Could a Conservative Leaning CW Superhero Show Work?

[ilovelocust]

None of your suggestions sound like conservatives would empathize with though...

I'm a conservative. Pretty sure I know better what I empathize with and believe more than a non-conservative created strawman.

[Jim Kelly]

I imagine living and working alongside Canadians every day must have some effect on the Americans in these CW shows. They must see that so much of what is a big deal to Americans hardly even matters here in Vancouver and they must be just as confounded as the Canadian crew by the ridiculousness of American politics when looked at from this side of the border. What's conservative or liberal to a Canadian is not what Americans call conservative or liberal.

A conservative show in Canada would be something like MURDOCH MYSTERIES or CORNER GAS, while a liberal show would be SCHITT'S CREEK or ORPHAN BLACK.

[thwhtGuardian]

I'm a conservative. Pretty sure I know better what I empathize with and believe more than a non-conservative created strawman.

You may indeed self identify as conservative, I wouldn't argue that, and I wouldn't argue that you don't empathize with the situations you presented...but the fact remains that the values represented by the party at large don't align at all with the situations you presented and that bigger picture is what people mean when they say this show/movie align with x/y political party and that isn't a strawman argument at all.

The conservative wing in the US has zero empathy for the rights of LGBT people, so a show that not only features them but does so in a very real way in tackling abuse in a gay relationship wouldn't be championed by the Republican party or other prominent conservative groups. And the same goes for your other examples as well.

[Powerboy]

I think this thread pretty much shows why a conservative hero would never fly on the CW. No one knows what a conservative is and any attempt at a definition is either a bunch of strawman arguments or synonymous with a blind supporter of Trump. I doubt there is a writer at the CW that can write someone not holding liberal values who is still sympathetic. And to be honest I can't picture many conservative commentators that could write a superhero strip that had a superhero who held left-wing values.

Part of the problem for me is that, right now, just about every Republican I know and talk to on Facebook and my whole family are blind Trump supporters. Even when they originally despised him and did not want him to be the Republican candidate, they've rationalized everything away because nobody wants to perceive themselves as supporting a total dirtbag. In fairness, I just read a thread that shows that Republicans are very divided about Trump. The ones that have to defend him are more vocal and have more tunnel vision because you have to in order to ignore tons of facts.

But, to me, the kind of Republican who is sensible, mostly an economic conservative, does not represent the majority. Most Republican beliefs are steeped in almost willful ignorance, be it climate change, scientific facts in general and so on.

I really do think that reality has a liberal bias while human perception has a conservative bias.

This is not to say that liberalism has no faults or overkill. But regarding the issues the CW shows deal with, mostly human rights, I think they are mostly correct.

I think most of us agree that the season of Supergirl that dealt with illegal immigration was over the top. I don't see gangs of conservatives in real life going around killing immigrants though I'm sure such things have happened in isolated situations. Most conservatives emphasize that this is about "illegal" immigration. Now, is there an undercurrent of bigotry in order for a guy to win an election by playing on what is, in reality, an extremely minor issue? Yes.

It does seem to be that the Conservative stance on most issues is steeped in misinformation, Planned Parenthood being a prime example.

Anyway, I'm deviating from the CW. I do note that Supergirl drew across the board criticism for the Immigration season so it's not like there's no such thing as going too far. But in these times and considering how removed from reality (facts and evidence) conservative views are, I just cannot see myself sticking with viewing a Conservative hero. It may well be that a new show on some network could do that.

But I think the closest you could get would be something like the old shows like the 1950s Superman where you have no idea what his political views are because they only involve him stopping people from killing people and robbing banks. Incidentally, I love that show to this day and I would welcome a show like that that had zero reference to politics and just had a good adventure story.

[Bunch of Coconuts]

You can’t even have a veeeeeeery minor gay character such as Lefou in live action BatB without right-wingers crying about “shoving gay agendas down our throats”.

[Powerboy]

If you believe the only characteristic of a gay character can be "I'm gay", minorities may only have story lines related to their minority status, and women are only strong if they hate the opposite sex, then I could see how you'd come to that conclusion. If you believe a black man's story line can center around the struggle to do what's right vs keeping his family safe from criminal elements. A gay man's story being about revealing corruption at city hall, or a woman's story about stopping a meteor from crashing into the planet. It becomes surprisingly easy to have characters of all backgrounds as one shots or ongoing characters.

If you must wade into physical identity stories, a conservative story would start with monsters can't be identified by sex, race, or sexuality. Explore stories that rigid liberal story telling won't touch because the only acceptable unsympathetic villain is white, male, and straight. Write about a lesbian whose being abused by her girlfriend but has trouble accepting that because abuse is something only the straights do. Have a black man struggling through a false rape accusation where innocence doesn't fix the damage to his life. Equality, justice before revenge, save the innocents before you punish the guilty, these are conservative values that apply to anyone's story.

And now I need to stop slacking at work.

I think what you are describing might be Captain Singh on the Flash. At first, you didn't know he was gay. Then you did know but the stories had nothing to do with his being gay. There might have been one reference when he visited his partner who was in the hospital (or maybe when his partner was visiting him). Or Joe West where I don't think they have ever that I remember referenced his being black even when adopting a child who is white. I don't think there has ever been a reference to Iris being black and Barry being white. They have normalized it and their only political and social statement was that it's not a relevant political or social issue anymore.

Maybe the mistake for a lot of viewers was in starting to make such things an issue although, back in the '60s and '70s, one of the criticisms of shows was that they normalized and that did not reflect what was happening in the real world.

[Kirby101]

I think what you are describing might be Captain Singh on the Flash. At first, you didn't know he was gay. Then you did know but the stories had nothing to do with his being gay. There might have been one reference when he visited his partner who was in the hospital (or maybe when his partner was visiting him). Or Joe West where I don't think they have ever that I remember referenced his being black even when adopting a child who is white. I don't think there has ever been a reference to Iris being black and Barry being white. They have normalized it and their only political and social statement was that it's not a relevant political or social issue anymore.

Maybe the mistake for a lot of viewers was in starting to make such things an issue although, back in the '60s and '70s, one of the criticisms of shows was that they normalized and that did not reflect what was happening in the real world.

I always wondered on those casting choices. Did they decide to have Iris black. Or did they cast either Candice or Jesse and then the other to fit as a family. And you are right. They don't even reference that it is a mixed race couple, it's just Barry and Iris and it works. It seems that in the CW, color is not relevant to any character (except in Black Lighting, which is part of the DNA of the show)

[kidfresh512]

I think what you are describing might be Captain Singh on the Flash. At first, you didn't know he was gay. Then you did know but the stories had nothing to do with his being gay. There might have been one reference when he visited his partner who was in the hospital (or maybe when his partner was visiting him). Or Joe West where I don't think they have ever that I remember referenced his being black even when adopting a child who is white. I don't think there has ever been a reference to Iris being black and Barry being white. They have normalized it and their only political and social statement was that it's not a relevant political or social issue anymore.

Maybe the mistake for a lot of viewers was in starting to make such things an issue although, back in the '60s and '70s, one of the criticisms of shows was that they normalized and that did not reflect what was happening in the real world.

Singh is a good example. But, hes super minor as a character we can't say he's really been given much in terms of developing him or his life. But, if you run with that example and just make the world of this conservative CW superhero show be a post racial world, or far into the future where any equality issue didn't exist? Like a Legion of Super heroes show? Would that satisfy or be "conservative?"

The original complaint to me seems to be that these shows pull elements of the "real world" into the storytelling. So just keep it fictional where you don't have any civil rights concerns to worry about might work?

[Powerboy]

Singh is a good example. But, hes super minor as a character we can't say he's really been given much in terms of developing him or his life. But, if you run with that example and just make the world of this conservative CW superhero show be a post racial world, or far into the future where any equality issue didn't exist? Like a Legion of Super heroes show? Would that satisfy or be "conservative?"

The original complaint to me seems to be that these shows pull elements of the "real world" into the storytelling. So just keep it fictional where you don't have any civil rights concerns to worry about might work?

I guess the complaint is that they are topical and approach the topics from the liberal view aka "All in the Family". I suppose they could do the equivalent of "The Andy Griffith Show" set in the South in the 1960s but there are no racial issues at all (and I loved that show, by the way) or "Gomer Pyle" set in a Marine base in the 1960s but, apparently, Vietnam is not happening.

But, yeah, I'm sure there are Conservatives that the very existence of Captain Singh was already pushing something called the "Gay Agenda" and Batwoman is just completely unacceptable because, no doubt, it might encourage some young woman who isn't having much luck with boys to try being gay. I am being sarcastic. It might cause her to accept who she really is and what she really feels rather than adhering to an archaic social standard.

But I do think what many conservatives want is that gay characters are not portrayed at all and that there are no racial tensions because, in their minds, racism is a thing of the past. Or, even if they admit there are, they don't want to see them.

So, a conservative show or a show acceptable to most conservatives simply would not deal with any real world issues.

I do myself get tired sometimes of all the navel gazing where every episode of every show has to be the main character questioning himself or herself, deconstructing himself or being deconstructed by someone else, usually the main villain. I do sometimes prefer an older show where the hero just has an adventure and we don't get every moping detail of his personal life. Then again, I get tired of those and want something that deals somewhat with reality.

Someone posted that he would prefer a story where maybe a woman who is gay is being abused by her lover to show that people are people and there is good and bad in any group. The problem is that I think the average conservative wouldn't care about that part, only that the very existence of a lesbian relationship is still putting gay characters on the air.

[Marvel-Studios Rep]

They use to have one called Smallville season 1.

[daBronzeBomma]

Nope.

10char

[wjowski]

I think this thread pretty much shows why a conservative hero would never fly on the CW. No one knows what a conservative is and any attempt at a definition is either a bunch of strawman arguments or synonymous with a blind supporter of Trump. I doubt there is a writer at the CW that can write someone not holding liberal values who is still sympathetic. And to be honest I can't picture many conservative commentators that could write a superhero strip that had a superhero who held left-wing values.

Nearly everything listed such as gay marriage, abortion, 'Christian' values, and even some things not mentioned already like keeping women out of the military, are core planks in the platform of the Republican party as recently as 2016. And the GOP is, like it or not, the face of conservatism in the U.S.

[bat39]

Well, honestly, neither The Flash nor Arrow were ever explicitly 'liberal' as such.

Yes, Arrow has the veneer of left-wing ideology with Oliver mostly targeting corrupt and exploitative businessmen in Season 1, and with the Big Bad's plan essentially involving class warfare against the underpriveleged. But the CW Oliver Queen has never been the liberal crusader that the comic-book Oliver Queen has been for large chunks of his existence. Ultimately, Oliver wasn't really focused on social justice issues - he was focused on stopping criminals and saving lives. Let's also not forget that Oliver has, at various points over the show's history, been prepared to use extrajudicial killing, torture and incarceration without trial as tools in his crusade. Among his closest allies and mentors are intelligence officers involved in all manner of black ops. Hell, when Oliver essentially becomes a police officer in Season 7, he set new records for police brutality! So no, he's definitely not some kind of liberal fantasy by any stretch of the imagination.

Neither is the Flash for that matter. Sure, the cast is diverse, but its never really been mentioned, let alone made an issue. Barry and Iris and just Barry and Iris - not a 'interracial relationship'. Cisco is just Cisco, not the token hispanic guy. The Flash fights metahumans and speedsters, not racists and misogynists.

In a larger sense, the question of whether superheroes are 'conservatives' or 'liberals' has always amused me. They rarely ever fall neatly into either camp. This is partly because of the desire of generations of creators trying to avoid alienating one end of the political spectrum or the other. But also, its just the nature of the beast. Superheroes work outside the system, upholding an abstract concept of justice and doing the 'right thing' over the due process of law, which I suppose makes them 'liberal'. But ultimately their aim is to work outside the system in order to preserve the status quo and maintain law and order, which kinda makes them 'conservative'. On a personal level, a lot of superheroes tend to be altruistic and willing to help the less fortunate - but they're also typically more than prepared to come down hard on the less fortunate who've turned to crime.

[titanfan]

Being conservative does not mean being against civil Rights or gay marriage.

But it's not a big enough of an issue for you to vote *for* it, which means, that for all intensive purpose you are against it.


A conservative superhero show could get boring:

Superhero: "Old Woman, I'm here to save your house from being robbed!"

Old Woman: "Don't worry, I had a gun and I shot him myself! Go save a cat from a tree or something."

Superhero: "Ok then!"


-----------------
Superhero: "Your girlfriend is going to murder your child?!?!"

Guy: "Yes, she's at the abortion clinic! Hurry and stop her!"

[Powerboy]

Well, honestly, neither The Flash nor Arrow were ever explicitly 'liberal' as such.

Yes, Arrow has the veneer of left-wing ideology with Oliver mostly targeting corrupt and exploitative businessmen in Season 1, and with the Big Bad's plan essentially involving class warfare against the underpriveleged. But the CW Oliver Queen has never been the liberal crusader that the comic-book Oliver Queen has been for large chunks of his existence. Ultimately, Oliver wasn't really focused on social justice issues - he was focused on stopping criminals and saving lives. Let's also not forget that Oliver has, at various points over the show's history, been prepared to use extrajudicial killing, torture and incarceration without trial as tools in his crusade. Among his closest allies and mentors are intelligence officers involved in all manner of black ops. Hell, when Oliver essentially becomes a police officer in Season 7, he set new records for police brutality! So no, he's definitely not some kind of liberal fantasy by any stretch of the imagination.

Neither is the Flash for that matter. Sure, the cast is diverse, but its never really been mentioned, let alone made an issue. Barry and Iris and just Barry and Iris - not a 'interracial relationship'. Cisco is just Cisco, not the token hispanic guy. The Flash fights metahumans and speedsters, not racists and misogynists.

In a larger sense, the question of whether superheroes are 'conservatives' or 'liberals' has always amused me. They rarely ever fall neatly into either camp. This is partly because of the desire of generations of creators trying to avoid alienating one end of the political spectrum or the other. But also, its just the nature of the beast. Superheroes work outside the system, upholding an abstract concept of justice and doing the 'right thing' over the due process of law, which I suppose makes them 'liberal'. But ultimately their aim is to work outside the system in order to preserve the status quo and maintain law and order, which kinda makes them 'conservative'. On a personal level, a lot of superheroes tend to be altruistic and willing to help the less fortunate - but they're also typically more than prepared to come down hard on the less fortunate who've turned to crime.

True. Just the basic premise that they work outside the law does not make them liberal or conservative. By that standard, Chuck Norris movies and the Charles Bronson Death Wish movies would be liberal when they are anything but.