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  1. #1
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    Default Lois Lane issue #10 spoiler discussion

    Crazy how I've heard no one talk about this issue yet. It's pretty damn wild.

    This whole run has been a slow burn, and its chosen subject matter has been hit or miss in terms of what I wanted this book to be, but this issue kind tied it all together in such a way that I'm anticipating the hell out of the next two issues.

    What Lois has been working on since Action Comics 1001 finally has and idea to it, and also some fitting scale to warrant such a drastic shift in her personal life. This book is like low key one of the most important books coming out of DC right now in terms of what it's lining up with.

    Renee floats an idea about Lois out there that adds a lot of intrigue to the book and what happened out in space.
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!" - The Digger

    We walk on the path to Secher Nbiw. Though hard fought, we walk the Golden Path.

  2. #2
    Invincible Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Woah that was a crazy turn from what I expected the book to be. Odd how important the multiverse is to a lot of the Superbooks. Sadly I don’t think this is a series that will be able to stand on its own, as opposed to Jimmy Olsen, it’s too tied up in DC’s current continuity. Still entertaining for me though.

  3. #3
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    I keep reading this book, but I can't say it's quite clicking in the way I was hoping it would. It reads too much like Rucka trying to bring back his old characters that were wiped out by the New 52 rather than a compelling comic that stands on its own. I was really hoping that this title could be something that I could gift to people to show them how cool Lois Lane is. Unfortunately, it has ended up being a cautionary tale of allowing a writer to crawl up his own *** and satisfy his own needs rather than the reader's.

  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Electricmastro's Avatar
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    Interesting discussion on the Multiverse:


  5. #5
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    I keep reading this book, but I can't say it's quite clicking in the way I was hoping it would. It reads too much like Rucka trying to bring back his old characters that were wiped out by the New 52 rather than a compelling comic that stands on its own. I was really hoping that this title could be something that I could gift to people to show them how cool Lois Lane is. Unfortunately, it has ended up being a cautionary tale of allowing a writer to crawl up his own *** and satisfy his own needs rather than the reader's.
    Rucka has commented that he will always return to DC to write Diana, Renee and Kate, and I'm sorry to say it does feel like he's using Lois Lane's book to write about Renee again.

    It's a shame. This book feels like it's trying to serve a lot of different masters and Lois is the glue holding it together, but I do wish this was Lois Lane's book and not Rucka indulging himself. :/

    Perhaps I'm being overly mean, but I wanted the world's greatest investigative reporter doing all this stuff, not Renee.

  6. #6
    Extraordinary Member Caivu's Avatar
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    I've been sorta souring on Rucka in general for a while. Whether he means to or not, he's made some recent-ish comments that come off as him dissing the direction that certain DC characters he's had a big hand in have gone after his time. Directions that have not only been widely praised and almost universally loved, but seem to flow naturally from what he set up, making his objections puzzling. It feels like really weird sour grapes on his part, like he doesn't want to play nice with what others have done to "his" characters, and will just rewrite whatever he doesn't like because he can.

    I agree with Bored at Robanker that this miniseries has increasingly been a manifestation of that sort of attitude.
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  7. #7
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    I like what this book is leading up/trying to sell but I have grown increasingly frustrated as it's featured/become less and less about Lois Lane. Ugh!

  8. #8
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpmaluki View Post
    I like what this book is leading up/trying to sell but I have grown increasingly frustrated as it's featured/become less and less about Lois Lane. Ugh!
    Glad to see others feel that way. I only wish Rucka liked Lois Lane more. I was super excited when he was announced as the writer but my heart sank when the solicit of issue two mentioned Gotham because I saw this coming.

    The book hasn't been bad, but each issue it just feels like it's slipping further and further away from Lois.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Rucka has commented that he will always return to DC to write Diana, Renee and Kate, and I'm sorry to say it does feel like he's using Lois Lane's book to write about Renee again.

    It's a shame. This book feels like it's trying to serve a lot of different masters and Lois is the glue holding it together, but I do wish this was Lois Lane's book and not Rucka indulging himself. :/

    Perhaps I'm being overly mean, but I wanted the world's greatest investigative reporter doing all this stuff, not Renee.
    On one hand I totally see that argument, but on the other I gotta think that to be the world's greatest reporter, you've got to have the world's greatest sources and the world's greatest fixers or fact-finders. In this context Renee has proven to be something more akin to combination liaison, assistant, fixer, and bodyguard, but she's a jack of all trades as we know. Plus I find no fault at all in combining the narrative theme nature of The Question with Lois Lane because like I thought out loud when this book was announced ... I can't believe that connection has been made as rarely in DCU history as it has (with the I want to say Rick Veidt Question run featuring a lot of Superman on the covers and in the books, but that being a four-issue miniseries and like ... the only? time that's ever happened outside an Event?).

    Montoya herself might be the GCPD cop with the odd Multiversal insight but The Question was a news reporter, just like Lois. News Reporter turned vigilante corresponds so insanely well to News Reporter married to News Reporter Vigilante. Arguments have to vary of course about whether you call Superman a vigilante. There's something about his methodology that doesn't track with pure vigilantism, but then in real life there's plenty of vigilantes who didn't even feel the need for secret identities. I'm getting off track.

    I think finding very good people to work with who are also good at digging into information is probably a very fine trait for a top level reporter to have. Plus Renee makes a really valuable source because ... well, she's probably REALLY keen on keeping her identity out of the papers, so Lois gets to take all of the credit for the scoop. Being faceless has its pros and cons, as Charlie taught back in 52. We might all presume that in some never-to-occur future where Perry White has retired or died, that Lois Lane becomes "The Boss" at the Daily Planet, and knowing who to use for these sorts of things indicates good Editor instincts as well.

    Actually that's a really keen thing for using Renee to tie back to the themes with as well. Lois is a superhero with no secret identity. She doesn't just have a face, she has one of the most recognizable faces in the DCU. It's pretty explicit in this book that it's a theme. Her bodyguard has "no face" and her would-be assassin seems to REALLY have no face. Renee takes her face off to operate in the shadows and the Kiss of Death lives in the shadows and has to put a face on to operate in the light.

    Lois is the light, the truth, the story, the news, is the light. The shadows are all lies, untruths, deceptions. That sort of stuff.

    I have completely missed that Clarice is The Radiant through this entire thing. It's been a hot minute since I read Revelations. Between Lois Lane and Wonder Woman Rucka has given us updates on Renee, Jessica Midnight, Sasha Bordeaux, and the Radiant. Steve Trevor maintains plenty of usage. Bendis is attempting to revamp King Standish. Somebody will probably hopefully remember that Dick Grayson and Helena Bertinelli are top level spies. There's an incredibly strong central Checkmate cast stepping into the picture.
    Last edited by K. Jones; 05-14-2020 at 05:26 AM.
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  10. #10
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    I also forgot to bring up that Renee's supposition that Lois isn't even the right Lois tracks with Superman Reborn.

    It's all shenanigans. But Rebirth-era is an extension of New 52-era, readjusted and course-corrected by Dr. Manhattan in real-time. Because Superman told him to.

    Superman and Lois are still Pre-Flashpoint, having through super-heroics managed to avoid the timeline reboot of Flashpoint, avoided the Trash Bin reset of Convergence, which basically resulted in a Quantum split of their very selves, where Historically Accurate New 52 versions of them had to be created from complete nothing (unlike other characters who Time-Shifted) to fill the void, who they raised a boy in secret while observing, stepped in for in the wake of seemingly tragic events, then realized thanks to the Mxyzptlk factor they had to Reintegrate with historically to fix things. Regardless of how ludicrous that series of events is ...

    Renee having multiversal awareness that Lois might not even be the right Lois is still pretty accurate, since for all intents and purposes Lois & Clark are still very much the Post-Crisis, Pre-Flashpoint Lois & Clark, changed absolutely the least.

    But that seems to be the gist of it, a bit, too! Renee, Midnight and the Radiant seem to be "catching up" to Lois & Clark, re-merging to some degree with their Pre-Flashpoint selves. There's been hints of this in other titles as well, as Stephanie and Cass get a glimpse of their Batgirl phases (I guess Brother Eye comes from there as well?). I'm sure there's other examples.
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  11. #11
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K. Jones View Post
    On one hand I totally see that argument, but on the other I gotta think that to be the world's greatest reporter, you've got to have the world's greatest sources and the world's greatest fixers or fact-finders. In this context Renee has proven to be something more akin to combination liaison, assistant, fixer, and bodyguard, but she's a jack of all trades as we know. Plus I find no fault at all in combining the narrative theme nature of The Question with Lois Lane because like I thought out loud when this book was announced ... I can't believe that connection has been made as rarely in DCU history as it has (with the I want to say Rick Veidt Question run featuring a lot of Superman on the covers and in the books, but that being a four-issue miniseries and like ... the only? time that's ever happened outside an Event?).

    Montoya herself might be the GCPD cop with the odd Multiversal insight but The Question was a news reporter, just like Lois. News Reporter turned vigilante corresponds so insanely well to News Reporter married to News Reporter Vigilante. Arguments have to vary of course about whether you call Superman a vigilante. There's something about his methodology that doesn't track with pure vigilantism, but then in real life there's plenty of vigilantes who didn't even feel the need for secret identities. I'm getting off track.

    I think finding very good people to work with who are also good at digging into information is probably a very fine trait for a top level reporter to have. Plus Renee makes a really valuable source because ... well, she's probably REALLY keen on keeping her identity out of the papers, so Lois gets to take all of the credit for the scoop. Being faceless has its pros and cons, as Charlie taught back in 52. We might all presume that in some never-to-occur future where Perry White has retired or died, that Lois Lane becomes "The Boss" at the Daily Planet, and knowing who to use for these sorts of things indicates good Editor instincts as well.

    Actually that's a really keen thing for using Renee to tie back to the themes with as well. Lois is a superhero with no secret identity. She doesn't just have a face, she has one of the most recognizable faces in the DCU. It's pretty explicit in this book that it's a theme. Her bodyguard has "no face" and her would-be assassin seems to REALLY have no face. Renee takes her face off to operate in the shadows and the Kiss of Death lives in the shadows and has to put a face on to operate in the light.

    Lois is the light, the truth, the story, the news, is the light. The shadows are all lies, untruths, deceptions. That sort of stuff.

    I have completely missed that Clarice is The Radiant through this entire thing. It's been a hot minute since I read Revelations. Between Lois Lane and Wonder Woman Rucka has given us updates on Renee, Jessica Midnight, Sasha Bordeaux, and the Radiant. Steve Trevor maintains plenty of usage. Bendis is attempting to revamp King Standish. Somebody will probably hopefully remember that Dick Grayson and Helena Bertinelli are top level spies. There's an incredibly strong central Checkmate cast stepping into the picture.
    Sure, and I gave it that benefit of the doubt, but I wanted to read about Lois Lane and now she's just become the glue holding Rucka's pet projects together. If they wanted it to be a Lois/Question team-up, I'd prefer it billed as such.

    Sources are one thing. Renee's involvement has gone well beyond that point. Since Lois is a favorite of mine and I really wanted this to be her book, it sucks that she got upstaged in her own title by the creator's pet.

    Imagine if Wonder Woman got upstaged by a writer's pet project and started doing things Diana could, but instead they did to build them up at the title character's expense. That was Jason under Robinson. This isn't that bad, but by now it almost feels like Lois is a guest in her own book and I'm at the point where I don't think I want Rucka sticking around for more.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member Yoda's Avatar
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    I don't think its that Rucka doesn't care about Lois Lane, he's written her exceptionally well in the past and during the New 52 he was one of the few creators to criticize how DC was misusing her. He definitely gets her. The Sam Lane funeral issue is probably one of the best Lois character pieces ever.

    I think there are a few issues. One, this book was intended to be an ongoing and Daily Planet focused. And while he obviously reworked it into Lois' book, he has not really indicated anywhere that his original arcs were reworked into a 12 part miniseries. In fact, he hasn't actually reworked any of it to even account for Bendis' decision to reveal the ID. I think what we are getting is essentially the first two arcs of what he intended to be an ongoing Lois Lane book. So the slightly diluted focus on Lois in the second arc, possibly intended to set up an ongoing supporting cast for her, is understandable. If we weren't in the final quarter of the series, I honestly would not mind building out the cast like he has in the last few issues.

    Another issue here is that Rucka wanted to write a "real" journalism book, which is probably too limited for what people actually want out of a Lois book. She's a "real" journalist, but she's a real journalist in the DCU. He's said she's not going to be throwing punches, etc. a few times, but honestly - Lois does throw punches. I don't like her fighting the Furys, but Lois traditionally has had no issue getting her hands dirty. Looking back at his Adventures of Superman, she was much more active in getting her stories - doing a lot of the leg work that has been delegated to Renee here. The "sitting in a room" writing a book angle is the set up that was kind of imposed on him, but I think it's one he liked because of the journalism angle. I think he wanted to have her be a "serious" journalist, but took that a little too far.

    All that said, I do still like the book quite a bit. It remains one of the better written DC books month to month. I think this second arc just has lost the focus on Lois.
    Last edited by Yoda; 05-14-2020 at 08:09 AM.

  13. #13
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caivu View Post
    I've been sorta souring on Rucka in general for a while. Whether he means to or not, he's made some recent-ish comments that come off as him dissing the direction that certain DC characters he's had a big hand in have gone after his time. Directions that have not only been widely praised and almost universally loved, but seem to flow naturally from what he set up, making his objections puzzling. It feels like really weird sour grapes on his part, like he doesn't want to play nice with what others have done to "his" characters, and will just rewrite whatever he doesn't like because he can.
    I know he was critical of making Kate Bruce's cousin, so I wonder if he'd either ignore it or just not address it much if he were to ever write Batwoman again.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Imagine if Wonder Woman got upstaged by a writer's pet project and started doing things Diana could, but instead they did to build them up at the title character's expense. That was Jason under Robinson. This isn't that bad, but by now it almost feels like Lois is a guest in her own book and I'm at the point where I don't think I want Rucka sticking around for more.
    I mean, Rucka had some creators pets in his WW run (Veronica Cale as a Big Bad, Sasha Bordeaux although she didn't really do much, and Ferdinand needing to be the one to bring Diana to sanity instead of herself)...

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member Yoda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    What Lois has been working on since Action Comics 1001 finally has and idea to it, and also some fitting scale to warrant such a drastic shift in her personal life. This book is like low key one of the most important books coming out of DC right now in terms of what it's lining up with.

    Renee floats an idea about Lois out there that adds a lot of intrigue to the book and what happened out in space.
    Quote Originally Posted by K. Jones View Post
    I also forgot to bring up that Renee's supposition that Lois isn't even the right Lois tracks with Superman Reborn.

    It's all shenanigans. But Rebirth-era is an extension of New 52-era, readjusted and course-corrected by Dr. Manhattan in real-time. Because Superman told him to.
    This was a kinda crazy thing to casually drop. I agree it likely ties into the whole Reborn merging and likely a lot more into Doomsday Clock. I had assumed that when Bendis said he knew the end of Doomsday Clock and that some of the stuff in his book would make sense once we saw it he was talking about Manhattan and Jor El. But it might be he was talking about Lois and what she learned from Luthor about the timelines. Because that all plays into this quite a bit, and generally nothing has been done with that. It's also interesting that way back in Man of Steel he had Jon concerned about evil timelines and Clark reassuring him that those weren't actually him. Luthor's visit to Lois way back in Action 1003 also likely ties into all this as well and what they learned about the metaverse in Doomsday Clock. She said I think way back in issue five that only two or three other people knew what she was going to tell Renee. It's now obvious that she was talking about Luthor and the Metaverse.

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member superduperman's Avatar
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    I dropped this after the funeral issue because it was dependent on reading every other DC book just to follow what was going on. This is going to look ridiculous five/ten years from now when it's trade released and nobody even remembers what Leviathan was. Which is a shame because Rucka is a great writers and the art is spectacular. But time will not be kind to this series.
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