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  1. #31
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    Very true. And Amazons in particular at that. Pre-Crisis, he and Donna were amicable (and while as Robin, I would almost say friends), perhaps developed a slight crush on Diana in "For the Man Who Has Everything", and now Artemis. I think the only main Amazons left are Hippolyta and Cassandra Sandsmark for him to meet. Plus Jason has also teamed up with, if only for a short time, Supergirl as well.

    The only non-powered girls I know of are Isabella and maybe Rose? Does Rose have the enhancements? Still though.
    Yeah, Kara belongs in the Amazon-type bag, definitely. I would say even non-powered girls are of the "strong woman" type, either by personality or by skills. I mean: Isabel is pretty baddass, for a normal woman. Someone who doesn't fell into panic with all the stuff she had to deal with? That's something.
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  2. #32
    Extraordinary Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaresh View Post
    Yeah, Kara belongs in the Amazon-type bag, definitely. I would say even non-powered girls are of the "strong woman" type, either by personality or by skills. I mean: Isabel is pretty baddass, for a normal woman. Someone who doesn't fell into panic with all the stuff she had to deal with? That's something.
    Fair enough.

  3. #33
    Astonishing Member Korath's Avatar
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    Perhaps Jason subconsciously need some female figure who could protect him ? Poor kid had it rough with healthy female figures in his childhood after all.

  4. #34
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    (A little late, sorry, but here are my observations on the issue.)

    As already mentioned, I love the slow pace. It's also a very "quite" issue that focuses on the main characters and their supporting cast. It has a lot of beautiful and emotional moments but also still manages to “sneakily” provide information about what’s going to come. I’d definitely like to see more of such slice-of-life moments and heartfelt character interactions in the future.

    Some things I noticed:

    DC has put the wrong artists on the cover. A human mistake, but still sucks for the real artists.

    Prianto did a great coloring job. (The sunset scenes gave me an immediate flashback to RHatO #7. )

    When we were introduced to the Generation Outlaw kids, DNA and Babe were a little hostile towards each other. So it’s nice to see that they have become friends, well … “friends”, let’s not be too hasty. We should not forget that Babe is a scientist. Maybe she isn’t just interested in Bizarro but also in DNA and Doomed too.

    Funny artistic slip-up: There’s something fishy going on with Ma Gunn’s dress. In one panel it looks like she’s wearing a broad waist belt – and on the next page it’s a thin belt (or dress ornament). And her fingernails look scary.

    What does Jason mean by “Nobody died.”? Ma Gunn kept Willis’ letters from Jason – and Willis officially died in prison. So officially someone did die. Jason doesn’t know that Ma Gunn has seen “Willis” in RHatO #25 (Was that Solitary or the real Willis?). Or maybe Jason thinks that Ma Gunn doesn’t know that Willis “died” in prison.

    Pup Pup is still so damn cute. Ma Gunn and Pup Pup are an interesting combination. I wonder if Pup Pup stays close to her because he feels partly guilty for her imprisonment.

    I’d like to see some concept art of Jason’s bike. When he drives away from Ma Gunn’s school, the bike reminds me of a red bird (with a little arrow on the bottom).

    I’m not sure why Suzie Su suddenly is a blonde. Maybe it’s a coloring error, maybe it’s on purpose. But Pantalena’s style is definitely not doing Suzie any favors. I miss Woods’ Suzie Su. He knew how to draw a big girl like Suzie and still make her look fashionable and normal.

    In hindsight, it probably wasn’t a good idea to leave Essence’ sword behind. The safe is open, probably opened by Suzie. I’m surprised that she isn’t surprised that there’s a sword in the safe – and that there’s a person in the sword. But maybe Suzie can’t see Essence (Roy couldn't see Essence either in New52). I’m still wondering why Jason left Essence behind. Maybe he wanted her to “cool down” a little bit. (Something similar helped Crux.)

    “You are one mysterious Lady, A.” – “And you are an oft-clueless man.” – I missed Jason and Artemis’ little banters.

    I’m surprisingly okay with Artemis’ enchanted hair. There are definitely weirder things in the DC universe.

    Seeing Bizarro calmly meditating on the lake shore low-key shows how far Bizarro has come on his own journey since he once said "Bizarro am not perfect. But Red Him show me how and me promise to be the best Bizarro me can be." (RHatO #7). And this here is a damn good Bizarro. I love how he openly welcomes Doomed and tells him that no one of them is a monster. DNA joining is such a nice addition. Hopefully Bizarro will be good influence on DNA and Doomed because Bizarro knows their struggle to fit into society firsthand.

    Nevertheless, I still would have preferred Bizarro with pupils instead of all white eyes. He’s not avatar, the last airbender.

    I didn’t think we’d ever see Jason commenting on Wally West’s actions in HiC but the scene was nice. Jason is forgiving four people in this issue: Ma Gunn, Wally West, Artemis (for lying at the end) and Damian Wayne. Jason says that he has four brothers (Also nice to see Duke acknowledged). So Jason still considers Damian a brother.

    Normally I don’t like 9 panel grids (there has been an overdose in other titles, especially in HiC) but I feel like the nine panel grid has redeemed itself in this issue. The scene with Jason and Artemis is beautiful. Pantalena did a great job showing all those emotions. But I still don’t like his Artemis (I generally don’t like how he draws female characters.)

    I’m glad that Mistress was mentioned. I’m already looking forward to the Dark Trinity setting out to find her. And as already mentioned by someone else in the Jason Todd appreciation thread, it really is interesting that both Jason and Artemis have weapons that are tied to their souls. (In the meanwhile it’s not even sure if characters like Bizarro, DNA, Mombie or Vessel have a soul.)

    I had a little déjà-vu when I saw the couple on the Times Square page. At first I thought that are two characters from Red Hood/Arsenal #2 (also drawn by Pantalena). But then I looked the issue up: not the same people, just another guy with a similar beard and another blonde woman in a red dress. It also wouldn’t have made sense to see those two characters form R/A #2 dating in RH:O #42.

    I wonder if the old homeless man is someone important.

    “They probably built a time machine out of a toaster and the washing machine.” – Is that a reference I’m not getting?

  5. #35
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    With "nobody died" I think he means that Penguin didn't die in the end. Willis supposedly dying wouldn't have anything to do with Jason reading those letters or not. His fate wouldn't be afected: but Oswald's would, if Jason had killed him. Jason attacking him was a direct consequence.

    I don't think the stuff with the art and Ma is to paye much attention. The artist's style is just like that, and seems to be a little bit inconsistence between panels in the same page.

    I think that Jason was talking about Roy, not Duke. Duke's relationship with the bats is more like an associate, mostly professional, as far as I've seen.
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  6. #36
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaresh View Post
    With "nobody died" I think he means that Penguin didn't die in the end. Willis supposedly dying wouldn't have anything to do with Jason reading those letters or not. His fate wouldn't be afected: but Oswald's would, if Jason had killed him. Jason attacking him was a direct consequence.

    I don't think the stuff with the art and Ma is to paye much attention. The artist's style is just like that, and seems to be a little bit inconsistence between panels in the same page.

    I think that Jason was talking about Roy, not Duke. Duke's relationship with the bats is more like an associate, mostly professional, as far as I've seen.
    Penguin makes sense. (Although I'm not sure if Ma Gunn knows about the confrontation with Penguin.)
    I was thinking about something else. Theoretically, if Jason had read those letters as kid, he could have asked Batman for help later and they could at least have saved Willis from Hierve El Agua.
    And as far as I recall, Jason doesn't know if Willis is alive or dead.

    I don't mind little artistic inconsistencies like that. In most cases I think they are funny (for example Jason's shirt color is changing in RHatO #21 from blue to white and the woman in the casino - Emory - wears at first a red skirt with a red cropped/bra-like top. Later it's suddenly a dress).

    Has Jason ever called Roy a brother before? As far as I can remember Roy was always depicted as Jason's best friend.
    Last edited by Sergard; 01-29-2020 at 01:46 PM.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    Penguin makes sense. (Although I'm not sure if Ma Gunn knows about the confrontation with Penguin.)
    I was thinking about something else. Theoretically, if Jason had read those letters as kid, he could have asked Batman for help later and they could at least have saved Willis from Hierve El Agua.
    And as far as I recall, Jason doesn't know if Willis is alive or dead.

    I don't mind little artistic inconsistencies like that. In most cases I think they are funny (for example Jason's shirt color is changing in RHatO #21 from blue to white and the woman in the casino - Emory - wears at first a red skirt with a red cropped/bra-like top. Later it's suddenly a dress).

    Has Jason ever called Roy a brother before? As far as I can remember Roy was always depicted as Jason's best friend.
    No idea if he had, but I think he fits the place better than Duke, to be honest.

    About the letters, it could be what you say, but I don't know. I don't know if Ma knowing about Penguin changes anything: Jason is the one who said it, and he definitely knew .
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  8. #38
    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaresh View Post
    No idea if he had, but I think he fits the place better than Duke, to be honest.
    I'd say he was likely mean to be talking about Duke, i don't think he's ever refered to Roy as his brother, and there has been evidence that Duke does bond with the other Batwards (movies with Damian, one on one training with Jason, they even have him in a family photo with the other Robins, etc.) between panels. plus he just acknowledged Roy's death, I don't think he'd say he "has [read:have]" four brothers, as in present tense, if he was referring to Roy postmortem. that being said, while I do think Jason and the other Batboys consider Duke family, I don't think the bat-office has demonstrated that bond enough to genuinely earn calling them "brothers"; I'd say more like relatively close cousins.
    Last edited by lemonpeace; 01-30-2020 at 06:13 AM.
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  9. #39
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    I'd say he was likely mean to be talking about Duke, i don't think he's ever refered to Roy as his brother, and there has been evidence that Duke does bond with the other Batwards (movies with Damian, one on one training with Jason, they even have him in a family photo with the other Robins, etc.) between panels. plus he just acknowledged Roy's death, I don't think he'd say he "has [read:have]" four brothers, as in present tense, if he was referring to Roy postmortem. that being said, while I do think Jason and the other Batboys consider Duke family, I don't think the bat-office has demonstrated that bond enough to genuinely earn calling them "brothers"; I'd say more like relatively close cousins.
    Good point.
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  10. #40
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    I wonder if the "Nobody died." comment also extends to RH:O #26.
    It was never officially stated if or if not Jason killed any of the bikers.

  11. #41
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    I wonder if the "Nobody died." comment also extends to RH:O #26.
    It was never officially stated if or if not Jason killed any of the bikers.
    Oh, we don't know if the bikers were even human, after what we saw in that town.
    If that FBI agent were to appear again, maybe we could know.
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  12. #42
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaresh View Post
    Oh, we don't know if the bikers were even human, after what we saw in that town.
    If that FBI agent were to appear again, maybe we could know.
    Melissa could probably shed some light on the topic.
    Since it was shown that she's investigating the case by following Jason's leads, I hope we'll see her again soon.

    The "Can you believe it? Wally West on trial for murder." part also feels a little bit like Jason wasn't just a Wonder Girl fan as kid but also maybe a Kid Flash fan.

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