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  1. #226
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    If there’s one thing DC is good at it’s ignoring WW continuity. They can totally ignore that if they want to.

  2. #227
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    If there’s one thing DC is good at it’s ignoring WW continuity. They can totally ignore that if they want to.
    Yeah, it's been such a small thing right now that if they want to walk back from it, now's the time.

  3. #228
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Unless it's King writing it I don't see Bruce retiring just to be a full-time parent. I mean, most Superheroes don't retire to be parents these days so I don't see it happening to Batman.
    I was most assuredly thinking of King. Or, really, just taking a jab. Unfair of me, I guess.

    Yeah, it's been such a small thing right now that if they want to walk back from it, now's the time.
    Have to feel sorry for Wonder Woman, though. Things already started in that direction, and her continuity would just end up even more unsettled.

  4. #229
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    I mean it wouldn’t be that hard to pull something like “that was actually earth 2 Wonder Woman since COIE is canon or that is actually Hippolyta like Geoff Johns said in his JSA runs”
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
    Words to live by.

  5. #230
    Astonishing Member Factor's Avatar
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    I'm not sure the WWII origin is even the best for WW's character.
    It almost guarantees she didn't leave much of an impact until Superman's debut, so everything else can stay pretty much the same.
    It also makes most of her history a complete blank. It's not like DC will actually expand on her decades being active as a superheroine before the debut of her fellow Leaguers. At most we'll see her alongside the JSA, but nothing that will bring true value to the character aside from the status of being "the first".
    And then there's the problem that it further complicates Donna's best origin (of being an orphan rescued by Diana and adapted by the Amazons), because it only makes sense if Diana is still new to heroing, since she'd have rescued tons of other orphans before Donna was even born and they wouldn't develop a sisterly bond if Diana was old enough to be her grandmother.

  6. #231
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    I'm not sure the WWII origin is even the best for WW's character.
    It almost guarantees she didn't leave much of an impact until Superman's debut, so everything else can stay pretty much the same.
    It also makes most of her history a complete blank. It's not like DC will actually expand on her decades being active as a superheroine before the debut of her fellow Leaguers. At most we'll see her alongside the JSA, but nothing that will bring true value to the character aside from the status of being "the first".
    And then there's the problem that it further complicates Donna's best origin (of being an orphan rescued by Diana and adapted by the Amazons), because it only makes sense if Diana is still new to heroing, since she'd have rescued tons of other orphans before Donna was even born and they wouldn't develop a sisterly bond if Diana was old enough to be her grandmother.
    And I doubt any current origin is going to be as strong or as evergreen as Rucka/Scott's Year One, which was decidedly set in the modern era.

  7. #232
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    Well I was enjoying the books I've been following, and I'll say I'd be disappointed if they just decide to drop all the current plots and reboot again, either with them going straight to the supposedly rumored 5G setting(which is actually a big worry for me) or another kind of reboot.

    Nor would I be in favor ditching Diana starting in the golden age, presumably in favor of backtracking to Rebirth's Year One or yet another reboot. I've been enjoying Orlando's current direction with Diana, more than her initial rebirth set up, and fell it has done a better job of restoring her continuity, which I feel was one of the major flaws or Rucka's Rebirth run. And I have no problem with her being immortal, and I feel the JSA should have an Amazon to fill Diana's place, and if Diana is available there's no reason it shouldn't be her. The major flaw in this set up is how they may handle Steve in this, but I'm willing to wait and see how they handle him first.

    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    I'm not sure the WWII origin is even the best for WW's character.
    It almost guarantees she didn't leave much of an impact until Superman's debut, so everything else can stay pretty much the same.
    It also makes most of her history a complete blank. It's not like DC will actually expand on her decades being active as a superheroine before the debut of her fellow Leaguers. At most we'll see her alongside the JSA, but nothing that will bring true value to the character aside from the status of being "the first".
    And then there's the problem that it further complicates Donna's best origin (of being an orphan rescued by Diana and adapted by the Amazons), because it only makes sense if Diana is still new to heroing, since she'd have rescued tons of other orphans before Donna was even born and they wouldn't develop a sisterly bond if Diana was old enough to be her grandmother.
    Donna's origin as initially presented requires a Diana who has been active on some level for at least over a decade, and I'd say at least two decades so Donna can be in the same age group as the other Titans in their twenties. They're are other ways to get around this but you have to make compromises elsewhere, such as Donna being raised alongside Diana, meaning you have to give up on Diana being an only child growing up, or Donna being adopted at significantly older age(for example if Donna is currently age 20, and Diana has only been active for 10 years, she couldn't have been rescued and adopted by Diana before age 10).

    Right now I'm willing to see what Donna Troy's full origin under Orlando is. So far it would seem we have a Donna who at a young age was rescued and adopted as Diana's sister(which would have been impossible in the rebirth continuity with how cut off from Themyscira, Diana had been. Which is one of the things I'm glad has apparently been changed with Doomsday Clock's alterations), but instead of rescuing Donna from a fire Donna was saved from an undisclosed party that intended to use her as a weapon against Diana. We also don't know exactly at what age Diana rescued Donna. So far from what I've seen I'm eager for the full details which makes these delays particularly frustrating for me.

  8. #233
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    If they could just keep Year One as the official origin and put the brakes on the rest of this while it's still early, that would be great.

    Donna as usual is a bit of a headache here, but they could always say it was a God or something that rescued her and brought her to the island, and she left shortly after Year One to become Wonder Girl. I've also toyed with the idea of Wonder Woman being bounced around time in a time travel adventure, maybe she ends up at the burning building to rescue Donna before being transported to Paradise Island where she can secretly leave Donna in Hippolyta's chambers and is bounced back out again before the queen and her younger self see her. She has at least one obscure villain (the Time Master) who could fit the story.

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  10. #235
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    I don't like the idea of Wonder Woman being so much older than her contemporary heroes. It just seems kinda' weird to me.
    I tend to agree. I am very much a fan of Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman being similarly-aged, similarly-experienced contemporaries. I didn't like her as the rookie with them more experienced in post-COIE era, either. I mean, it's not a deal-breaker for me either way, though. Just a preference.

  11. #236
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    I definitely prefer Wonder Woman debuting a little bit after Superman and Batman and be their contemporary. Like within the same year, or just after Robin at the absolute latest. And pre-dating most of her other peers in the JL.

    That's why Donna's pre-COIE origin, despite being vastly better than anything that came after, still doesn't make 100% sense. WW typically debuts after Robin, and Dick and Donna are the same age, how is Donna an infant when Diana is active?

  12. #237
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    I definitely prefer Wonder Woman debuting a little bit after Superman and Batman and be their contemporary. Like within the same year, or just after Robin at the absolute latest. And pre-dating most of her other peers in the JL.

    That's why Donna's pre-COIE origin, despite being vastly better than anything that came after, still doesn't make 100% sense. WW typically debuts after Robin, and Dick and Donna are the same age, how is Donna an infant when Diana is active?
    I agree with you on Donna's pre-COIE origin being a problem (though, like you said, much better than all others). I'd just give her a different one - what does one more matter at this point,

    No, but seriously, I like Donna a lot, and hate the fall she's taken. But it's more important to me that Wonder Woman, Superman, and Batman be peers than that Donna be Wonder Woman's sister (though, she could, of course, be rescued by someone else as others have suggested, I admit I prefer Steve the first outsider there at least in Diana's lifetime). I think a lot of my perspective comes from think of Donna as Titans character, first and foremost. In reading all the old stuff with her, she and Diana really didn't have that much to do with each other. She even said at one point - Hippolyta raised her and she rarely saw Diana because Diana didn't live there. I do like the warrior background, particularly as a bonding point with Kory. But if necessary, I'm willing to sacrifice it (and have her inducted as an Amazon or in trained as a warrior in her teens) in order to keep the trinity members peers.

    I actually really like that Dick (and Roy) have more experience than so many of the JLA. People forget Green Arrow is as old a consistently-appearing character as Wonder Woman. Presumably because he never had his own title in the old days and was rather re-invented later and just never reached the same highs of fame.
    Last edited by Tzigone; 04-03-2020 at 05:23 PM.

  13. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    I agree with you on Donna's pre-COIE origin being a problem (though, like you said, much better than all others). I'd just give her a different one - what does one more matter at this point,

    No, but seriously, I like Donna a lot, and hate the fall she's taken. But it's more important to me that Wonder Woman, Superman, and Batman be peers than that Donna be Wonder Woman's sister (though, she could, of course, be rescued by someone else as others have suggested, I admit I prefer Steve the first outsider there at least in Diana's lifetime). I think a lot of my perspective comes from think of Donna as Titans character, first and foremost. In reading all the old stuff with her, she and Diana really didn't have that much to do with each other. She even said at one point - Hippolyta raised her and she rarely saw Diana because Diana didn't live there. I do like the warrior background, particularly as a bonding point with Kory. But if necessary, I'm willing to sacrifice it (and have her inducted as an Amazon or in trained as a warrior in her teens) in order to keep the trinity members peers.

    I actually really like that Dick (and Roy) have more experience than so many of the JLA. People forget Green Arrow is as old a consistently-appearing character as Wonder Woman. Presumably because he never had his own title in the old days and was rather re-invented later and just never reached the same highs of fame.
    Personally, I think if we were to go with Diana starting at the same time as Superman and Batman in the present day, we're better off compromising on the Diana being and only child growing up angle and having Donna either brought to island by one of the goddesses or ship wrecking there or any other way we can think of to get her there, and having Diana grow up with Donna as a younger sister from a certain age onward.

  14. #239
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    I'm not sure the WWII origin is even the best for WW's character.
    It almost guarantees she didn't leave much of an impact until Superman's debut, so everything else can stay pretty much the same.
    It also makes most of her history a complete blank. It's not like DC will actually expand on her decades being active as a superheroine before the debut of her fellow Leaguers. At most we'll see her alongside the JSA, but nothing that will bring true value to the character aside from the status of being "the first".
    And then there's the problem that it further complicates Donna's best origin (of being an orphan rescued by Diana and adapted by the Amazons), because it only makes sense if Diana is still new to heroing, since she'd have rescued tons of other orphans before Donna was even born and they wouldn't develop a sisterly bond if Diana was old enough to be her grandmother.
    I mean let’s break this down: Diana starting in the Golden Age means she has got decades of experience on her fellow Leaguers. She’s actually been a member of a super team before. In other words there’s no way she wouldn’t become the leader of the Justice League. Batman would be taking orders from her not the other way around. Does anyone see that happening because I don’t. I also don’t see Scott Snyder writing a better WW origin than Greg Rucka. I’m just not interested in starting over from scratch AGAIN.

  15. #240
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I mean let’s break this down: Diana starting in the Golden Age means she has got decades of experience on her fellow Leaguers. She’s actually been a member of a super team before. In other words there’s no way she wouldn’t become the leader of the Justice League. Batman would be taking orders from her not the other way around. Does anyone see that happening because I don’t. I also don’t see Scott Snyder writing a better WW origin than Greg Rucka. I’m just not interested in starting over from scratch AGAIN.
    And this origin seems mostly just to tie her into the JSA then from a natural character perspective.

    I mean, I thought it was an interesting take in Young Justice, but I'm not sure if it'll serve much of a purpose in the current comics.

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