Should Wanda Maximoff (Scarlet Witch stand trial for House of M ?

[Lucyinthesky]

Mike Carey didn´t write Wanda as an evil character imo, more like slighty unstable and afraid of doing again a hex of that magnitude because things could be left a lot worse, also endangered species ends with the beggining of the messiah trilogy so you could argue Wanda´s talk about time was referring to things getting better without her participation on them, this is in part why I really didn´t think her fighting the phoenix made sense in AvX because the phoenix was the one who ultimately brought back mutants births but that´s a talk for another time, I think his story ties nicely with Chidren´s Crusade because he wrote her living on Wundagore mountain, given her knowledge on magic I guess Hank talked with her before Dr Doom put his doombot there.



And well I am really tired of this discussion, I would just like for marvel to officially close up this story either by trial, which I don´t really think would solve anything, or by a storyline, given Hickman style in writting I seriously doubt he would bring back a remorseful Wanda just to let her die at zombies hands during a tie in, he likes to build storylines by linking the characters with each other and play a long game, so I think he has plans for Wanda that don´t involve her just being left to die or the X-men hating her and I also think the Avengers side of marvel already know of his plans hence them waiting with her character, with the exception of the Darkhold story which I am sure will address WandaVision series and maybe decimation. Hickman likes his long game but he also respects the stories other writers are doing with the characters so I hope he will put an end to this decimation subplot or at least will address it in a more balanced way than it has been in the past.

[GenericUsername]

She wishes!

She's a murdering witch and she needs to pay for her crimes. Either by death or having a solo written by Guggenheim.

Lol or you wish. Because they haven't resolved this story in any satisfying way in 15 years. Everytime they touch it, it just creates more problems.

What makes you think anything in the future would be any better?

Especially now with comics releases being heavily restricted and weeklies being in danger due to Covid.

With two different offices handling these characters no less. The most you get is now some mutant zombies. Expect the worst. Temper expectations.

[misty101]

Hickman is clearly interested in the plot and is reaching the end goal for the storyline.
He acknowledged the death numbers in House of X, he has Exodus continuously teach about The Pretender and she's now a major plot point in Empyre.

[GenericUsername]

What she did is the major plot point. Not her, herself. She's gone already. Whether or not she appears again is up in the air. But it's likely gonna be no different to how they've treated the character in all these years now. It's likely she's just the plot device to stir the pot again. So you get another 15 years of stories from it. And she doesn't appear again for a while. And with the severe delay in comics, it'll probably be even longer of a span. If comics survives Covid at all.

[CoCoBandz]

What she did is the major plot point. Not her, herself. She's gone already. Whether or not she appears again is up in the air. But it's likely gonna be no different to how they've treated the character in all these years now. It's likely she's just the plot device to stir the pot again. So you get another 15 years of stories from it. And she doesn't appear again for a while. And with the severe delay in comics, it'll probably be even longer of a span. If comics survives Covid at all.

She's gonna resurface in about three months on some random beach eating a glizzy in a bikini like nothing happened.

It's her M.O. at this point. Or at least to the writers that pick her up it is.

[GenericUsername]

She's gonna resurface in about three months on some random beach eating a glizzy in a bikini like nothing happened.

It's her M.O. at this point. Or at least to the writers that pick her up it is.

Three months has never been it after something like this. The first was 7 years. She's gonna be in Darkhold but that has nothing to do with this, and that was delayed. So it likely won't get addressed even for years more.

[ExodusCloak]

She was when Quicksilver got to her to start the whole mess, remember?

Quicksilver was a bloody pool of flesh and bone at the end of HoM. But if you wish to go back to the original sin.
She wasn't when she sought out the life force which was her own idea and choice despite knowing full well there would be consequences.

[ExodusCloak]

No amount of shade the X-Books have thrown at Wanda under Hickman can ever match Mike Carey's impulse to crap on Wanda. "Endangered Species" was just page after page showing that Wanda was evil and what she did was a zillion times worse than we thought, and it ended by heavily suggesting that Wanda was aware of what she'd done and didn't care.

Then when Carey wrote the "No More Humans" OGN, Wanda and Pietro showed up but the X-Men wouldn't let her into the meeting ("she shouldn't even be on school grounds"). That was just before she was retconned out of being a mutant.

I don't really get why the X-writers would pile so much guilt on a character that they almost made it impossible for her ever to be a hero again. I guess it's a combination of short-term thinking along with not really knowing or caring much about the character. But one reason I always come out for the idea of blaming the whole thing on Doom or Chthon or whoever is that stories like "Endangered Species" would, if we consider them canon (I don't consider OOC writing to be canon, others disagree), make it impossible for Wanda to be a hero. Which would be bad and wrong, since she is a hero.

Mike Carey's take on Wanda is what Remenders UA should have been. At least she would have been somewhat usable as a character now. I believe Carey wrote the correct response to witnessing a xenocide

[PhoenixThanos]

Here is how I think Krakoas Quiet Council would vote regarding Wanda:
Charles Xavier (yes), Magneto (no), Apocalypse (yes), Storm (no), Jean Grey (no), Night Crawler (no), Mister Sinister (yes), Mystique (no), Exodus (yes), Sebastion Shaw (yes), Emma Frost (yes). Thoughts ?.
Mystique and Emma Frost were my hardest choices.

[ExodusCloak]

Here is how I think Krakoas Quiet Council would vote regarding Wanda:
Charles Xavier (yes), Magneto (no), Apocalypse (yes), Storm (no), Jean Grey (no), Night Crawler (no), Mister Sinister (yes), Mystique (no), Exodus (yes), Sebastion Shaw (yes), Emma Frost (yes). Thoughts ?.
Mystique and Emma Frost were my hardest choices.

I think the only person who might vote no is Nightcrawler. Magneto isn't blood related to Wanda and he didn't raise her. Storm is yes. Jean is yes. Mystique definite yes

The bus attack and decimation was due to Wanda. Even a nuanced Emma would find it hard to vote no

Yes for guilty yeah?

[Steel Inquisitor]

I think the only person who might vote no is Nightcrawler. Magneto isn't blood related to Wanda and he didn't raise her. Storm is yes. Jean is yes. Mystique definite yes

The bus attack and decimation was due to Wanda. Even a nuanced Emma would find it hard to vote no

Yes for guilty yeah?

The bus attack would have happened without Decimation, the Purifiers have been killing mutant children since God Loves Man Kills. Emma has no moral high ground, she didn't unintentionally do evil things as a villain she did them willingly and had pride in it. It'd be in character for her to do this hypocrisy. She may have shown progress but it's not like she's been punished for her own crimes and she does has a habit of going back to doing villainous things every few years.

[ExodusCloak]

The bus attack would have happened without Decimation, the Purifiers have been killing mutant children since God Loves Man Kills. Emma has no moral high ground, she didn't unintentionally do evil things as a villain she did them willingly and had pride in it. It'd be in character for her to do this hypocrisy. She may have shown progress but it's not like she's been punished for her own crimes and she does has a habit of going back to doing villainous things every few years.

No in fact it is outright stated by Stryker that the bus attack wouldn't have happened had Decimation not given him the opening for it. Nimrod specifically went back in time ar that period because it was the only time he could give Stryker to complete the bus attack.

[gurkle]

No in fact it is outright stated by Stryker that the bus attack wouldn't have happened had Decimation not given him the opening for it. Nimrod specifically went back in time ar that period because it was the only time he could give Stryker to complete the bus attack.

Which brings us back to the fact that if Wanda was guilty of "No More Mutants" then she can never be a hero again, not so much because of what happened in House of M, but the years of misery and horror that X-Men books wrote about after the Decimation happened.

I ain't giving up my favorite Marvel hero because of stuff that happened in books she wasn't in, as a result of something she would never do. If Doom did it or Chthon or whoever, all the Decimation stories are exactly the same (since they had nothing to do with Wanda and would have been the same no matter how it happened) and nothing is lost. If Wanda did it, her fans lose the character. Seems better all around if she didn't do it or if HoM is just dismissed as a writer's mistake.

[The Cool Thatguy]

As I said in the other thread, the sooner Wanda is no longer used as a whipping boy for mutants, the better.

The story that led to House of M was built on both poor canon, and some impressively sexist tropes. (Muh babies are dead! Crazy time!). We have all forgotten that Disassembled started because Janet teased Wanda about her dead kids?

House of M came about because Marvel was pissed they lost X movie rights, and because they didn't quite grasp that a minority metaphor could still have a great number of people while still being a minority (the existence of Africa, for example, does not mean African Americans are not a minority in the US).

All the power losses/deaths should be fixed by now. The less said about House of M, the sooner its forgotten, the better

[The Cool Thatguy]

Which brings us back to the fact that if Wanda was guilty of "No More Mutants" then she can never be a hero again, not so much because of what happened in House of M, but the years of misery and horror that X-Men books wrote about after the Decimation happened.

If the books are gonna blame Wanda for all the misery caused House of M, it'd only be fair to hold Mags and Professor X responsible for all the havoc caused by Onslaught. They paved the way for a near planetary takeover by Zemo, after all