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  1. #661
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    Because there are oversensitive Hal Jordan fans that white knight him any time they even perceive something that threatens him.
    At least those oversensitive Hal Jordan fans don't tend to use his own appreciation thread to constantly drag other representatives of the mantle anytime they don't like what DC is doing with him.

  2. #662
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    Because there are oversensitive Hal Jordan fans that white knight him any time they even perceive something that threatens him. Yet, the things I said have nothing specifically to do with Hal Jordan's merits as a character or lack thereof. Simply, I was exposed to a black Green Lantern on television and when I went to buy a comic, I got a white one instead. I can't say I was happy with that. This doesn't even particularly have to do with the characters' races. But rather that I knew the guy I was reading in the comic was not the guy I wanted to see. You could have sat me down and explained about all these white GL's all day long and I wouldn't have given too much of a crap. I wanted to see the guy I saw on TV, and I didn't want to see him in the background behind some characters I didn't know.
    It was the complete opposite for me. My major experience with the GL's was John in the cartoons and then I got into the comics through Hal with the Geoff Johns run.

  3. #663
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    I had no idea what a Green Lantern was until the JL show so John was my first Lantern. Aside from having a Green Lantern who looked like me, I was automatically attatched to him by virtue of him being my first experience with the title. And he's been my favorite ever since. So you won't hear me complaing whenever he gets put into the spotlight over Hal. Shit, ever since the DCEU started talking about adding a Green Lantern, I've been hoping it would be him.

  4. #664
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
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    I still wonder why fans of superheroes in Japan never have these kinds of disputes even though they have 54 years worth of Ultramen, 49 years worth of Kamen Riders, and 45 years worth of sentai ("Power Rangers") teams.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
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  5. #665
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    I still wonder why fans of superheroes in Japan never have these kinds of disputes even though they have 54 years worth of Ultramen, 49 years worth of Kamen Riders, and 45 years worth of sentai ("Power Rangers") teams.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    How do we know that they don't? I'm sure there are plenty of disputes over Gorenger VS Dekaranger. Or whether or not Sentai truly started with Battle Fever xD
    Last edited by Blue22; 02-27-2020 at 10:17 AM.

  6. #666
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    I still wonder why fans of superheroes in Japan never have these kinds of disputes even though they have 54 years worth of Ultramen, 49 years worth of Kamen Riders, and 45 years worth of sentai ("Power Rangers") teams.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    They are set up way differently. I think the (mostly) annual refreshes/new continuities being ingrained as a tradition means they don't expect anything else.

    We just don't have that. I do kind of envy them a bit. Though it does pop up in some fandoms. Digimon is getting a reboot that is based on the first anime series, and the "nostalgia" complaints are rearing up. However, those are the western fans saying that, so who knows how those in Japan feel.

  7. #667
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    They are set up way differently. I think the (mostly) annual refreshes/new continuities being ingrained as a tradition means they don't expect anything else.

    We just don't have that. I do kind of envy them a bit. Though it does pop up in some fandoms. Digimon is getting a reboot that is based on the first anime series, and the "nostalgia" complaints are rearing up. However, those are the western fans saying that, so who knows how those in Japan feel.
    From what I can tell, the Japanese fans eat up anything relating to Adventure. Look at how well Tri did over there in spite of it not being....very good :/

  8. #668
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sodam Yat View Post
    It's not about who's more recognizable than the other among pop culture. I think what others are trying to make is the fact that it could upset someone if the character they expect is different than the one in the comics. I just don't see why there's such disagreements with that.

    And besides, before I even got into comics, I didn't know Hal Jordan even existed. In fact, there's other characters who were created before Hal Jordan and some of them I didn't know at the time.
    For me, though, it just doesn't matter because I know that the movies, shows, and comics all operate on separate realities. I appreciate films and TV shows that loyally adapt the comics (or at least strive to capture the "spirit" of the comics), but I know that a lot of the time, creative liberties will be taken. I'd imagine that a lot of fans probably feel the way I feel. However, by that token, maybe some people were upset to learn that, despite the movie telling them otherwise, Captain America, Black Widow, and Hawkeye were actually not founding members of the Avengers.

    I've also learned through my years of fandom that, unfortunately, success in other media does not translate to increased comic book sales (for the most part). If that were true, Iron Man would be outselling almost every single character. And I say this as someone who, yes, got into comics because of the DCAU. However, in spite of that, I didn't expect the DC Universe to take the shape of the DCAU and in many respects, I'm happy that it hasn't. At the same time, some of the concepts that have migrated from the DCAU into the DCU, annoy me.

    And of course, the DCAU ended fourteen years ago at this point. I don't know how much relevance to the fanbase it has any more or even if it had much back then. It was a cartoon that had a dedicated cult following, but it wasn't as big as the MCU or anything like that. I'd even say that CW DC shows probably have a bigger following.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    Again, if I was an executive at WB or AT&T, anybody who can't understand that concept and gets in the way of it would be let go, and it doesn't seem like DiDio understood it or wanted to play ball with it, and that sounds like it may have been his undoing. He was especially foolish in this instance because WB was literally right across the lot from him this time. The difference between me and whoever fired him is that I would have fired him about 18 years ago. You don't successfully build brands by confusing and disappointing your potential buyers, and you should not expect them to go researching to find out why your thing doesn't make sense. If there is a black Green Lantern prominently displayed in media, and if he is working well, he should be prominently displayed in the comic book titled "Green Lantern". Not some other character who doesn't have near the platform as the black one who is working well. Simple. Lastly, even if potential buyers find out there is a white Green Lantern, that does not mean they want to read/see him after being conditioned to a black one.
    Here's the thing, though: Hal Jordan is an incredibly popular character. That's just the truth. And, obviously, it should be expected because he's been the star of the Green Lantern comics for over 50 of the 60 years the Green Lantern Corps has been a thing. So, getting rid of him in any capacity is not going to fly over well with GL fans. They tried that once, and while it gave us Kyle Rayner (which I am very grateful for), it also sparked an entire movement among the fanbase in response, dedicated to getting Hal back. Plus, he's the GL who has probably had the most success sales-wise in the comics and was at the center of the most high-profile and popular run on Green Lantern comics of all time.

    Plus, the MCU has taken huge liberties with Marvel characters and at least a few of those things have not been replicated in the comics. And honestly, that's a good thing because some of those things from the movies make sense for the movies but don't make sense in the comics. Unless of course, they've changed the Marvel Universe continuity to have it so that Tony Stark gave Peter his Spider-Man costume, Tony Stark built Ultron, Hank Pym is now an old man whose daughter is dating Scott Lang, etc. In the end, the comics and the movies and the shows are all separate universes. IMO, people should let them be separate universes.
    Last edited by Zeeguy91; 02-27-2020 at 11:05 AM.

  9. #669
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    I still wonder why fans of superheroes in Japan never have these kinds of disputes even though they have 54 years worth of Ultramen, 49 years worth of Kamen Riders, and 45 years worth of sentai ("Power Rangers") teams.
    Those series have had that format almost since inception, and the core audience is expected to age out of them very quickly.

    People know going in that there's going to be a complete story with a beginning, middle and end, told over 50 or so episodes - all designed to tie-in with a new toy line each year. Comics aren't really equipped to work with that format, and there's never been much of an incentive to do so.
    Last edited by Lee; 02-27-2020 at 12:51 PM.

  10. #670
    A Wearied Madness Vakanai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    That's too bad. These characters should and would be better of in the hands of public if you ask me.
    I would disagree. We haven't gotten a good Dracula or Frankenstein in how long? Sure, Sherlock Holmes has had some good stuff in the past decade, but you still get a year or two in between with nothing. Sure, more people can use public domain characters - but fewer bother with them. Better to work on something you own than something free to everyone.

  11. #671
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vakanai View Post
    I would disagree. We haven't gotten a good Dracula or Frankenstein in how long? Sure, Sherlock Holmes has had some good stuff in the past decade, but you still get a year or two in between with nothing. Sure, more people can use public domain characters - but fewer bother with them. Better to work on something you own than something free to everyone.
    Do you think the characters you mentioned would have been used more effectively if they were owned? I don't think so.Disney's whole brand uses charcters from public domain like tarzan or jungle book. Again, the quality of the product you deliver will decide the profit you make.

  12. #672
    A Wearied Madness Vakanai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Well, to be fair, people hated it when Arthur Light became a real villain in Identity Crisis (or whatever it was) instead of a moron who got beat up by children. Then in the New52 he wasn't evil at all, just a scientist who got caught on the edge of superhumanity, and people didn't like that either.



    They already pull in more money from tv and movies. And we're happy they do, because those adaptations are the best protection comics could hope to have.

    When Disney bought Marvel, everyone said "oh noes, they'll shut down the publishing! They'll turn our comics into princess stories and have Mickey Mouse join the Avengers!" That never happened. Ever dire prediction turned out to be noise and hot air. Every single one. Marvel kept making comics just like they had been, and those comics kept being used for movie storyboard ideas and to maintain copyrights (or is it trademarks? I always forget which is which, and that's damn embarrassing). Nothing really changed for the comics when Marvel went corporate. Hell, even Marvel's desperate chase of movie synergy started before Disney bought them. That began as soon as Iron Man hit with Fraction's run.

    I find it unlikely that AT&T will do anything much more drastic, as far as the structure of the publishing goes. Replace some people? Sure. And Harras can be next, please. But what's the worst case scenario? Comics are still excellent, cost effective ways to provide storyboards and plots for larger media adaptations, which are stupid profitable. They're still easy ways to maintain ownership. So what, AT&T pulls DC out of the direct market? We all know that's an awful distribution method so why would anyone be upset about it? We have multiple distribution models that work, and if DC wasn't putting 90% of their resources into the direct market they'd put those resources into digital, Scholastic, bookstore OGN's, etc. All the stuff we keep saying they should do.

    So perhaps the worst case scenario isn't AT&T making big changes, but AT&T leaving things as they are.
    If I could nod in agreement to this any harder I think my head would fly right off.

  13. #673
    A Wearied Madness Vakanai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Do you think the characters you mentioned would have been used more effectively if they were owned? I don't think so.Disney's whole brand uses charcters from public domain like tarzan or jungle book. Again, the quality of the product you deliver will decide the profit you make.
    There's also a lot of crap out there too. And even when you get quality, quantity goes way down. How many Tarzan products have there been over the years? Not bloody many. If I had to go years between my Batman fix, I'd be less than happy with the whole arrangement.

  14. #674
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    I doubt DC would stop publishing Batman comics if the character became public domain. They'd still own 90% of the Batman lore and characters.

  15. #675
    Incredible Member Lvenger's Avatar
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    Didio's been in charge of DC for the 10+ years I've been reading and collecting comics monthly so seeing his removal from power in DC is an end of an era. I would have liked it even more if Didio leaving put a stop to the 5G relaunch but I guess that's been in the works for too long now.

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