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  1. #1216
    Astonishing Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    It's not like they're on a sentient location that is a powerful mutant or that there are numerous powerful telepaths on the island. Take Xavier, you take them all.
    I guess if you wanna be petulant youll find what youre looking for


    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    He put Rogue in danger in the first place for a gambit, he didn't warn her of the consequences of touching the gate and didn't say anything until well after they learnt the consequences. The only reason this occurred was because he convinced Excalibur to open the gate, which was a millenia old plan of his. This is why Excalibur were angry with him, so much they got into physical confrontations with him.
    Welllll he is a Apocalypse. He's gonna do Shady sh!t creating a new magic system aint one of them

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Omitting the fact how he's doing it is dissecting a living being who is a conscious humanoid. I hardly expect you to act like it's all good had another nation done that to Xavier if they conquered Krakoa.
    Didnt know she was still alive... thats creepy
    Xavier isnt some evil Lord that has conquered a county


    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    And how Krakoa went full colonist, they conquered that dimension and put their own puppet king in it.
    Do you know what the Scarlet Citadel is or how connected it is to the Marvel universe? What do you think he's going to do once he gets there?
    Full colonist? Oh are they controlling the population?
    Soooo he hasnt tho?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Don't conflate complaints about Krakoa being cultist with the festivals, that's disingenuous. The villains are the least affected by Krakoa, most of them are acting in character. Though Emma is getting more villainous the longer she stays there, she never used to be ok with calling human "monkeys" but now she is. House of X #3:

    Emma:"Well, what do we have here?"

    Esme:" It looks to me like the monkeys are are using tools again, Ms.Frost -- playing at civilisation."

    Emma:"Young lady, how many times do I have I told you to only use our mutant names in public, so I insist you call me White Queen."

    Esme:"Yes, mum."

    Xavier's worse then she is, since there's still some goodness in her and her being on the dark side isn't completely out of character. You could replace Xavier with Magneto and not miss a beat.
    Yes...they are both on the same page.
    Villain magneto? ehhhh kinda definitely grasping at Straws dude
    Ehhh I dont think Emma's ever had a prob throwing shade at flatscans.....
    preeeeeety sure she called them something similar in first issue of generation X
    buut not saying anything when someone makes a general shady comment about a general group of people is on the road to cackling villain? So KraKoa is not only mind controlling the general populace but also one of the worlds strongest telepath? Thats some incredible flexibility

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Correct, the puppet king of Apocalypse is a successor to the Otherworld throne.
    I meeeean he's more legitimate than the former ruler. Im sure the Otherworlders would be pleased and evil witch is no longer on the throne.
    GrindrStone(D)

  2. #1217
    Astonishing Member Glio's Avatar
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    EDIT: Wrong thread, sorry
    Last edited by Glio; 03-26-2020 at 03:06 AM.

  3. #1218
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    I guess if you wanna be petulant youll find what youre looking for
    I'm using the clues that Hickman is giving us.

    Welllll he is a Apocalypse. He's gonna do Shady sh!t creating a new magic system aint one of them
    Except he has done shady sh*t creating this magic system.


    Didnt know she was still alive... thats creepy
    Xavier isnt some evil Lord that has conquered a county
    Xavier just let Apocalypse do that, Otherworld is a colony of Krakoa now. It was't too long ago he got caught up when Apoclayspe resurrected in Krakoa. All he got was a "You on our side?' pep talk and let go, back to business.

    Full colonist? Oh are they controlling the population?
    Soooo he hasnt tho?
    Apocalypse is a person who'd be completely fine with colonising places "for their own good." It's not like he respects anything that isn't a mutant and to him mutants are expendable pawns.


    Yes...they are both on the same page.
    Villain magneto? ehhhh kinda definitely grasping at Straws dude
    Magneto's shown he upholds his ideals and it's not like he's above using malicious means to get act he wants - look at what happened when his "associates" stole from Damage Control. Xaviers colder than ice, post- Krakoa.

    Ehhh I dont think Emma's ever had a prob throwing shade at flatscans.....
    preeeeeety sure she called them something similar in first issue of generation X
    buut not saying anything when someone makes a general shady comment about a general group of people is on the road to cackling villain?
    You don't need to be cackling evil to be bad news.

    So KraKoa is not only mind controlling the general populace but also one of the worlds strongest telepath? Thats some incredible flexibility
    Krakoa's not an ordinary mutant, we're still learning about its abilities. Xavier is far from the most dangerous being on Earth. If it's not Krakoa the next best suspect is Moira X. I think she's going to be the key to the Krakoa era, and Xavier only went to Krakoa after she broke him. How she "broke" him remains a mystery and the theories I've been thinking about her go outside Krakoa. Given the structure of Hickman's series, how epic in scope they are and how "meta" Hickman is with his ideas and introducing alien species that are above the Phalanx - it'd be a complete Hickman move that one of those species, who exist outside time and space, made Moira a mutant for a specific hostile purpose. I this is true that backing would explain how she got Xavier under her control and Krakoa followed.

    I meeeean he's more legitimate than the former ruler. Im sure the Otherworlders would be pleased and evil witch is no longer on the throne.
    To be replaced with a mad reality warper, who's a puppet to Apocalypse.

    Edit: I was thinking of the Dominion class of species Hickman's X-men have bought up.
    Last edited by Steel Inquisitor; 03-26-2020 at 05:56 AM.

  4. #1219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    My favourite theory remains 'I don't care' attitude.
    Hickman seems less interested by the X-men and more by the idea of X-men.
    I think it's the exact opposite honestly. I think it's the fans who are overly invested in the "idea of the X-Men" so much that they're unable to reconcile why certain mutants are ok with the new status quo despite it being painstakingly laid out by the writer.

    Hickman literally laid out a data page of mutant murders and atrocities and slapped a big NO MORE and the end of it to drive that point home. But you still have people screaming mind control and bad writing at the top of their lungs

  5. #1220
    Mighty Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by loke13 View Post
    I think it's the exact opposite honestly. I think it's the fans who are overly invested in the "idea of the X-Men" so much that they're unable to reconcile why certain mutants are ok with the new status quo despite it being painstakingly laid out by the writer.

    Hickman literally laid out a data page of mutant murders and atrocities and slapped a big NO MORE and the end of it to drive that point home. But you still have people screaming mind control and bad writing at the top of their lungs
    I have been reading X-men comics long enough to have a idea of the X-men personalities.
    You can always say they have changed, a lot of things have happened since…
    I still can find this change puzzling and have a hard time to find it believable.

    Hickman could have done this Krakoa thing with characters… more in-character.
    I suppose it would have created less buzz.

  6. #1221
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by loke13 View Post
    I think it's the exact opposite honestly. I think it's the fans who are overly invested in the "idea of the X-Men" so much that they're unable to reconcile why certain mutants are ok with the new status quo despite it being painstakingly laid out by the writer.

    Hickman literally laid out a data page of mutant murders and atrocities and slapped a big NO MORE and the end of it to drive that point home. But you still have people screaming mind control and bad writing at the top of their lungs
    "Classic fan" mentality.

    Which has its place and isn't always wrong, but it's a balancing act. Sometimes adhering to the classic fan mentality to avoid shake ups and new things can be detrimental to a property and cause them to stagnate.
    I think Krakoa, as loaded and complicated as it is, is the shot in the arm that this specific franchise needed and is working because of the writer in charge.

  7. #1222
    Incredible Member scourge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by loke13 View Post
    I think it's the exact opposite honestly. I think it's the fans who are overly invested in the "idea of the X-Men" so much that they're unable to reconcile why certain mutants are ok with the new status quo despite it being painstakingly laid out by the writer.

    Hickman literally laid out a data page of mutant murders and atrocities and slapped a big NO MORE and the end of it to drive that point home. But you still have people screaming mind control and bad writing at the top of their lungs
    Except that doesn't make sense because until Hickman showed up they were more in character. Then sudden huge shifts that data pages alone can not explain away.

  8. #1223
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post


    Are you joking? lol
    I'm sorry are we seriously using Incursion, faded from existence Braddock as an argument? Especially when we know Roma and Saturyne still exist now?

    If you wanna argue Apocalypse and Jaime(that's a hard argument to make) are better rulers than Morgan Le Fay... (Who herself stated she's only there in interum until Arthur returns) I suppose you can do that.

    But to argue the Braddocks, who only came into power in the death throws of the multiverse, have more claim to legitimacy is a hell of a take.
    Last edited by Woozie; 03-26-2020 at 07:52 AM.

  9. #1224
    Astonishing Member Electricmastro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by loke13 View Post
    I think it's the exact opposite honestly. I think it's the fans who are overly invested in the "idea of the X-Men" so much that they're unable to reconcile why certain mutants are ok with the new status quo despite it being painstakingly laid out by the writer.

    Hickman literally laid out a data page of mutant murders and atrocities and slapped a big NO MORE and the end of it to drive that point home. But you still have people screaming mind control and bad writing at the top of their lungs
    I don’t think it’s really a healthy attitude to have to quickly conflate simply not being 100% onboard and being cautiously suspicious of what’s going on at Krakoa with being ignorant of murderous atrocities. What I think it really boils down to is if the person, whether having a positive or negative opinion, is being constructively reasonable in explaining their opinion, because as far as I’ve observed, a well-constructed opinion tends to be more worthy of being listened to.
    Last edited by Electricmastro; 03-26-2020 at 10:56 AM.

  10. #1225
    Incredible Member ARkadelphia's Avatar
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    Krakoa has been assimilated by The Brood
    “The Scarlet Witch is the only thing that will scare them. It’s the only thing they’ll respect.” - Hope Summers, Avengers vs X-Men #7

  11. #1226
    Ultimate Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ARkadelphia View Post
    Krakoa has been assimilated by The Brood
    It’s the other way around.

  12. #1227
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scourge View Post
    Controlled not to rebel against Krakoa =/= Stopping everyone from fighting each other.
    We all know how Apocalypse feels about this...

  13. #1228
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    Quote Originally Posted by loke13 View Post
    I think it's the exact opposite honestly. I think it's the fans who are overly invested in the "idea of the X-Men" so much that they're unable to reconcile why certain mutants are ok with the new status quo despite it being painstakingly laid out by the writer.

    Hickman literally laid out a data page of mutant murders and atrocities and slapped a big NO MORE and the end of it to drive that point home. But you still have people screaming mind control and bad writing at the top of their lungs
    That's a single piece to a large puzzle, they're not the sole reason for everything and the context isn't without bias Hickman's kept in. Many of the reporters are clearly made from characters who have their own biases, like the CIA agent monitoring the Marauders, or certain pieces are "missing" - like Xavier not being confirmed as an Omega. They're not omniscient narrators like Claremont writes, they're people reacting to events in-story which are giving us an insight into the world building in Hickman's run because they're all going to be relevant by act 3. This is act 1.

  14. #1229
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Xavier just let Apocalypse do that, Otherworld is a colony of Krakoa now. It was't too long ago he got caught up when Apoclayspe resurrected in Krakoa. All he got was a "You on our side?' pep talk and let go, back to business.

    Apocalypse is a person who'd be completely fine with colonising places "for their own good." It's not like he respects anything that isn't a mutant and to him mutants are expendable pawns.
    Well, yes and no. Most Horsemen are Mutants, but not all. Also, Apoccy has an odd propensity for choosing people that have been crippled and have the WILL to survive, but not so much the power to enact it.

    Warren Worthington: got recruited while he had his powers, but his wings were shredded.
    Abraham Kieros had his power to make things go boom, but he was paralyzed and couldn't use his powers.
    Caliban wasn't a very powerful mutant. Until he met Apocalypse and Apocalypse granted him the title of Horseman TWICE.
    Gazer... wasn't powerful before he lost his powers n M-day. Then he was dying when Apoccy found him.
    Shiro Yoshida had his legs cut off by Deathstrike, then had his powers and life force drained nearly to the point of killing him by Rogue.
    Lorna Dane became Pestilence after M-Day while she had no powers.

    Then there's the non-mutants...
    Rory Campbell, normal human.
    Cal'syee Neramani is technically a mutant.... Shi'ar. Not even born in this GALAXY.
    Bruce Banner is powerful, but he's a Gamma Mutate.
    Leper Queen didn't actually become a Horseman, but Apoccy considered it even though she had no powers and was disfigured by massive burns.
    When Gazer became a Horseman Apoccy told him he had to fight an ordinary guy named Foster to the death for the position. Presumably if Foster had killed Gazer he'd have become War.

  15. #1230
    Time Police BishopsJuice91's Avatar
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    What happens when 2 mutants make a human baby? It’s happened before...

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