Fisher's death, which was never planned, and Artoo being there is because he's the only OT cast they have on standby.

    If anything the call-back there is to Darth Vader's body in the pyre, laid horizontally from left-to-right, with the cover her body being quite like Vader's.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Granted, still with a grain of salt like the rumors about a month ago, but apparentally this would've involved:

    -The film starting with Kylo Ren attempting a galaxywide communications blackout to keep the Resistance in check
    -Luke continuing to train Rey as a ghost but also causing problems for Ren (Keeping to his TLJ speech "See you around, kid" "Strike me down and I'll always be with you" etc).
    -The movie opening with them capturing a Star Destroyer, with Rose heavily involved
    -Visits to Coruscant and Mortis
    -Darth Plageuis shows up instead of Palpatine, but is known by Tor Valum, not Hugo Damask as the EU made him.
    Some of the ideas are interesting. Particularly Ghost Luke realizing the non interference thing is dumb and he should get involved. One thing I don't like is the idea of Mortis. Honestly I feel the Mortis arc is one of the most overrated and pretentious arcs in the clone wars.

  10. #10
    Mighty Member Kintor's Avatar
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    It's remarkable that this alternate script leaked so soon, while TROS is still in theatres no less. But then Disney could never control the leaks surrounding this filn to begin with. I mean, when even Burger King is spoiling your movie ahead of release you know you've screwed up.

    As the script itself? I'm intrigued by Darth Plageuis playing a central role, he is one of my favourite EU characters. However, seeing as how Disney managed to character assassinate everybody in favour of Rey alone it's probably best this script was never used. Better to have the Plageuis I know undiminished then see him treated like a joke on screen in the doomed third part of this failed trilogy.

  11. #11
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Saw reports on this earlier. I kinda think I like this concept a bit better then what we got in the actual movie, but it's all water under the bridge and missing some the stuff I really liked in the actual film.
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  12. #12
    Spectacular Member PoorStudent's Avatar
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    Just let it die. Let it die like Game of Thrones died. It's over. Everyone should move on to something else and stop with this endless articles, clickbait, comment threads and debates.

    We need to put all of our attention towards something else. Something like CATS.

  13. #13
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    It's Star Wars.
    Like the Emperor it'll never die.

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Plus Mandalorian is pretty big at the moment, although it's on break.
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  15. #15
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    In any case, we don't know for sure if this was the final script and so on. Everyone confirms that it's real.
    https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-rise-o...w-script-real/

    So I buy that this was the script that Trevorrow wanted to work with but I don't think it's the intended final draft, and I think he got removed before he did additional work with it, with producers feeling that there wasn't a lot of interest in this take to put more work into it.

    The title "Duel of the Fates" feels like a temp. title. Naming the final entry of the Skywalker Saga after a piece of John Williams' music feels cheesy. What next, Renaming TESB as "The Imperial March", "Han Solo and the Princess", ANH as "Binary Sunset".

    You can see the skeleton of TROS in this draft, and you can see what Abrams brought into it. The main common elements:
    -- Kylo Ren relapsing to TFA because rather than going "Supreme Leader Kylo", he's once again under the thumb of some Sith ghost. Only now, it's Darth Plagueis rather than Palpatine himself.
    -- The plot still involved finding Sith temples and stuff...Maybe not to the same extent as TROS but certainly enough.

    Abrams built on that (which is why Trevorrow has a credit in the film).


    The real problems with the denouement of the ST is again TLJ. Rian Johnson ended the film with Kylo Ren as the Big Bad and Supreme Leader, as someone who's trying to chart out a new vision...but doing so changes the character from how he was introduced in TFA as an angsty adolescent dude torn between mentors. So nobody knew what to do to change and develop his character. Both Trevorrow and Abrams were having him relapse.

    The final movie also didn't have much for Finn to do, as is clear even in Trevorrow's version. So the flaws are apparent there too.

    I think ideally Rian Johnson should have been told to finish the trilogy, because no other film-maker had a vision on where to take these characters forward.

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