Giant Size X-men - Jean Grey and Emma Frost SPOILER thread

[Fall-From-Grace]

I was making a bajilion jokes over how happy i am over kitty's death immediatly made mauraders a more balanced book, so i know that aint me

At this point im interested in jason aaron's jean :P

That's fine, I think my post came off a bit too agressive, sorry about that. I didn't mean to single out anyone , it's just that , more often than not, when I see '' X character took the spotlight of Y book'' , what is really being said is '' I hate X character. Why are Z,Y, N ( my favorites) not receiving the same attention? '' . Like, it's fine to call Red a solo, because it was, but if that is going to be your criticism of the book then yeah, point it out when it happens to your fave chars as well.

I agree to an extent with what you said in terms of Jean's power displays . Yeah, it was obvious Taylor was a Jean fan , and he gave her some pretty powerful scenes, but I did feel like the rest of the cast played a role. Trinary, Gabby and Laura in particular all felt important . I wish he did more with Gambit, Nightcrawler and Storm, who, IMO, were neglected.

What I'm really sad with is you ignoring me in the Wanda Thread =/. Not cool man, haha

Also, by Aaron writing Jean, do you mean that prehistoric Phoenix business ? Haven't caught up with that, and not sure I should hahaha

[stormphoenix]

I’m not sure why some fan groups are so insecure, talking to the Storm and Emma mega fans.

It’s Comments like THIS is why the Infighting and Arguments and the subtle Shade continues to happen.

You sir are Poking the Bear. Leave it Alone......

[ExodusCloak]

Only to those that sleep on Jean and her capabilities.



The Mag helmets were for all the non telepaths and to stop Nova for accessing more innocent people...Jean herself clearly didn't need it (Nova removed it and Jean still prevented her from attacking her mind), and Jean is the only one who confronted Nova at first, until it was Laura and Gabby's turn to play their parts.

She used it herself, if she didn't need it she wouldn't have worn one. For sure she could stall Nova for a bit until Nova eventually got through her defenses which is what happened. And thats why she needed the helmet in the first place because she wouldn't have been able to keep Nova out over a long battle. All she needed to do was stall long enough to set their plan in motion.

Nova is in another league

[MechaJeanix]

It’s Comments like THIS is why the Infighting and Arguments and the subtle Shade continues to happen.

You sir are Poking the Bear. Leave it Alone......

I'm not. I'm just responding to what I see. I never hate on either Storm or Emma or create ridiculous arguments to try to downgrade the other all in some bizarre childish online war between different 'fav character' groups. I'm just calling out bad behavior in hopes that it stops.

I called out bad behavior on some Jean fans on twitter the other day and all it resulted in was people dog piling on me to make fun of me even though I was the level headed intelligent person in the conversation. All I'm asking is for some of you to be better and do better because I know you are capable of being better.

I'm being fair to all the groups. I'm just asking for folks to act like adults and engage in good faith discussions. I don't think that is much to ask for folks to try to be better.

[Ferro]

the problem is bringing up storm emma when its a response to me, and my dislike of hean realy doesnt stem from my love of those two

[Omega_DCD]

... she literaly pulls a trick ot make herself the smartest person in the room to become the saint the world needs, effortlessly lifts/destroys massive building, rocks and what not witout a moment of strain, its he cringiest display of an overpowered lady with a severe savior complex.

You gotta be kidding...she literally tells Namor to hurry because she can't hold that collapsing structure forever. What is so outlandish about that feat, or any of her others?

She used it herself, if she didn't need it she wouldn't have worn one. For sure she could stall Nova for a bit until Nova eventually got through her defenses which is what happened. And thats why she needed the helmet in the first place because she wouldn't have been able to keep Nova out over a long battle. All she needed to do was stall long enough to set their plan in motion.

Nova is in another league

Cassandra Nova targeted Jean in the first place because Jean was the only telepath around that could challenge her(same as Gamesmaster did with Jean in the late 90s)...Due to her meticulous plans, due to her hate and depravity, and yes, her powers, she's a huge threat...but she's not some untouchable psi.

[Strong Girl Daken]

wich was probably to help those mediocre sales in the final issue, saint jean didnt have any need for help just compassionate enough to let others have a play.

Are you sure you want to go with "Avengers help sales" here?

[Ferro]

Are you sure you want to go with "Avengers help sales" here?

you're right that's a self drag

[butterflykyss]

I think if we are to call people out we should be fair about the criticism. I think jean - considering how long she had been dead - most certainly deserved her moment to shine. however, this shouldn't have been at the expense of other characters. for instance, taylor wrote that storm should be able to kill herself with her own lightning bolt. ororo is immune to the weather and the effects of it so under no circumstances should she be hurt by her own lightning especially when nehzno easily tanked it.

next when their underwater base was under attack ororo and nehzno stood helplessly by until jean could transport them underwater even though ororo could have done the same thing on her own. jean, at that time, should have gotten the focus she needed but it doesnt make it right when other characters are made to look ineffectual. so I would challenge people who criticize certain fans for expressing their frustration to at least try to see where these fans are coming from.


now let's compare that to what happened in this giant size book.

even though ororo was incapacitated, her mind was still strong enough to resist the power of two immensely strong telepaths, one being an omega level telepath. both jean and emma got moments to shine while the strength of ororos mind was showcased. we didnt see this in red where storm wasnt even shown trying to resist the nanite in her brain. so fans wont cry foul when their faves are represented in a good light.

[MechaJeanix]

the problem is bringing up storm emma when its a response to me, and my dislike of hean realy doesnt stem from my love of those two

It wasn't a response to you, but I guess you just assumed it was. It was more toward Exodus Cloak and butterflykyss, but your comments came across as very similar to what I described so that is probably why you felt that way.

My point remains that it is way past time for the x-men fandom to grow up. I think we are certainly heading in that direction.

edit; I guess I did call out the Mary Sue thing whoever said it. I don't recall. But I was still referring to the frequent ones who sort of play the game I was referring to.

[spirit2011]

She used it herself, if she didn't need it she wouldn't have worn one. For sure she could stall Nova for a bit until Nova eventually got through her defenses which is what happened. And thats why she needed the helmet in the first place because she wouldn't have been able to keep Nova out over a long battle. All she needed to do was stall long enough to set their plan in motion.

Nova is in another league

she didn't needed the helmet, Jean hold Nova out of her head

[Omega_DCD]

Storm has been hurt by her own lightning before...but even in the case, the nanites that are controlling her don't necessarily know the lightning won't hurt her, it's just a logical choice...Gentle intervenes because better safe than sorry

Just because Jean transported them outside the underwater base doesn't mean Storm couldn't have...has Storm never carried people with her winds who are capable of flight themselves?

[ExodusCloak]

Cassandra Nova targeted Jean in the first place because Jean was the only telepath around that could challenge her(same as Gamesmaster did with Jean in the late 90s)...Due to her meticulous plans, due to her hate and depravity, and yes, her powers, she's a huge threat...but she's not some untouchable psi.

She still required the helmet. Once removed she held out against Nova for a brief moment before being taken down and this was while Nova was controlling an army.

Nova is a super psi. And she should be written the way you describe her, but she wasn't written that way in X-Men Red. Nova wasn't very clever, shrewd or calculating she gave the X-Men time to attack with the aid of the Avengers had no contingency like in Morrisons. Got chumped several times. It was an unfortunate portrayl of her intelligence. In terms of her powers Taylor at least got that right. She's a an evil corrupting mega psi

[Del torro]

Lmfao, I was starting to miss the Jean bashing. The forums just don't seem the same without it.

[butterflykyss]

Storm has been hurt by her own lightning before...but even in the case, the nanites that are controlling her don't necessarily know the lightning won't hurt her, it's just a logical choice...Gentle intervenes because better safe than sorry

Just because Jean transported them outside the underwater base doesn't mean Storm couldn't have...has Storm never carried people with her winds who are capable of flight themselves?

Taylor himself said that he and his team figured storm could hurt herself with her own lightning. even though canocially claremont established she is immune to the elements. moreover, it was reestablished in her solo book she is immune to lightning.

you're making my point for me. instead of standing there waiting for jean to save them she could have been more proactive as she was when she went to attack nova.




taylor wrote his story to make jean look the best while slighting the strengths of other characters. that's why storm fans complained about it. alternatively, no storm fan has complained about giant size. Hickman has demonstrated he can write a strong jean while not dininshing the established power sets of other characters. if Taylor had done the same it would have perhaps been received better. the morale of the story: fans wont shade if writers dont give them a reason to.