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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by K7P5V View Post
    How about Avengers Disassembled?
    That's a good one, Wanda's never recovered from that. Could say the same for Civil War with Iron Man.

  2. #32
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    That's a good one, Wanda's never recovered from that. Could say the same for Civil War with Iron Man.
    And the sequel was even worse.
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  3. #33
    Astonishing Member jetengine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulBullion View Post
    My go to answer: Too many mediocre white men in charge.
    Jim Shooter claimed he was drunk when he approved that story

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by norj View Post
    Avengers 200, how was that approved?
    Believe it or not, the original plot was completely different but got rejected, so what we got was something that was rewritten at the last minute by half a dozen people.
    Last edited by ed2962; 03-22-2020 at 05:53 AM.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    Jim Shooter claimed he was drunk when he approved that story
    Is that his story now? Cause he's the one who rejected David Micheline's original plot and his name is one of the scripters of the published story.

  6. #36
    Mighty Member norj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed2962 View Post
    Believe it or not, the original plot was completely different but got rejected, so what we got was something that was rewritten at the last minute by half a dozen people.
    What was the original plot?
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  7. #37
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed2962 View Post
    Believe it or not, the original plot was completely different but got rejected, so what we got was something that was rewritten at the last minute by half a dozen people.
    Usually it's the other way around, with success having many parents and failure being an orphan...
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by norj View Post
    What was the original plot?
    I don't know if the complete details were ever released, but David's plot was going to follow up on some loose threads from a Capt Marvel/Ms Marvel team up that happened earlier in Carol's then cancelled book. The Supreme Intelligence was going to behind Carol's "pregnancy" and this was going to lead into some Kree Empire stuff.

    What happened is that a What If comic about the Kree/Skrull War with Supreme Intelligence as the bad guy had just came out a couple of months before and Jim Shooter who was EiC, thought the plots were too similar and said that the story for Avengers #200 had to be changed.
    Last edited by ed2962; 03-22-2020 at 10:33 AM.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulBullion View Post
    Usually it's the other way around, with success having many parents and failure being an orphan...
    I'm sure it just didn't occur to them how controversial the ending would be.

  10. #40
    I am invenitable Jack Dracula's Avatar
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    speaking of inappropriate elements, The New Teen Titans: The Judas Contract, where it's revealed in a particularly creepy way that the middle-aged Slade Wilson aka the Terminator is actually having a sexual relationship with the sixteen year-old Terra.
    What the **** Wolfman and Perez?
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  11. #41
    Mighty Member icctrombone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadH View Post
    speaking of inappropriate elements, The New Teen Titans: The Judas Contract, where it's revealed in a particularly creepy way that the middle-aged Slade Wilson aka the Terminator is actually having a sexual relationship with the sixteen year-old Terra.
    What the **** Wolfman and Perez?
    Deathstroke was a bad guy, that's what bad guys do. When he got his own series they gave him a sense of honor which didn't jive with this story.

  12. #42
    I am invenitable Jack Dracula's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by icctrombone View Post
    Deathstroke was a bad guy, that's what bad guys do. When he got his own series they gave him a sense of honor which didn't jive with this story.
    IDK, it seems like these professional writers could've figured out a more palatable way to demonstrate his badness other than statutory rape.
    The stink of wish-fulfillment makes it even more creepy.
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  13. #43
    Amazing Member Adam Allen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1 View Post



    This won't go well I'm sure...


    Marvel to me has had some brilliant comics the last decade. The whole Secret Empire arc with an evil Captain America , the creation of Ms. Marvel and the current work done on X-Men. But its time to admit a terrible idea and call it a terrible idea.

    The New Warriors has been a concept that worked in the 1990's for a 75 issue run (it ran outta steam after #50 as some claim and limped to an ending) but since has had numerous reboots that failed. There was a planned TV series set for Freeform but after a pilot wasn't picked up in 2017 and Marvel couldn't find a place to air it the show was considered dead in 2019.

    So after so many failed reboots we get this latest attempt and man ...oh man. It makes what DC did with New Guardians in the 1980's look like the greatest work ever. In fact the characters are pitched in this video as it starts off detailing how good the 1990s series was . Then it nosedives quick...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PCWUCv1rnU

    Before folks jump in and accuse me of hating or anything ; I love comics and have read for years. I can get behind 99% of what is out there. It shouldn't excuse bad ideas even now. Sorry if this upsets people.


    (Now a character with snow related powers who can hurt people with deadly snowflakes ...ok that is kinda cool , just with this concept...not so much)
    Snowflake and Safespace are absolutely a bad idea. I mean, I get it ... automatically tons of free press, because people definitely noticed this, who otherwise probably would never have blinked as New Warriors was revived, struggled, and got cancelled again, with just its original characters in updated stories.

    There's just not any way you're going to be able to use these characters to make some kind of positive social commentary, so trolling the public by naming the characters this way will inevitably end up being a bad idea, in retrospect ... however it may have somehow seemed a good idea, at the start.

    Oh, also, Trailblazer and Screentime seem like rather lame characters, too. You know you're in trouble when the teenaged knockoff of Morbius is your most interesting character concept.
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  14. #44
    Astonishing Member jetengine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Allen View Post
    Snowflake and Safespace are absolutely a bad idea. I mean, I get it ... automatically tons of free press, because people definitely noticed this, who otherwise probably would never have blinked as New Warriors was revived, struggled, and got cancelled again, with just its original characters in updated stories.

    There's just not any way you're going to be able to use these characters to make some kind of positive social commentary, so trolling the public by naming the characters this way will inevitably end up being a bad idea, in retrospect ... however it may have somehow seemed a good idea, at the start.

    Oh, also, Trailblazer and Screentime seem like rather lame characters, too. You know you're in trouble when the teenaged knockoff of Morbius is your most interesting character concept.
    Apparently there is some thought this may be a heavy comedy series so those names are intentionally ott.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadH View Post
    IDK, it seems like these professional writers could've figured out a more palatable way to demonstrate his badness other than statutory rape.
    The stink of wish-fulfillment makes it even more creepy.
    I think it was more to show not just how evil Slade was but also how evil Terra was. She was presenting herself to Changeling and the other Titans as this innocent victimized person, but her true self is out there fornicating and wearing bad make up and smoking cigarettes!

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