5G Sales

[voidox]

If nothing else 5G will atleast change something. I will be more than happy if they publish stories of different generation. Why should i be stuck with reading about a version of superman or batman or barry allen as flash who bores me?if i get different versions i will be ecstatic.

i mean, change for the sake of change is not always right... nor is it a guarantee the change is going to be good.

Poor sales has less to do with people being tired of the characters they're reading, and more to do with having to read terrible stories and/or writers making stupid creative decisions with the characters people love, e.g. DiDio, Bendis, Tom King, Ric, Bard, MM x Hawkgirl and so on. Other issues include writers not respecting continuity/history, many concurrent events involving the exact same characters, no real plan by the DC editorial in ensuring their lineup all makes sense and is in continuity annnd so on.

If we end up in 5G with a brand new lineup of heroes but with the same issues, then nothing will have really changed right. In fact, it'd be an even worse state for DC cause it wouldn't be poor stories with characters people love, it'd be with brand new characters people will have no connection to.

[Sacred Knight]

I expect it to bomb pretty spectacularly after the relaunch boom. But at the same time I can't see the future, and that expectation while partly based on experience to DC's ways, is also colored by my own staunch distaste and auto-rejection. So my personal expectation is probably nothing I'd be willing to bet the farm on at the same time.

[skyvolt2000]

wew lad, nice generalisation of all the critics of stuff DC/Marvel does eh. Here's some advice: don't assume stuff to suit your narrative.

Go ask Jaime Reyes, Jason Rusch, Duke Thomas, John Stewart, Jessica Cruz, Simon Baz, Riri Williams, Kyle and even Wallace West fans how much CRAP they.
Go ask the New Age Heroes fans-who saw those books get attacked for existing.
Go ask Black Panther, Deadpool, Guardians of the Galaxy and even Harley fans who saw attacks on spinoff books that both companies tried.
Go ask Marvel & DC employees who head all this CRYING about "why can't we get original created characters" and when BOTH try-it's the greatest goal post moving event to NOT even try those books.

In every single case that vocal portion was from FANS & even store owners.

In MANY of the fans case-they NEVER read the book-they saw a woman or POC or someone they felt had no business Existing on the cover and that was it. Because that is group we keep hearing from the most. Meanwhile most of these books find FANS outside of the comic book store-for a reason.

Yet when DC & Marvel FLOOD the market place with Batman & X-Men books-guess who cries about it? That SAME group.

Korath was not generalizing. He bought up a legit concern.

It's not like both are NOT trying. Everyone can accept a book failing if it was at least TRIED by folks. Instead we see books unwelcomed the moment they are announced.
Then what is insulting-that book gets bashed and boycotted-yet sales better outside of comic book stores.

Right now nothing has been set in stone and we got folks plotting boycotts and FORGETTING comic book history.

If one did not have an issue with all the OTHER (mainly white guys) who have replaced icons-why is it an issue now on the RUMORED POC?

If someone claims to have support and bought Batman since 1970 and now claims he's DONE if Luke Fox is in that suit. Has ignored the Jim Gordon, Dick Grayson & John Paul in that suit.
Same with Artemis was WW, Wally, Bart & Jay as Flash. 4 different Supermen, 5 Supergirls, 15 Green Lanterns & 5 Robins.

Why is NOW the time to be vocal about not supporting a book because the lead is a POC or a POC is in it (yes even Batman saw calls of Boycotts over Duke)?

That is what is getting folks mad.

[Mr.B]

As long as no DC you style stuff.

[voidox]

Go ask Jaime Reyes, Jason Rusch, Duke Thomas, John Stewart, Jessica Cruz, Simon Baz, Riri Williams, Kyle and even Wallace West fans how much CRAP they.
Go ask the New Age Heroes fans-who saw those books get attacked for existing.
Go ask Black Panther, Deadpool, Guardians of the Galaxy and even Harley fans who saw attacks on spinoff books that both companies tried.
Go ask Marvel & DC employees who head all this CRYING about "why can't we get original created characters" and when BOTH try-it's the greatest goal post moving event to NOT even try those books.

In every single case that vocal portion was from FANS & even store owners.

In MANY of the fans case-they NEVER read the book-they saw a woman or POC or someone they felt had no business Existing on the cover and that was it. Because that is group we keep hearing from the most. Meanwhile most of these books find FANS outside of the comic book store-for a reason.

Yet when DC & Marvel FLOOD the market place with Batman & X-Men books-guess who cries about it? That SAME group.

Korath was not generalizing. He bought up a legit concern.

It's not like both are NOT trying. Everyone can accept a book failing if it was at least TRIED by folks. Instead we see books unwelcomed the moment they are announced.
Then what is insulting-that book gets bashed and boycotted-yet sales better outside of comic book stores.

Right now nothing has been set in stone and we got folks plotting boycotts and FORGETTING comic book history.

If one did not have an issue with all the OTHER (mainly white guys) who have replaced icons-why is it an issue now on the RUMORED POC?

If someone claims to have support and bought Batman since 1970 and now claims he's DONE if Luke Fox is in that suit. Has ignored the Jim Gordon, Dick Grayson & John Paul in that suit.
Same with Artemis was WW, Wally, Bart & Jay as Flash. 4 different Supermen, 5 Supergirls, 15 Green Lanterns & 5 Robins.

Why is NOW the time to be vocal about not supporting a book because the lead is a POC or a POC is in it (yes even Batman saw calls of Boycotts over Duke)?

That is what is getting folks mad.

um... what?

where the hell did this all come from? literally no one has brought up any of this stuff about Poc, women, white guys or w.e in this thread... so why the hell are you quoting me?

I never said any of this, I laid out my reasons for not liking 5G quite clearly. Maybe read what I wrote before posting. I mean, even Korath didn't bring up any of this stuff as to his reason why he didn't care for people not liking 5G.

Also stop assuming shit, cause holy hell are you assuming stuff right now if you think the only reason people dislike/are uninterested in 5G replacements is cause of Poc/women or w.e -_- And are you really trying to suggest that the majority of people who don't read certain books... do so because they saw a women/Poc on the cover? wat? do you actually have proof or anything on that? cause we have maaaany books with women/PoC on the cover that have sold well, the data on that is there on comichron to see

yet sales better outside of comic book stores.

I honestly have no idea what you mean by "outside comic book stores".
______________________________________________

as to your other point about people not liking books from announcement, what exactly are you trying to say? People are free to like or dislike w.e they want based on the information and news we get for something new. Just like watching a movie trailer leaves you free to wanting to watch or not watch a movie. Or seeing a gameplay trailer leaves you free to decide if you want to buy the game.

we pay for these comics with our money so we're free to buy what we want to read. I mean, why should people be expected to buy a book if they don't like the concept and information about it?

now sure, you can (and you have) say we're being a bit premature in our dislike since there is still stuff up in the air about 5G, and that's fair. I actually don't agree with the whole "boycott 5G" thing even if I am not interested in it.... but you can't just dismiss any and all opinions this way.

though as people have pointed out, the 5G initial release will most likely see a healthy sales bump cause readers will be trying out the new books. This usually happens with these types of large change-ups/events/so on, but then the sales drop will come once that initial hype is over, for the reasons people (including me) have stated.

[manwhohaseverything]

i mean, change for the sake of change is not always right... nor is it a guarantee the change is going to be good.

Poor sales has less to do with people being tired of the characters they're reading, and more to do with having to read terrible stories and/or writers making stupid creative decisions with the characters people love, e.g. DiDio, Bendis, Tom King, Ric, Bard, MM x Hawkgirl and so on. Other issues include writers not respecting continuity/history, many concurrent events involving the exact same characters, no real plan by the DC editorial in ensuring their lineup all makes sense and is in continuity annnd so on.

If we end up in 5G with a brand new lineup of heroes but with the same issues, then nothing will have really changed right. In fact, it'd be an even worse state for DC cause it wouldn't be poor stories with characters people love, it'd be with brand new characters people will have no connection to.

Yeah! i am not at all happy now. I don't or can't enjoy superman or flash or jon or titans. The only book good is redhood. So, i don't care. I am gonna give it a shot. If they publish books about goldenage superman or wally west flash i would take it.

[Korath]

lol, fans are barely supporting the current stories with the characters they love (in case you haven't been looking at the state of the comic industry/sales), what makes you think they will continuously support these new random heroes (after the initial 5G release and sales bump)? like I said, if it was the legacy characters taking over things might look better, but it's not them.

also many people would have been cool with this whole 5G thing if it wasn't a complete replacement of DC's entire main lineup and seemingly what DC comics will become. If it was announced as a timed event or even it's own imprint, would be received better.

and sure, if the OG heroes are indeed going to get some stories in the Black Label, then at least there will still be something left of DC to buy.



I never said that

Also no one cares if you don't like what people think. We're all free to have our opinion on 5G and we're all free to voice our opinions on it as long as we aren't breaking rules or w.e (just as you're free to comment about liking it). So if you don't like what people are saying, don't whine about it.



wew lad, nice generalisation of all the critics of stuff DC/Marvel does eh. Here's some advice: don't assume stuff to suit your narrative.

A this point, some of DC characters are basically running on fume, because there isn't much left to write about them and with them (like Bruce Wayne in my eyes).

Changing the old guards may be what's needed to save the DC U, because it's incredibly stale with the same faces since forever.

[kilderkin]

So, fans of the old timers, who will get their heroes still published with new stories, would still not support new things ? Is that what you mean ? Because if so, I feel even less inclined to care about the opinion of those who screams that you must have read decade-old stories to understand why such and such are important characters, this and that defining events and the like.

The quality of the stories of 5G may be poor, we don't know yet. But the obvious bias among a vocal portion of the fanbase, who shot down everything which isn't just more of the same stories and relationships and generally speaking only want one version of the characters to exist and be published is not helping mainstream comics as a medium.

Well I love the older characters, and that includes a lot of characters forwards of teen titans, young justice and so forth

I don't feel any need to support something just because it's new, I will if it's good

More so if I can still read my favourite character in new stories great, but knowing it's set in the past will affect that

More than anything my current irritation is the realisation that current books are effectively set in the past

I'm not jumping on or off because stuffs new

I will if it's not good

However, it will very much depend on how the new gen of books renders characters I love, if I don't like it I'll not buy into it

As for support, well DC aren't a charity and I'm not a patron, they can publish what they want, but if I don't like it, I'll save my cash

I don't owe any company anything

[manwhohaseverything]

Well I love the older characters, and that includes a lot of characters forwards of teen titans, young justice and so forth

I don't feel any need to support something just because it's new, I will if it's good

More so if I can still read my favourite character in new stories great, but knowing it's set in the past will affect that

More than anything my current irritation is the realisation that current books are effectively set in the past

I'm not jumping on or off because stuffs new

I will if it's not good

However, it will very much depend on how the new gen of books renders characters I love, if I don't like it I'll not buy into it

As for support, well DC aren't a charity and I'm not a patron, they can publish what they want, but if I don't like it, I'll save my cash

I don't owe any company anything

Nobody is asking for you to give something that isn't for you or upto par in your eye, a try. But, shouting down something new because "not my batman" or "not my superman" before it even happens, stifles creativity. The thread is such a phenomenon.

[kilderkin]

Nobody is asking for you to give something that isn't for you or upto par in your eye, a try. But, shouting down something new because "not my batman" or "not my superman" before it even happens, stifles creativity. The thread is such a phenomenon.

I agree entirely with you on that, I certainly didn't mean to sound that way if I did (if that was a point on me)

But really, how much harm do you think this thread can do

A prediction of sales, big deal!

[manwhohaseverything]

I agree entirely with you on that, I certainly didn't mean to sound that way if I did (if that was a point on me)

But really, how much harm do you think this thread can do

A prediction of sales, big deal!

It doesn't, do damage i mean. A lot people shouting down may be heard. But,Everyone seems to have made up their mind one way or another. That's their perogative. but its just, generally negative. especially, when we don't even have any promotions to go of on. I would understand being skeptical or after seeing promotions, deciding/opinionating. But, that isn't what's happening.

The manga industry works better in that regard. Sure, there are troupes and copies of story beats.But,people generally want new stories. Even things like my hero academia got called out for being similar to naruto and others. And, at the very least everything ends and someone has to come up with some new stories about new characters in different settings , find new audiences and new markets.

Alan moore's critic of never ending comic book soap opera storytelling does have its point. Well, the audience are reducing. Trying same thing again is pointless. Even this legacy gimmick is something that isn't going to help long term, because its done to death.If things need to change. They need to start ending stories and beginning new ones. If they want to return an old franchise make it seasonal when good pitch comes around. Dragon ball did it. Having a start, middle and end is a big help.Ending batman or superman for a while might sound like blasphemy. But, it might be what the franchises need. Dc will be forced to create new franchise in the mean time.

people have vague ideas about the characters that might be true,but for the era. Casuals think superman has always been like this since 40s. Well he isn't. Character has changed. It can and should change again. Having the same name doesn't mean 40s or 70s or current versions of character are equivalent. Clark in the 40s =/=clark now. So does it really matter if the name changes along with the character this time? And the old character is still around. Heck! Thanks geoff johns every era has been saved.

[kilderkin]

It doesn't, do damage i mean. A lot people shouting down may be heard. But,Everyone seems to have made up their mind one way or another. That's their perogative. but its just, generally negative. especially, when we don't even have any promotions to go of on. I would understand being skeptical or after seeing promotions, deciding/opinionating. But, that isn't what's happening.

The manga industry works better in that regard. Sure, there are troupes and copies of story beats.But,people generally want new stories. Even things like my hero academia got called out for being similar to naruto and others. And, at the very least everything ends and someone has to come up with some new stories about new characters in different settings , find new audiences and new markets.

Alan moore's critic of never ending comic book soap opera storytelling does have its point. Well, the audience are reducing. Trying same thing again is pointless. Even this legacy gimmick is something that isn't going to help long term, because its done to death.If things need to change. They need to start ending stories and beginning new ones. If they want to return an old franchise make it seasonal when good pitch comes around. Dragon ball did it. Having a start, middle and end is a big help.Ending batman or superman for a while might sound like blasphemy. But, it might be what the franchises need. Dc will be forced to create new franchise in the mean time.

people have vague ideas about the characters that might be true,but for the era. Casuals think superman has always been like this since 40s. Well he isn't. Character has changed. It can and should change again. Having the same name doesn't mean 40s or 70s or current versions of character are equivalent. Clark in the 40s =/=clark now. So does it really matter if the name changes along with the character this time? And the old character is still around. Heck! Thanks geoff johns every era has been saved.

Okay that's cool

As for general negativity I suppose that's a reflection of the general pattern of reboots or restarts and that rebirth was fairly well liked

You can't please all the people all of the time, but I do c what u mean