X-MEN/FF #1 REVIEW 2.0 (Spoilers)

[useridgoeshere]

Most Mutants may die in every scenario so far, but we know that Franklin outlives everything and makes it to the next universe (Immortal Hulk notwithstanding). Getting Franklin to finally care about Mutants is actually the best plan for survival, even if no one in book really knows it.

[Zelena]

Most Mutants may die in every scenario so far, but we know that Franklin outlives everything and makes it to the next universe (Immortal Hulk notwithstanding). Getting Franklin to finally care about Mutants is actually the best plan for survival, even if no one in book really knows it.

He doesn't care about mutants or he doesn't care specifically about mutants?

[MarvelMaster616]

This was such a great first issue. I went in thinking I'd know how it would play out. I was pleasantly surprised with how the story unfolded. I was worried that it would fall into the old AvX trap of drawing hard battle lines without much reason behind them. Zdkarsky avoided that. He set up a situation in which neither side truly antagonizes the other. You understand where the X-Men are coming from. You also understand where the Fantastic Four are coming from. Both have flaws. Both end up missing the bigger picture. And it makes for a clash that feels dramatic in all the right ways.

Franklin was the real star here, in my opinion. He was very different from Hope in that he's not some deer-in-the-headlights character who just gets dragged along for the ride. He gets to show some agency of his own. He gets to call out both sides and make his own choices. It made for some great moments. And if the last page is any indication, there are plenty more to come.

[spirit2011]

He doesn't care about mutants or he doesn't care specifically about mutants?

he is a teenager, he doesn't care

[Lapsus]

aren't we seeing that play out? Magneto and Sinister haven't changed. the X-men changed. Magneto was considered to be an "evil" mutant because the X-Men labeled themselves "good" mutants. he would have broken bread with them at any point in their history. but they attacked him on Xavier's orders. before he was considered to be a terrorist, he was volunteering at hospitals and hunting nazis. he has remained an individual who, at any point, can hunt a nazi or volunteer to help others. Mister Sinister is someone who started out being obsessed with evolution and continued to be obsessed with evolution. he gets the evil label for what exactly? doing genetic experiments on people? Doctor Doom does genetic experiments on people (ask Sharon Ventura).

What?, Magneto in his early days makes crystal clear that every mutant that doesnt follow him is his enemy and should be destroyed, he tells Mastermind that he doesnt need loyalty, that everyone should fear him. He was also a huge asshole treating toad like shit.

[Knives]

Please stay focused.

I don't know how the topic deviated to which villain is less bad but this discussion needs to have at least some relation to the topic to continue.

From a practical point of view, it might be better for the boy to stay away from Krakoa. I do not say this based on the fact that I believe that Krakoa is a mistake or that Xavier, Magneto and Moira are wrong. I'm basing my opinion on the fact that Sinister can create several problems if he gets his hands on Franklin's DNA.

[Zelena]

Please stay focused.

I don't know how the topic deviated to which villain is less bad but this discussion needs to have at least some relation to the topic to continue.

From a practical point of view, it might be better for the boy to stay away from Krakoa. I do not say this based on the fact that I believe that Krakoa is a mistake or that Xavier, Magneto and Moira are wrong. I'm basing my opinion on the fact that Sinister can create several problems if he gets his hands on Franklin's DNA.

It's not that Xavier is unaware of that. So what is it? Blindness?

[U.N. Owen]

He doesn't care about mutants or he doesn't care specifically about mutants?

He doesn't care about mutants unless they can restore his powers.

[Michael Watkins]

What?, Magneto in his early days makes crystal clear that every mutant that doesnt follow him is his enemy and should be destroyed, he tells Mastermind that he doesnt need loyalty, that everyone should fear him. He was also a huge asshole treating toad like shit.

that character ceased to exist when Claremont took over.

[Michael Watkins]

Well, how many of Magneto's sand castles need to kicked down before he realizes he's not on top of the food chain?

he's a survivor. he's strong enough to persevere.

[Woozie]

Can we get off this Magneto/Doom dick measuring contest and talk about something else?

Like how Charles and Magnus approached this in the worst way possible?

You show up on Yancy street with Xavier, Magneto, Storm, Kitty, Bishop, Wolverine, Iceman and Pyro to talk with the FF?

WHY?!

The ones in bold are big red flags.

[Lapsus]

that character ceased to exist when Claremont took over.

I know, but if we cant be nitpicky with supervillains then every era counts, which makes twirling mustache Magneto as canon as "i just love my people" Magneto and 90's edgy phase Magneto.

We just take it as his early villain days when he was in his more antagonistic position, he overcome that way.

[Michael Watkins]

I know, but if we cant be nitpicky with supervillains then every era counts, which makes twirling mustache Magneto as canon as "i just love my people" Magneto and 90's edgy Magneto phase.

We just take it as his early villain days when he was in his more antagonistic position, he overcome that way.

it's not nitpicky. the character, literally, started over. and he's been quite consistent. it's never "i just love my people." it's "i'm a bad person who enjoys killing. i'm good at it. i need to put this to use. i can do evil to defend and avenge mutankind." that's who Magneto is and has been since Claremont got ahold of him. when he was headmaster of the school it wasn't a reformation. it was him repaying a debt to charles xavier. he struggled the entire time and organically slid back into his terrorist mode. he's never fully a hero. as a Magneto fan, i'm not out here pretending that he's noble or a hero. he doesn't think in those terms. i don't count the pre-Claremont stories because he hadn't been given an origin at that point. he was a stock character/completely 1-dimensional.

[Michael Watkins]

Can we get off this Magneto/Doom dick measuring contest and talk about something else?

Like how Charles and Magnus approached this in the worst way possible?

You show up on Yancy street with Xavier, Magneto, Storm, Kitty, Bishop, Wolverine, Iceman and Pyro to talk with the FF?

WHY?!

The ones in bold are big red flags.

wow. you ever consider that we have discussed all of that? we're almost at page 50. why did they bring Pyro, Iceman, and Bishop? they are Kate Pryde's crew. she lives on a boat. it's the same boat that Franklin shows up on at the end of this issue. Magneto and Xavier showed up after the conflict began. they served as the distraction while Kate made her sales pitch to Franklin. you call it the worst way possible while missing the very obvious strategy of getting Franklin's parents to fly off the handle. the first punch was thrown by the FF. and it, logically, resulted in Franklin running away from home.

[Woozie]

wow. you ever consider that we have discussed all of that? we're almost at page 50. why did they bring Pyro, Iceman, and Bishop? they are Kate Pryde's crew. she lives on a boat. it's the same boat that Franklin shows up on at the end of this issue. Magneto and Xavier showed up after the conflict began. they served as the distraction while Kate made her sales pitch to Franklin. you call it the worst way possible while missing the very obvious strategy of getting Franklin's parents to fly off the handle. the first punch was thrown by the FF. and it, logically, resulted in Franklin running away from home.

I know they're Kate's crew. Kate does not need to pull her entire crew to meet with the Fantastic Four. Especially when we know they work autonomously pretty easily. There was zero reason to bring them all there.

If the counter argument is "They had a mission right after." ... then don't schedule a diplomatic meeting right before a marauders rescue, or let your crew handle one issue (that requires the fire power) while you handle the other... which does not.

And if the intention was to fuck with the family to force the kid to take your side. I'm sorry, but fuck you as a person. That's pure scum tactics.