Has There Been A Justice League Run Similar To New Avengers by Bendis?

[charliehustle415]

So, stay with me here; I know some hate Bendis but I personally love his early Marvel works especially New Avengers it revitalized the entire line and without it we would not have the MCU.

It was an approachable run that didn't have the baggage of 50 years of continuity, I mean it is in the title New Avengers it introduced new characters to the line up as well as mega epic events.

So, has there been a run like that similar for the DC universe?

The few that come to mind are Morrison's JLA run, I didn't read it as it was being published so I do not know if it caught fire like New Avengers did and I don't know how much it affected the DC universe as a whole. Then there is Justice League of America by Meltzer which really opened up the roster, but again I don't know how much it affected the zeitgeist.

The only thing that I can think of is not even a comic run it is the Justice League animated series that really stuck in people's minds and affected the books.

So, anyone else have any ideas?

[MRP]

Well there was the launch of Justice League by Giffen/DeMatteis/MAguire in '87 coming on the heels of the 4 issue arc that ended JLof A which in some ways was a disassembled type arc. It was a clean slate for the League, and introduced members that hadn't been associated with the League before (Beetle, Booster, Guy Gardner, etc. mirroring the addition of Wolverine & Spider-Man as newbies in New Avengers) with some core League members (Batman, Martian Manhunter, Canary), and put the team front and center in the post-Legends DCU and the events that followed (Millennium, Invasion, etc.).

-M

[Riv86672]

Well there was the launch of Justice League by Giffen/DeMatteis/MAguire in '87 coming on the heels of the 4 issue arc that ended JLof A which in some ways was a disassembled type arc. It was a clean slate for the League, and introduced members that hadn't been associated with the League before (Beetle, Booster, Guy Gardner, etc. mirroring the addition of Wolverine & Spider-Man as newbies in New Avengers) with some core League members (Batman, Martian Manhunter, Canary), and put the team front and center in the post-Legends DCU and the events that followed (Millennium, Invasion, etc.).

-M

That’s a good comparison.
If you read the LEGENDS mini series, and the first few issues of that JL book, it seemed like it was going to be a fairly serious take on the team. The humor was present but not the main focus.
Nowadays that humor is what most ppl remember, but it took some time for it to set in.

[Ascended]

Have you tried the McDuffie run that, if I remember right, followed Meltzer? I think Meltzer is probably as close to a Bendis Avengers as you're gonna find. I thought it was solid, but not really as grand in scope as I'd like. McDuffie's run seemed like it was full of promise, and it was solid (I mean, it's McDuffie) but it felt like he never pushed things as far as they should have gone, it felt like he was being limited by editorial or something (and, I believe, he actually was?). Still a fun run though.

[charliehustle415]

Well there was the launch of Justice League by Giffen/DeMatteis/MAguire in '87 coming on the heels of the 4 issue arc that ended JLof A which in some ways was a disassembled type arc. It was a clean slate for the League, and introduced members that hadn't been associated with the League before (Beetle, Booster, Guy Gardner, etc. mirroring the addition of Wolverine & Spider-Man as newbies in New Avengers) with some core League members (Batman, Martian Manhunter, Canary), and put the team front and center in the post-Legends DCU and the events that followed (Millennium, Invasion, etc.).

-M

Never read that, I'm going to have to take a look at it.

Do you think it changed the larger DC Universe though?

Think about the changes to Iron Man & Captain America and how that permeated throughout the Marvel Universe

Have you tried the McDuffie run that, if I remember right, followed Meltzer? I think Meltzer is probably as close to a Bendis Avengers as you're gonna find. I thought it was solid, but not really as grand in scope as I'd like. McDuffie's run seemed like it was full of promise, and it was solid (I mean, it's McDuffie) but it felt like he never pushed things as far as they should have gone, it felt like he was being limited by editorial or something (and, I believe, he actually was?). Still a fun run though.

I wonder if DC editorial would even allow for a major change that Bendis did with the Avengers.

[MRP]

Never read that, I'm going to have to take a look at it.

Do you think it changed the larger DC Universe though?

Think about the changes to Iron Man & Captain America and how that permeated throughout the Marvel Universe

It was a period of reshaping the DCU as a whole in the wave of Crisis on Infinite Earths and Legends. While the League wasn't the epicenter of those changes, what was happening there was part of the foundation they were building at that time. It was also a sales success and led to a lot of spin-off titles, and the popularity of Mr. Miracle in the title (and of Darkseid in Legends) were part of the renaissance of the Fourth World stuff after it had been mostly dormant in the DCU for a long time. That in turn led to things like Cosmic Odyssey and other series featuring the Fourth World, and the resurgence of Darkseid and the Fourth World mythos had as big an impact (if not bigger) on the larger DCU than the changes to Cap and Shellhead did on the MU. The League book wasn't the only factor in that, but putting Scott Free, Barda and Oberon front and center in that book (and Mister Miracle getting his own spin-off book because of that) were a large part of that resurgence.

-M

[Ascended]

I wonder if DC editorial would even allow for a major change that Bendis did with the Avengers.

I mean, the formula still works and makes money, so probably not no. At least not for long. They'll allow some variation around the Morrison archetype, but anything that gets too far out ends up being a B title.

But the formula works, so why would they want to change it? When it stops working? DC will happily try something different.

And actually, if I remember right the League hadn't been doing so hot before Morrison took over (much like Bendis right?) so what Morrison did *was* a pretty big change and reset.

[charliehustle415]

I mean, the formula still works and makes money, so probably not no. At least not for long. They'll allow some variation around the Morrison archetype, but anything that gets too far out ends up being a B title.

But the formula works, so why would they want to change it? When it stops working? DC will happily try something different.

And actually, if I remember right the League hadn't been doing so hot before Morrison took over (much like Bendis right?) so what Morrison did *was* a pretty big change and reset.

Totally agree, Morrison changed the game; however, his JLA didn't steer the ship the other titles informed his run for example when lighting Superman showed up or when Hippolyta became Wonder Woman

New Avengers was the spine of the Marvel Universe for a long time.

[Riv86672]

Have you tried the McDuffie run that, if I remember right, followed Meltzer? I think Meltzer is probably as close to a Bendis Avengers as you're gonna find. I thought it was solid, but not really as grand in scope as I'd like. McDuffie's run seemed like it was full of promise, and it was solid (I mean, it's McDuffie) but it felt like he never pushed things as far as they should have gone, it felt like he was being limited by editorial or something (and, I believe, he actually was?). Still a fun run though.

CBR actually covers McDuffie’s run and the frustration he went through in a few articles...

https://www.cbr.com/meta-messages-dw...ce-league/amp/

[LifeIsILL]

Giffen and DeMatteis Justice League America and Justice League Europe.

The whole Justice League run before Morrison took over was pretty underrated if you ask me.

[Riv86672]

And actually, if I remember right the League hadn't been doing so hot before Morrison took over (much like Bendis right?) so what Morrison did *was* a pretty big change and reset.

It kinda was, yeah.

Thing is, Marvel and DC are fundamentally different.
A Bendis style team really would be seen as a B team, and likely not sell.
Bendis took Wolverine and Spider-Man and that worked because they’re two of Marvel’s most popular characters and were never Avengers. It was a shake up.
At DC, their most popular characters have been part of the Big 7 for decades. There’s no shaking that.

[Ascended]

Totally agree, Morrison changed the game; however, his JLA didn't steer the ship the other titles informed his run for example when lighting Superman showed up or when Hippolyta became Wonder Woman

New Avengers was the spine of the Marvel Universe for a long time.

That's true, Morrison didn't get to set the status quo for the individuals. But like Riv says, the companies are different animals in this regard. At the time Morrison was doing JLA, Superman alone had 5 ongoing solo titles. The characters were DC's biggest brands, so of course their solo titles took precedence. But the Avengers weren't treated like that until the MCU, so Bendis being the big name he was on a big-ish book, of course he got more control.

[charliehustle415]

It kinda was, yeah.

Thing is, Marvel and DC are fundamentally different.
A Bendis style team really would be seen as a B team, and likely not sell.
Bendis took Wolverine and Spider-Man and that worked because they’re two of Marvel’s most popular characters and were never Avengers. It was a shake up.
At DC, their most popular characters have been part of the Big 7 for decades. There’s no shaking that.

That's a good point, the New Avengers members were not big names until Bendis. So I guess the next logical question what can cause a big shake up in the Justice League?

Maybe have the Trinity with a rotating cast of A-List DC heroes? Especially now with the CWDCverse? Maybe throw in more of the Bat-family in the ranks?

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

I wonder if DC editorial would even allow for a major change that Bendis did with the Avengers.

A major change in what regard? To the lineup?

[H-E-D]

Bendis' Avengers run was good up until the start of the Heroic Age. He should have exited after Siege.