Killua Zoldyck (Hunter X Hunter) vs All Might (My Hero Academia)

[moonknight11]

Alright, let me first just ask for some All Might speedfeats because I feel like you're referencing levels of speed I'm not aware of. I certainly wouldn't have clocked him remotely close to Mach.

Second, this is effectively asking me for a full speed curve breakdown on HunterXHunter and that will take some time to put together. Please hold.

Crossing 5 KM to get to AfO 30 seconds puts him at least half the speed of sound already. Thats of course a lowball as All Might beat up on Nomus and had a conversation before he went to AfO. Those things would eat up a chunk of those 30 seconds.

https://youtu.be/JhUZP4ZjJqA?t=43

Here he crosses hundreds of meters in a fraction of a second. Kind of a non-lethal but vastly more impressive version of Killua's heart grab blitz.

He also just generally causes gusts and gales by punching in a direction.

Edit: Also I forgot to mention this wacky supermanesque sequence, where he kicks off air and before he catches a falling tower, he clears the land, moves animals around, and takes a picture with a fan.

https://imgur.com/a/pqh1NN5

Having someone getting pushed through some buildings and saying "Look his eyeballs didn't explode," is a weird argument to take.

Like if you had him taking a beam to the face or something actually hitting him the eyes, this would feel more believable.

Also, given the speed in question, Killua can actually just bat him around. All Might doesn't weigh more than a regular big dude and start-of-series Killua is capable of shoving 16 ton objects around pretty easily. Killua can just smack him off the ground and keep hitting him and juggling him and stopping him from even getting a ground pound off.

The initial point blank push hit his upper body. The force to destroy multiple skyscrapers hit him dead on. If his eyes were as weak as claimed and somehow with separate durability from his body they would be pulped. Its like trying to come at Superman's eyes.

How would batting All-Might around work? Even if he was fast enough to do that, All Might punches straight ahead at full power. If the ground is in front, he causes a massive shockwave and a crater, if not he whips up a wind storm. He just has to keep punching.

16 tons is nothing here. Not when All-Might can do this and survive his power being turned back on him.

[The Arbiter]

I've got no real interest in the outcome of this fight, but I just wanted to jump in and say I really dont like the "his eyes though" argument in general. Its certainly applicable in some cases, but generally your eyes are not vastly weaker then say, your skin. Just more sensitive.

Like, yes, your eyes ARE less durable then skin but not dozens of times weaker or anything crazy like that. If your attacks bounce off a person's skin, there is not much to suggest they could damage the eyes unless the source material goes on to show them being vulnerable in some way.

Basically my point is, if you cant deal damage... you cant deal damage.

[The Drunkard Kid]

Do we know how well All Might deals with electricity? Because Killua is basically Kaminari on steroids, with his reflexes allegedly being comparable to lightning in his Godspeed mode, since he is using his electrical powers to bypass the chemical aspect of human reflexes, IIRC, and send the signal straight from his already casually bullet-timing/1500-people-blitzing speed brain directly to his limbs at the speed of lightning.

[Nik Hasta]

Crossing 5 KM to get to AfO 30 seconds puts him at least half the speed of sound already. Thats of course a lowball as All Might beat up on Nomus and had a conversation before he went to AfO. Those things would eat up a chunk of those 30 seconds.

Alright, that's travel speed not combat speed for one. Additionally, it's offscreen and the exact timing is somewhat ambiguous so not the strongest piece of evidence.

https://youtu.be/JhUZP4ZjJqA?t=43

Here he crosses hundreds of meters in a fraction of a second. Kind of a non-lethal but vastly more impressive version of Killua's heart grab blitz.

Okay, firstly you've made an odd choice of comparison there because the heart grab feat is done by Killua at a time where he was exponentially weaker and slower than he is currently and before he had godspeed.

So, All Might does something about as impressive as something a version of Killua does before he even unlocked the majority of his powers, including his speed technique. Not really seeing how he's competitive here based on that feat.

Second, that's not "hundreds of metres," it's like fifty tops. The page from the manga gives a clearer indication of the distance:



This is literally the sort of thing that people Killua effortlessly dunks on can do.

He also just generally causes gusts and gales by punching in a direction.

That's a product of his strength rather than his speed and, again, doesn't indicate speed that Killua can't massively exceed.

Edit: Also I forgot to mention this wacky supermanesque sequence, where he kicks off air and before he catches a falling tower, he clears the land, moves animals around, and takes a picture with a fan.

https://imgur.com/a/pqh1NN5

Judging by the art, that's not from MHA. That's from the spin-off series Vigilante: My Hero Academia Illegals that's not written or drawn by Hirokoshi so it's not canon to the main MHA storyline as far as I can tell.

I would be very dubious about building your case on All-Might from something that isn't the primary text.

The initial point blank push hit his upper body. The force to destroy multiple skyscrapers hit him dead on. If his eyes were as weak as claimed and somehow with separate durability from his body they would be pulped. Its like trying to come at Superman's eyes.

How would batting All-Might around work? Even if he was fast enough to do that, All Might punches straight ahead at full power. If the ground is in front, he causes a massive shockwave and a crater, if not he whips up a wind storm. He just has to keep punching.

16 tons is nothing here. Not when All-Might can do this and survive his power being turned back on him.

The point about the sixteen tons thing was less Killua's hitting power and more about his ability to throw and juggle All-Might at will. All-Might can throw punches all he wants, but if he's being thrown around and prevented from directing his attacks to somewhere where Killua is then it's pointless.

As I said from the outset, I'm not denying that his durability is massive and Killua is going to have to wear him down but All-Might lacks the speed to even remotely keep up with him and garner an effective offensive game.

With regards to Killua's attack power, he's capable of physically rending metahumanly durable monsters to pieces with his bare hands and claws with ease. I think, for example, if he uses Godspeed to zip in and do a bunch of attacks on All-Might's eyes then that's going to compromise his vision and hurt him.

Sidebar: Are we considering All-Might's injury as a weak spot in this? That's could be an avenue for Killua to do damage.

[Nik Hasta]

I'll give a breakdown of the important Killua speed feats in context later on today.

Reviewing the relevant materials has been very useful, Killua is exceptionally fast.

[The Drunkard Kid]

I'm pretty sure that at least the broad strokes of the Vigilantes stories are canon, since they show the origins of Stain, and introduced Eraserhead's and Present Mic's old partner a little before he got introduced into the recent arc of MHA, referencing the very important events of Vigilantes. That speed feat did seem significant greater than anything else that we've seen for All Might or a Deku who is about to use All For One at full capacity yet, though.

[moonknight11]

Alright, that's travel speed not combat speed for one. Additionally, it's offscreen and the exact timing is somewhat ambiguous so not the strongest piece of evidence.

Traveling 5 KM in at least less than 30 seconds in a city still requires speed.

Killua is gonna need demonstrated travel speed feats to clear 100 feet before the superhumanly fast All Might can punch the ground.

Okay, firstly you've made an odd choice of comparison there because the heart grab feat is done by Killua at a time where he was exponentially weaker and slower than he is currently and before he had godspeed.

So, All Might does something about as impressive as something a version of Killua does before he even unlocked the majority of his powers, including his speed technique. Not really seeing how he's competitive here based on that feat.

Second, that's not "hundreds of metres," it's like fifty tops. The page from the manga gives a clearer indication of the distance:

Idk that's a massive stair case and there is still a distance from the foot of it to where bad guys are. The Anime may have made it seem bigger than the manga.

No, I posted a feat that vastly exceeds a Killua speed feat. Killua will need to catch up with his subsequent power ups. Which he probably does.

This is literally the sort of thing that people Killua effortlessly dunks on can do.

Like who? Youpi? Cause that's what Killua is fighting here, a far more physically powerful Youpi with AOE, that extends far further than Youpis explosion.

That's a product of his strength rather than his speed and, again, doesn't indicate speed that Killua can't massively exceed.

Its both. His strength enables him to move his limbs fast enough to cause shockwaves, to propel himself through air via shockwaves, to move so fast that in the movie (that the author has said connects to the manga) he moves at mach speeds and reacts at that speed. He's got the speed, Killua has to be fast enough to not die immediately and even then its a losing strategy.

Judging by the art, that's not from MHA. That's from the spin-off series Vigilante: My Hero Academia Illegals that's not written or drawn by Hirokoshi so it's not canon to the main MHA storyline as far as I can tell.

I would be very dubious about building your case on All-Might from something that isn't the primary text.

Spinoff manga set in the exact same universe sounds pretty canon to me. Does wolverine no longer get feats from say an Avengers series since its not in his solo or x-books?

The point about the sixteen tons thing was less Killua's hitting power and more about his ability to throw and juggle All-Might at will. All-Might can throw punches all he wants, but if he's being thrown around and prevented from directing his attacks to somewhere where Killua is then it's pointless.

Again why does he need to do that when punching in any direction can throw up a 360 gale of wind around him, or even worse?

As I said from the outset, I'm not denying that his durability is massive and Killua is going to have to wear him down but All-Might lacks the speed to even remotely keep up with him and garner an effective offensive game.

With regards to Killua's attack power, he's capable of physically rending metahumanly durable monsters to pieces with his bare hands and claws with ease. I think, for example, if he uses Godspeed to zip in and do a bunch of attacks on All-Might's eyes then that's going to compromise his vision and hurt him.

Sidebar: Are we considering All-Might's injury as a weak spot in this? That's could be an avenue for Killua to do damage.

He doesnt have the oomph to do any of that. All Might's strength and durability are physically leagues above any HXH character, even the weak spot has only been used by All Might's peers (the nomu).


BTW we have actual numbers for godspeed Killua's running speed as 150 MPH so clearing 100 feet before All Might can punch is not gonna happen.

I think Killua's reactions/combat speed are a lot higher, but he needs the travel speed to get to All Might in the first place.

[Nik Hasta]

I'll give a breakdown of the important Killua speed feats in context later on today.

Reviewing the relevant materials has been very useful, Killua is exceptionally fast.

So, you might have noticed that this didn't happen.

I stalled on this and the thread in general for a couple reasons.

1) Rereading Hunter X Hunter for the feats reminded me of how boring a lot of it is. A lot of it is really good but also a lot of it is just skin-rendingly dull. I was reading parts of it and just... argh - I really hate the Greed Island arc a whole lot. Which is problematic because Killua does a whole bunch of stuff in there and actually starts actively building his feats.

2) General COVID related anxieties has left me feeling a bit less than my usual in terms of doing things in my spare time that require busy work like reading the worst arc in HxH.

I'll concede the argument, All Might's speed feats still don't feel particularly strong to me (I feel that the Vigilantes one especially needs a big pinch of salt) but Killua has his own incongruities to his speed algorithm as well so it's hardly cut and dry.

Reviewing some stuff though, I also noted a more pertinent fact to the argument that Killua can't actually use godspeed for that long because it burns through his stored electricity and Nen very quickly. Quite apart from the speed debate, I don't see Killua being able to use that form to maintain his speed advantage long enough to reasonably hurt or really impede All-Might.

Eventually he slows, even with his ridiculous normal stamina and speed, he's not winning here.

[The Drunkard Kid]

Actually, does All Might have any defense from Killua just flaring his aura and paralyzing him? That worked just fine on protagonist-level willpower of the likes of Gon and Killua himself, before the two of them learned how to use Nen themselves, and he should be able to do that at least as fast as he could activate Godspeed/Whirlwind.

[Nik Hasta]

Actually, does All Might have any defense from Killua just flaring his aura and paralyzing him? That worked just fine on protagonist-level willpower of the likes of Gon and Killua himself, before the two of them learned how to use Nen themselves, and he should be able to do that at least as fast as he could activate Godspeed/Whirlwind.

This in reference to the whole Nen barrier thing that Hisoka did in the Tower arc, right?

I think All-Might is durable and strong enough that he just shouldn't care.

[Captain Morgan]

This in reference to the whole Nen barrier thing that Hisoka did in the Tower arc, right?

I think All-Might is durable and strong enough that he just shouldn't care.

Nah I think it is more what Illumi and Zushi did. Well, Hisoka did it too maybe but the others were more explicitly a mental effect.

[TheRay]

*I* could probably wreck All Might in a straight fight.

Per the rules you have to make this thread now.