X-Men + Fantastic Four #3 Preview Pages

[Lucyinthesky]

Claremont likes his anti-heros and he seems to have a weakness for both Magneto and Dr Doom imo.

I would not quite say steal imo, the hero having a previous relationship with the villain is something not that rare in fiction and even there Claremont did a spin on the story, Xavier and Magneto don´t disagree on how they perceive each other they had a lot of respect for each other since day one and seemed to enjoy interacting with each other, they only had ONE, MAIN disagreement born from their own very different life experiences and that was the reason why they became enemies, as JDW once said, it must have been quite frustrating for Xavier and the X-men to have a potential ally that could do so much good for the X-men mission but that always went too far so they had to fight and stop him.

I see Reed and Victor´s relationship much more different: they got into a competitive relationship over who was the smartest from that one, that only got worse after Victor´s acciddent and Reed feeling some personal responsibility over it but they both had very different perspectives on the world problems and how to solve them even if they share some of the same personality flaws.

I also loved Victor´s time as Infamous Iron Man, now that he´s feeling nostalgic for a child it would be nice if he went to look for his child from that story and yes I see what Slott did to Victor pretty similar to how the 90´s were for Magneto and only because marvel can´t seem to be able to develop new villains interesting enough to get the readers attention. I completely sympatize with you here but I also think the new Dr Doom solo is quite good for him I just hope Darkhold has the same quality.

[Iron Maiden]

Yas! YAS! YAAAAAAAAS!
Latveria isn't real tho

Neither is anything in comics for that matter so what is your point? His back story showed a history of oppression of his people very early on. What does it matter if it was Latveria or if Stan & Jack placed him in Romania or Hungary?

[BroHomo]

I find it ironic that Doom gave white guy Charles some of their own medicine with that little speech. People tend to forget that Doom is a Roma, a very oppressed RW minority, as opposed to an imaginary one like the mutants.

Latveria isn't real tho

Neither is anything in comics for that matter so what is your point? His back story showed a history of oppression of his people very early on. What does it matter if it was Latveria or if Stan & Jack placed him in Romania or Hungary?

I was pointing out that both characters have imaginary origins.
What was your point?

[Iron Maiden]

Claremont likes his anti-heros and he seems to have a weakness for both Magneto and Dr Doom imo.

I would not quite say steal imo, the hero having a previous relationship with the villain is something not that rare in fiction and even there Claremont did a spin on the story, Xavier and Magneto don´t disagree on how they perceive each other they had a lot of respect for each other since day one and seemed to enjoy interacting with each other but their ONE, MAIN disagreement born from their own very different life experiences was the reason why they became enemies, as JDW once said, it must have been quite frustrating having a potential ally that could do so much good for the X-men mission but that always went too far so they had to fight and stop him.

I see Reed and Victor´s relationship much more different they got into a competitive relationship that only got worse after Victor´s acciddent and Reed feels some personal responsibility over it but they both have very different perspectives on the world problems and how to solve them even if they share some of the same flaws.

I also loved Victor´s time as Infamous Iron Man, now that he´s feeling nostalgic for a child it would be nice if he went to look for his child from that story and yes I see what Slott did to Victor pretty similar to how the 90´s were for Magneto and only because marvel can´t seem to be able to develop new villains interesting enough to get the readers attention. I completely sympetize with this but I also think the new Dr Doom solo is quite good for him I just hope Darkhold has the same quality.

I just wish everyone hadn't forgotten about Amara and the other little Doom in utero. We don't even know if she gave birth or not. Cantwell had said on his Twitter that he may try and work in Kristoff at some point but who knows?

As for Reed and Victor, they were like oil and water. I really think at that point in his life Victor was suspicious of anyone that wasn't part of his tribe. I think it was in Zdarsky's Doom 2099 story that put in very simply....he didn't like that Reed had it so easy. Rich daddy who helped instill the interest in the sciences and was able to put him in the best schools. Reed would have qualified on a scholarship if need be but didn't have to. It was a sheer stroke of luck that Victor was found by that recruiter when he needed to escape from Latveria since he had a price on his head for his guerrilla tactics against the government. That's another aspect of Doom that gets forgotten but Warren Ellis used beautifully in Doom 2099.

[Iron Maiden]

I was pointing out that both characters have imaginary origins.

Well duh! My point is that mutants are an allegory, an imaginary minority. The plight of the Roma even to this day is very real and it was rather daring for those times for Stan and Jack to bring it up. You have to remember this was 1961. Although I sometimes think in this case "gypsy" was used as a sort of safer option than Jewish. Ben Grimm was actually the first Jewish character in Marvel but they never came out and said it. But Jack once drew a sketch of him wearing a yarmulke on a greeting card he sent to friends and always said that to his mind he always pictured him as Jewish.

[Lucyinthesky]

I just wish everyone hadn't forgotten about Amara and the other little Doom in utero. We don't even know if she gave birth or not. Cantwell had said on his Twitter that he may try and work in Kristoff at some point but who knows?

Yes, the child should be a baby right now it would be interesting to see Victor try to fit into that role but symbolicaly speaking Kristoff is Doom´s heir but we rarely see them interacting as father and son so it would be good to see a little more of that.

As for Reed and Victor, they were like oil and water. I really think at that point in his life Victor was suspicious of anyone that wasn't part of his tribe. I think it was in Zdarsky's Doom 2099 story that put in very simply....he didn't like that Reed had it so easy. Rich daddy who helped instill the interest in the sciences and was able to put him in the best schools. Reed would have qualified on a scholarship if need be but didn't have to. It was a sheer stroke of luck that Victor was found by that recruiter when he needed to escape from Latveria since he had a price on his head for his guerrilla tactics against the government. That's another aspect of Doom that gets forgotten but Warren Ellis used beautifully in Doom 2099.

Agreed I liked to see some of this Doom´s pov on "The books of doom" it was also interesting to see how he took over Latveria. it´s also one of the reasons why I like him better than most of the FF4 and during Hickman´s iluminati I almost wanted anyone to punch Reed in his face that´s why I get why some people want to hit a lot Hickman Magneto and Xavier. But well my point is that the FF4 are not bad people and have indeed done a lot of good of their own, but their perspective can also be, how do I say it, a little self centered sometimes and I like more characters who have gone more out of their comfort zone and even changed views because of those experiences even if they are not perfect representatives or moraly standing citizens XD but that´s also why I like Spider-man a lot and Wanda, Pietro and Captain America to a point.

From his solo I lol at him and Kang being out there just having to interact, they didn´t change anything about them but it was clear they both seem very lonely characters right now, well at least Doom has Morgan Le fey to give him some company but he seems to want an actual family now imo.

[Ferro]

the fantastic four are a relic of a time gone by , unable to capture anyone if not relying on nostalgia, the boomers of the marvel universe

[Gamall]

That being said it's kind of weird how some fans like when the X-Men are the bitches of the Marvel Universe and just take it without saying a word. I, to be honest, prefer this side of the X-Men not taking **** from the Karens of the MU and demanding the respect they deserve.

Some people only like minorities when they are miserable.

[Ferro]

Some people only like minorities when they are miserable.

and are never challenging the perceptions or the comfort of non minorities that read them, the xmen must always turn the other cheek, be forgiving and saints or else their poor sensibilities might get harmed.

[Rosa Snarks]

Ferro is the king of this forum after reading this entire thread.

[Iron Maiden]

Yes, the child should be a baby right now it would be interesting to see Victor try to fit into that role but symbolicaly speaking Kristoff is Doom´s heir but we rarely see them interacting as father and son so it would be good to see a little more of that.

Yeah, Hickman was the last one to use him on a regular basis. I got to meet Hickman at his first appearance at C2E2 when it was a much smaller convention than it is now and early in his Fantastic Four run. I did get to mention to him how I would like to see more of John Byrne's characters in his FF. This was around the time when an upcoming issue featured a time travel story with Reed's father Nathaniel... I really loved his Nathaniel. I mentioned Kristoff to him and how nobody really uses him anymore. I can't say for sure whether or not he was planning to use him anyway or if I sort of planted the idea. I'd like to think it was the latter of course.

At least Hickman did have Doom and Kristoff together and acting like a little family. He was there when Doom has a couple of his summits over dinner when the incursions started. Funny how people will say they don't trust Doom but don't pass up the free meal. I'm fully expecting that this series will end with everyone at the dinner table, with candles. Doom loves candles.

Agreed I liked to see some of this Doom´s pov on "The books of doom" it was also interesting to see how he took over Latveria. it´s also one of the reasons why I like him better than most of the FF4 and during Hickman´s iluminati I almost wanted anyone to punch Reed in his face that´s why I get why some people want to hit a lot Hickman Magneto and Xavier. But well my point is that the FF4 are not bad people and have indeed done a lot of good of their own, but their perspective can also be, how do I say it, a little self centered sometimes and I like more characters who have gone more out of their comfort zone and even changed views because of those experiences even if they are not perfect representatives or moraly standing citizens XD but that´s also why I like Spider-man a lot and Wanda, Pietro and Captain America to a point.

From his solo I lol at him and Kang being out there just having to interact, they didn´t change anything about them but it was clear they both seem very lonely characters right now, well at least Doom has Morgan Le fey to give him some company but he seems to want an actual family now imo.

You have to think that a little neck wound is not going to stop Kang from showing up again. And Morgan is due for another appearance I hope. I love Cantwell's take on Doom...he says Doom is both Dr Frankenstein and the Monster. As for the FF, I really think Hickman was the last one to get it right, although Robinson's run was OK too. Fraction? forget it. I think Slott makes them too "cuddly" for lack of a better term. With HIckman, there was more of an edge to them.

[Lucyinthesky]

Yeah, Hickman was the last one to use him on a regular basis. I got to meet Hickman at his first appearance at C2E2 when it was a much smaller convention than it is now and early in his Fantastic Four run. I did get to mention to him how I would like to see more of John Byrne's characters in his FF. This was around the time when an upcoming issue featured a time travel story with Reed's father Nathaniel... I really loved his Nathaniel. I mentioned Kristoff to him and how nobody really uses him anymore. I can't say for sure whether or not he was planning to use him anyway or if I sort of planted the idea. I'd like to think it was the latter of course.

Who knows, maybe I also enjoyed his Kristoff on his FF run.

At least Hickman did have Doom and Kristoff together and acting like a little family. He was there when Doom has a couple of his summits over dinner when the incursions started. Funny how people will say they don't trust Doom but don't pass up the free meal. I'm fully expecting that this series will end with everyone at the dinner table, with candles. Doom loves candles.

He really does, I can see him try to invite Storm to another dinner and maybe this time Magneto and the X-men can get into one of his famous dinners. Magneto and Victor have shared their deepest memories but have yet to have a dinner. I just hope this ends better than the dinner with Namor that was brutal, I fet so bad for Namor that time, he almost make me cry, poor Namor, even if he kind of deserved to hear that.

You have to think that a little neck wound is not going to stop Kang from showing up again. And Morgan is due for another appearance I hope. I love Cantwell's take on Doom...he says Doom is both Dr Frankenstein and the Monster.

Agreed that´s a nice balance for Doom, I also liked his exploration of his most emotional side getting him out of his comfort zone and he and Kang were just so much fun to read about, I also liked him with Dr Strange on Savage avengers.

As for the FF, I really think Hickman was the last one to get it right, although Robinson's run was OK too. Fraction? forget it. I think Slott makes them too "cuddly" for lack of a better term. With HIckman, there was more of an edge to them.

Agreed, they need their cute side but without that edge they lose some or most of their personality as a team imo.

[Ferro]

Ferro is the king of this forum after reading this entire thread.

it’s the quarentine luv

[Rosa Snarks]

it’s the quarentine luv

lmfao. you don't miss!

[Zelena]

Some people only like minorities when they are miserable.

Some people only like people that belong to minorities when these latter consider themselves like people and don't feel that they are above everyone else because they are different.