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  1. #646
    Astonishing Member Ferro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordUltimus View Post
    I meant in-universe.
    if cassandra nova shows up the x-men will pull up to murder her, wanda is a tale of a human that commited a genocide and is a super hero.
    wich one do you think is scarier? the monster the x-men can deal with, or the other who enjoys the priveledges of her humanity to absolve her of her crimes?

  2. #647
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordUltimus View Post
    Why single out Wanda when Cassandra Nova killed 16 times as many mutants as her?
    Bingo, plus although everyone gets to look the other way but since we are talking about resurrection,Selene should be banished from Krakoa,she resurrected those killed by Nova just to sacrifice them for herself.People twist themselves in pretzels trying to make mutants of her ilk somehow anomalies

  3. #648
    Astonishing Member LordUltimus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    New X-men wasn't a retcon it was a direct continuation of HoM 8. That wasn't referring to all mutants
    Direct continuations can do retcons. And yes, it rather explicitly was.

  4. #649
    Astonishing Member LordUltimus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferro View Post
    if cassandra nova shows up the x-men will pull up to murder her, wanda is a tale of a human that commited a genocide and is a super hero.
    wich one do you think is scarier? the monster the x-men can deal with, or the other who enjoys the priveledges of her humanity to absolve her of her crimes?
    The one that killed more people.

  5. #650
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferro View Post
    if cassandra nova shows up the x-men will pull up to murder her, wanda is a tale of a human that commited a genocide and is a super hero.
    wich one do you think is scarier? the monster the x-men can deal with, or the other who enjoys the priveledges of her humanity to absolve her of her crimes?
    What exactly was Wanda supposed to do? She tried to fix it and she couldn't by herself. And it seems to me like the X-Men weren't dying for her help.

  6. #651
    Mighty Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    Wandas wave was omniversal and affected all realities but two showed sign of mutants after messiah complex
    Omniversal… she is really impressing. Three little words softly uttered…

  7. #652
    Astonishing Member legion_quest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferro View Post
    cassandra nova has had her neck cracked, put into a mass of flesh, a tsunami trown at her and jean forced her to learn compassion, cassandra nova is a villain and is treated as such.
    wanda commited genocide over fake vibrator babies and daddy issues and shes an avenger
    Wanda didnt commit genocide, Cassandra Nova did. Wanda committed, at most, manslaughter of however many people. Genocide requires the premeditated murder of a whole section of society. She didnt do that.

    Wanda never set out to kill an entire race of people, she took away their powers. The vast majority did not die. Genocide requires death to be applicable. There isnt really a real world word for what Wanda did. It's more akin to ethnic cleansing, which can be done without killing, than genocide, which requires premeditated killing as part of the definition of what it is.
    I will raise my throne above the Stars of God

  8. #653
    Astonishing Member CGAR's Avatar
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    It wasn't a retcon though. The act of taking the powers didnt get them killed. But depending on what each individual mutant was doing they did die because they no longer had their powers.

    Wait. I didnt say that right. Or did I. I don't even know.

    But I dont think it was a retcon.

  9. #654
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by legion_quest View Post
    I dont need to? We aren't talking about the real world, we're talking about comics, and that was Xavier's dream. What we have now isn't his dream, but it's almost the polar opposite in terms of cultish segregation, which is just as, in my opinion anyway, childish and simplistic.

    Again, I think that will be one of the points Hickman makes by the end. Integration, not isolation. Acceptance, not dominance. Freedom of choice, not weird extremism that feigns choice but punishes those that disagree or dont fit in.
    All I’m saying is, a dream based on the fantasy of being accepted by ‘normal’ society if you just sit back and take everything they dish out at your expense is no dream. Xavier’s dream was the dream of a child. It has never worked in the real world, it cannot work in a fictional world where a plurality of humanity across all racial and national and cultural lines wants you UTTERLY annihilated.

    I’m not saying it isn’t a wonderful dream. It was. But humanity has made it abundantly clear that dream will NEVER come to pass, so it’s time for a new one. One where they are still absolutely a part of the world, but on THEIR terms, not those of their oppressors.

  10. #655
    Extraordinary Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordUltimus View Post
    Direct continuations can do retcons. And yes, it rather explicitly was.
    Point to the scan where it said all mutants were depowered and not a single one died. It's not a retcon at all

  11. #656
    Ultimate Member spirit2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosebunse View Post
    And another thing, no, Wanda wasn't in her right mind. She had just discovered that her brother had manipulated her and Magneto wasn't doing much better. Her children and husband were dead and everything was a lie and that's on top of her previous fragile state.

    But no, she is so much worse than Apocalypse and Sinister
    I can't wait for Apocalypse and Sinister turn heel on them

  12. #657
    Extraordinary Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by legion_quest View Post
    Wanda didnt commit genocide, Cassandra Nova did. Wanda committed, at most, manslaughter of however many people. Genocide requires the premeditated murder of a whole section of society. She didnt do that.

    Wanda never set out to kill an entire race of people, she took away their powers. The vast majority did not die. Genocide requires death to be applicable. There isnt really a real world word for what Wanda did. It's more akin to ethnic cleansing, which can be done without killing, than genocide, which requires premeditated killing as part of the definition of what it is.
    By destroying a culture and blocking mutant births Wanda satisfied two definitions of genocide.

  13. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosebunse View Post
    He's got the ass for it.
    Was it ever explained why Wandas attack wasn't 100% effective ? Why a few hundred survied?

  14. #659
    Proud Krakoan Jbenito's Avatar
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    The fact that this keeps coming up makes it clear that Hickman will address it in some way. Wanda's spell did lead to the uprising of many humans intent on killing the remaining mutants and we all saw the nasty, bloody road that led to. That's actually when I left the books for a little bit because I didn't like the hopelessness of it all.

    Unfortunately the source of this was an ally and in many cases, a friend/family member. And the truth is, there's no guarantee that she wouldn't snap again (or be influenced by an outsider). That's why I understand the fear and it will be interesting to see how Hickman handles this.
    Boop! Krakoa forever!

  15. #660
    Ultimate Member spirit2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Well, that "NO MORE" chart did say

    Cassandra Nova: 16 millions killed

    Wanda Maximoff: 1 million depowered
    Funny that they said there was a lot of Genocides, But one was comitted by a murmudrai, twin of Charles.

    and the other by a mutant.

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