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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvelgirl View Post
    Marvel balances lightheartedness and dark, in what movies did they do this? The thread master is aware that X-men was a different level of Dark incomparable to the MCU.



    We don't have to watch any of these movies not to accept the truth they are Disney films filled with unrealistic limitations and don't get me started on how this movies are short, made, CGI or the cinematography of these films.




    The recent marvel films are spoofy parodies. Comparing them to X-Men in tone and darkness makes MCU look more childish than it need to be.




    Depends on your definition of what you call great.What should be great X-Men. I would not call the reputation that comic movies ares spoofy child only fiction great. What was great was X-Men 1 opening the movie in concentration camps, changing non-comic fans thoughts on superhero stories intellectually, that was great. Marvel is not going to repeat that. Marvel constantly uses humor, stays on the light side and uses CGI as if the movies never had anything mind challenging to say. they don't want you to take the films seriously.
    What is your position on the Disney Fox merger?

  2. #32
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Myth 1: Fox X-men movies had a "darker tone"

    Truth: Fox X-movie occasional touch on something in dark manner than Marvel movie would but Overall tones of Fox and Marvel Superheroes movies are generally the same. Now something like Logan and DoFP are little bit darker movies. Overall stuff they are putting out are not that dissimilar. X3 , X-men Apocalypse, Wolverine Origins, Dark Phoenix, X-1, are not that dissimilar from Marvel except Marvel is way better at action balance. Where Fox was better at meaningful moments. Fox movies had a dark scene here and there not really movies of course Logan and New Mutants are rulebreakers.

    Myth 2: Marvel forces movies to be action comedies

    Truth: Marvel movie tone matches the main character. Your main character is humorous character like Starlord,Spiderman, Antman or snarky character like Iron man,Captain Marvel, Dr Strange you will get more moments of levity compare to Captain America ,Black Panther or Thor movies. Yes those movies had comic side relief in them as well but overall tone of the movies reflect the main character. And since is going to be mention Thor changed tones after the audience didn't respond to first two movies. But anyways the general tone of movie will follow lead characters tone and all Marvel movies with exception Thor 3 follow that part. Just as a test of the theory I bet Black Widow will be more serious in tone because of main character.

    The tone of Marvel movies match the story and the main characters. Storm, Wolverine,Cyclops aren't quippers, The X-men touch on more serious material in some stories. I expect Marvel X-men movies to be more Winter Solider or Black Panther than GotG or Antman and Wasp BUT Marvel movies will always have humor in it so if you don't like clear moments where they play to general audience to have fun and keep them going to these movies well these movies might not be for you but at least you have years of X-men movies to go back and watch. Two movies in superhero genre stand out to me as something you should never do as movie they are Batman V Superman and Dark Phoenix both suffer the same problem they are dull inspired movies despite having real good set action pieces. They are poster children for why Marvel put in comedy in their movies neither of mention before movies are innately bad but both movies had balance problems that levity would help movies be a whole lot more watchable.

  3. #33
    Astonishing Member Grey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Myth 1: Fox X-men movies had a "darker tone"

    Truth: Fox X-movie occasional touch on something in dark manner than Marvel movie would but Overall tones of Fox and Marvel Superheroes movies are generally the same. Now something like Logan and DoFP are little bit darker movies. Overall stuff they are putting out are not that dissimilar. X3 , X-men Apocalypse, Wolverine Origins, Dark Phoenix, X-1, are not that dissimilar from Marvel except Marvel is way better at action balance. Where Fox was better at meaningful moments. Fox movies had a dark scene here and there not really movies of course Logan and New Mutants are rulebreakers.

    Myth 2: Marvel forces movies to be action comedies

    Truth: Marvel movie tone matches the main character. Your main character is humorous character like Starlord,Spiderman, Antman or snarky character like Iron man,Captain Marvel, Dr Strange you will get more moments of levity compare to Captain America ,Black Panther or Thor movies. Yes those movies had comic side relief in them as well but overall tone of the movies reflect the main character. And since is going to be mention Thor changed tones after the audience didn't respond to first two movies. But anyways the general tone of movie will follow lead characters tone and all Marvel movies with exception Thor 3 follow that part. Just as a test of the theory I bet Black Widow will be more serious in tone because of main character.

    The tone of Marvel movies match the story and the main characters. Storm, Wolverine,Cyclops aren't quippers, The X-men touch on more serious material in some stories. I expect Marvel X-men movies to be more Winter Solider or Black Panther than GotG or Antman and Wasp BUT Marvel movies will always have humor in it so if you don't like clear moments where they play to general audience to have fun and keep them going to these movies well these movies might not be for you but at least you have years of X-men movies to go back and watch. Two movies in superhero genre stand out to me as something you should never do as movie they are Batman V Superman and Dark Phoenix both suffer the same problem they are dull inspired movies despite having real good set action pieces. They are poster children for why Marvel put in comedy in their movies neither of mention before movies are innately bad but both movies had balance problems that levity would help movies be a whole lot more watchable.
    You mention Thor as a more serious character but ragbarok was a comedy.

    I completely lost interest in the stakes of the film when Thor jokes to hulk as he sees hela destroying his world.

    All that being said, I do agree that the movie tone and humor tends to match the main character(s). But I think you’re wrong about Thor. They’ve been inconsistent at best.
    Your favorite superhero- the one you visit these forums to talk about. Would they talk to others the way you do on this message board?

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimsmack View Post
    "Human" issues, whereas everything else in comic books are just fiction. Got it.

    There has always been humor in much of the X-Men, for the past couple of decades the focus has been grim for many of the most popular books. It used to be that the X-Men played baseball together, go out for drinks, and laugh a little. X-Men like Nightcrawler and Kitty could keep things lite with their humor - Wolverine could even be depended upon to make a humorous comment. The New Mutants and especially Excalibur were definitely lighter in tone than most of the other books. When New Mutants became X-Force, it definitely got darker as Cable became the focus.


    Since the beginning, the X-Men have always used their younger students/members to draw in younger readers, so I'm not sure how you have interpreted that the series is made only for adults.

    So, while the X-books have been darker than most of the other Marvel titles, it's no Walking Dead.

    And I'm just trying to anticipate how Marvel will handle atmosphere. The X-Men films could potentially out earn the Avengers due to their popularity, and to capitalize, Marvel will make the films family-friendly. They absolutely will. It's how they approach it that makes all the difference - they don't want some awful hybrid like what the Fox films turned into.
    Yeah, I think its kids/teens that really made the X-Men popular and many fans on here started reading them around 10 ish even before (I was 8) or because of the FOX kids show. There have always been darker themed childrens entertainment dealing with human issues since even more "wholesome" 50s times and there have been fun/funny even hopeful films aimed at adults. Let me tell you the 80s had plenty of serious content that kids got involved in not just including comics.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    You mention Thor as a more serious character but ragbarok was a comedy.

    I completely lost interest in the stakes of the film when Thor jokes to hulk as he sees hela destroying his world.

    All that being said, I do agree that the movie tone and humor tends to match the main character(s). But I think you’re wrong about Thor. They’ve been inconsistent at best.
    Way too many sarcastic jabs or jokes. I think that should have been left only to Loki but its not funny with Thor. Simonson had lots of humor in his run but Thor wasn't really the joker it was mostly the supporting cast and some villains that brought the humor. He knew when to balance that and in the MCU films and I think a bit differently on the Thor films and I don't think they did that well. Everyone was a joker and not only a joker but the same style of humor. Inconsistent yes Thor was all over the place and I couldn't care about anything that I was supposed to. Though I didn't like Thor/Avengers oddly enough I liked Dr. Strange, Ant-Man and GotG.
    Last edited by From The Shadows; 03-10-2020 at 04:46 PM.

  6. #36
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    You mention Thor as a more serious character but ragbarok was a comedy.

    I completely lost interest in the stakes of the film when Thor jokes to hulk as he sees hela destroying his world.

    All that being said, I do agree that the movie tone and humor tends to match the main character(s). But I think you’re wrong about Thor. They’ve been inconsistent at best.
    Like I said Thor 1 & 2 was mostly serious with Kat Denning bring the comedy relief. Thor 1 & 2 are probably among worst performing marvel movies at the box office. Thor 3 they changed tone of character and lean more in on comedy. I said it previous comment Thor changed tones after audience didn't respond to the first 2 movies. Thor 3 is the best performing movie out of all of his movies, Thor in avengers 4 is most talk about he has been in movies. People can complain but you got Avenger 1 & 2 and Thor 1 & 2 of a more serious Thor and it didn't work but goofier Thor did but anyways this isn't the topic for it I won't mention it again because I don't want to derail the thread.

    Back on topic I will repeat it again the tone of leads Professor X, Magneto,Wolverine, Cyclops, Storm, Colossus who aren't quippers will lead to general more serious overall movie, The tone of best X-men stories God Love man kills, Days of Future Past,Dark Phoenix, Gifted,E is for Extinction,etc are more serious. I have zero worries the content and characters will lead to something more serious than say Gotg or Antman. That said it will have comedy and I fully expect Iceman, Rogue, Beast and Nightcrawler characters who have upbeat personality to bring levity and fun to X-men movies as well.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frobisher View Post
    Yes! The Foxmen learned really hard into the military industrial complex response to mutants, and while a valid take, there’s way more to mutants than that. Their “otherness” often makes them a conduit into magical planes, like Otherworld and Limbo.
    There have been many supernatural or magical elements, whole stories, devoted to various X-Men. The X-Men and New Mutants in Asgard (Asgardian Wars, great story); X-Men Annual 6 had The All New X-Men (and Kitty) confront Dracula in a memorable issue; Magik in Limbo is always awesome... plus many other, incredible scenarios.

    They could also adopt a 1960's science fiction to it (something the Fantastic Four failed to do). Maybe the X-Men will have met the Shi'ar Empire by the time their introduced?

    I think you're right, Frobisher, that Fox had "... leaned really hard into the military industrial complex response to mutants..." and then had a hard time shaking it.

    There has been talk the mutants/X-Men may make cameo appearances in upcoming MCU films (Black Widow, perhaps?). The X-Men popping up in a Dr. Strange film would be cool (nightcrawler magik sym colossus kitty in limbo).

  8. #38
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Keep it fluid. Let the ideas dictate the tone.

  9. #39
    The Best There Is Wolverine12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Keep it fluid. Let the ideas dictate the tone.
    This times a million. X-Men can do anything and it can still feel “right.”
    You brought back Wolverine

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  10. #40
    Extraordinary Member CRaymond's Avatar
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    Whatever tone was used for Netflix's Umbrella Academy.

  11. #41
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    What I'd the X-Men to be about:
    - Family: with some lighthearted moment. Not necessarily too much joking/humour. This should be the core tone of the movies.
    - Fear and hated: misunderstood, serious with some dark moments.; and
    - Colorful: in terms of costumes and diversity.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    This all day
    Hahaha one of the best comments on this issue.I always found Marvel's contrived levity absurd.Fox did the X-Men well,I want a similar tone.I was thinking Thanos snap combined with Loki's stealing of tesseract is perfect explanation for Wanda style depopulation of Mutants that unlike human population was not restored.Have around 200 mutants like in Messiah Complex, examine a new birth of a mutant or even have Sinister make mutants like they do on Krakoa under Hickman and it piques X-Men interest.That is a winning formula.Keep it serious, high stakes,rich in philosophical/ethical subjects and I think that would actually take Marvel as a natural evolution from the obsession with jokes in almost every take

  13. #43
    Incredible Member Marvelgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Myth 1: Fox X-men movies had a "darker tone"

    Truth: Fox X-movie occasional touch on something in dark manner than Marvel movie would but Overall tones of Fox and Marvel Superheroes movies are generally the same. Now something like Logan and DoFP are little bit darker movies. Overall stuff they are putting out are not that dissimilar. X3 , X-men Apocalypse, Wolverine Origins, Dark Phoenix, X-1, are not that dissimilar from Marvel except Marvel is way better at action balance. Where Fox was better at meaningful moments. Fox movies had a dark scene here and there not really movies of course Logan and New Mutants are rulebreakers.

    Myth 2: Marvel forces movies to be action comedies

    Truth: Marvel movie tone matches the main character. Your main character is humorous character like Starlord,Spiderman, Antman or snarky character like Iron man,Captain Marvel, Dr Strange you will get more moments of levity compare to Captain America ,Black Panther or Thor movies. Yes those movies had comic side relief in them as well but overall tone of the movies reflect the main character. And since is going to be mention Thor changed tones after the audience didn't respond to first two movies. But anyways the general tone of movie will follow lead characters tone and all Marvel movies with exception Thor 3 follow that part. Just as a test of the theory I bet Black Widow will be more serious in tone because of main character.

    The tone of Marvel movies match the story and the main characters. Storm, Wolverine,Cyclops aren't quippers, The X-men touch on more serious material in some stories. I expect Marvel X-men movies to be more Winter Solider or Black Panther than GotG or Antman and Wasp BUT Marvel movies will always have humor in it so if you don't like clear moments where they play to general audience to have fun and keep them going to these movies well these movies might not be for you but at least you have years of X-men movies to go back and watch. T.
    A complete myth that marvel's tone matches the main characters. Starlord, Thor and Tony Stark don't use too much humor in the comics. The annoying let down of Marvel is the humor has over ridden everything. The humor has gotten more senile than their generic plots.

    More truth lies on X-Men touching more on serious material that MCU has shown to be deliberately ignoring since it affect's the tone of their movies. X2 is slightly darker than Days of future Past. We used to be fine with this film until the recent complaints from millennials that X2 was too depressing. Now days of future past and logan are too dark and could use more fun? Who is telling you people this nonsense, Bob Iger?
    wo movies in superhero genre stand out to me as something you should never do as movie they are Batman V Superman and Dark Phoenix both suffer the same problem they are dull inspired movies despite having real good set action pieces. They are poster children for why Marvel put in comedy in their movies neither of mention before movies are innately bad but both movies had balance problems that levity would help movies be a whole lot more watchable
    Put this more as myth than truth. Dark Phoenix and Batman v Superman problems were not humor. These films are vastly inferior to other films. if they are the poster child of why marvel puts in humor how comes other Batman and X-Men films showed you don't need the marvel humor.


    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    You mention Thor as a more serious character but ragbarok was a comedy.

    I completely lost interest in the stakes of the film when Thor jokes to hulk as he sees hela destroying his world.

    All that being said, I do agree that the movie tone and humor tends to match the main character(s). But I think youÂ’re wrong about Thor. TheyÂ’ve been inconsistent at best.
    Finally someone who is not placing myth as truth or truth as myth. Its norse mythological futile to argue Raganrok is a comedy, unless you deliberately set out to make a paraody.

    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    Whatever tone was used for Netflix's Umbrella Academy.
    Bring it closer to home. How quick are you to forget marvel once had shows on netflix.
    Last edited by Marvelgirl; 03-11-2020 at 02:13 AM.

  14. #44
    Jubilant Member Dementia5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Keep it fluid. Let the ideas dictate the tone.
    Pretty much this, but I’d also like the tone to be a bit lighter overall. If it gets too dark I tend to shy away. I don’t watch movies or read comics to get depressed or disturbed, that’s what real life is for. IMO comics are not supposed to be like real life, they’re supposed to be an escape from it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Yer bonkers and you need a sandwich.

  15. #45
    Fantastic Member Foon4000's Avatar
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    GIVE ME SENTINELS OR GIVE ME DEATH.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    You mention Thor as a more serious character but ragbarok was a comedy.

    I completely lost interest in the stakes of the film when Thor jokes to hulk as he sees hela destroying his world.

    All that being said, I do agree that the movie tone and humor tends to match the main character(s). But I think you’re wrong about Thor. They’ve been inconsistent at best.
    Chris Hemsworth is a good comedic actor but a bleh serious actor. Ragnarock played to his strengths as Thor and to the inherent ridiculousness of the MCU Thor-verse. The same for Chris Pratt in GOTG.

    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    Whatever tone was used for Netflix's Umbrella Academy.
    Omega take: get the team behind HBO's Watchmen. Now. Lock them down in a bunker before they go off to other work. Watchmen was everything an X-men-on-screen should be.

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