Coronavirus knocks out direct market - Diamond stops deliveries

[Rise]

They are delaying the digital comics? Talks about selfish and terrible business decision.

[Clark_Kent]

Print readers are not getting books either. So how is this catering to print readers? The books will come out in print, and they will come out in digital. As I pointed out in another post, if they release digital now and comics ship next month, the whole schedule is getting pushed back a month, and that means next month you will still go a month (or whatever the length is) without digital at some point.

I think the rest of my post sums it up. I don't care about not getting books this month so much as I care about foolishly grasping to a dying medium when they have a perfect opportunity to embrace the future.

Would it work? Who knows. We'll never know unless they try it. But instead, we'll cater to the old ways of thinking. And why not, the old ways have done wonders for the industry the last 15 years, right? But you're correct, I shouldn't have said print "readers", I should have said print "format".

[cranger]

I think the rest of my post sums it up. I don't care about not getting books this month so much as I care about foolishly grasping to a dying medium when they have a perfect opportunity to embrace the future.

Would it work? Who knows. We'll never know unless they try it. But instead, we'll cater to the old ways of thinking. And why not, the old ways have done wonders for the industry the last 15 years, right? But you're correct, I shouldn't have said print "readers", I should have said print "format".

Fair enough. I would argue that your premise is flawed because you see digital as an upgrade. That argument has gone on too long and my impression is that people who are determined to see digital as the only format or whatever the end goal is just do not want to acknowledge at all why people see them as distinct offerings. So I will make that objection and move on.

What I will openly discuss is how sure are you digital is not just the future, but the now? That is, if the direct market is allowed to fall and digital does not catch on, I don't think they can rebuild the direct market or will want to. Monthly print comics will be all but dead, kept on by people who love the format. Digital would also be all but dead, pretty much falling to a state as seen by these other web toon type apps. Even if digital was my thing, I cannot for the life of me see any reason why I would want to see it overtake physical or risk the whole thing just to see if it could.

[kjn]

They sell the Archie Digests and the DC Giants, right? The problem is that $3.99 32 page floppies don't make the shops enough money. They'd need to merge books into anthologies. So, say, Superman, Action Comics, Supergirl, Young Justice and Legion of Super Heroes in one magazine? And the same for Batman, Detective Comics, Nightwing, Batgirl, and Red Hood?

As I understand it, the DC Giants are distributed by a games/toy/collectibles distributor, not a distributor of magazines or printed matter. I also heard more than enough reports that the DC Giants has had more than a bit of problem with spotty distribution.

Not something you want to bet your next major business strategy on. Nice marketing move, but not enough consistency.

[ohfellow]

It's probably already been observed in this long discussion, and perhaps is incredibly obvious, but:

Delivery methods are not the same as content consumption.

Listening to music hasn't changed. (Elements peripheral to the fundamental experience, like "album sides" and liner notes, have obviously changed - and yes, many people miss them. But listening to music is the same. A discussion of the value of sides, covers and liner notes is beyond the scope of this discussion.)

Watching TV and home video is still an audio/visual experience. You can still lean back in a comfortable chair and watch a big picture, or any size picture you want. (Peripheral changes are resolution, and formatting, like letterboxing, truncation or stretching, in some cases. You can watch on a large TV, or on an old analog TV connected to a digital-to-analog converter, or on a phone, but those are choices. And are still viewing experiences. Changing "channels" has also changed - again, peripheral to the critical experience.)

Digital comics are not just delivered differently. There is a fundamental difference in the reading experience.

You don't need to tap and scroll to read a printed comic. You turn the page. You can easily hold a lightweight book at any comfortable difference without your hands and arms growing fatigued, or sitting with your back in a potentially awkward and unhealthy position. There are no such radical differences in the real-time experience of listening to music or watching video.

If we really want to replace the distribution of print comics with digital, perhaps this would be a better comparison to music and video:

People would buy 32-page blank pamphlets; download comic content digitally; then print it at home! (You'd obviously need a very sophisticated printing system. That might lead to co-ops of fans joining to cover the equipment cost, which might start to resemble what we now call "local comic shops.")

But isn't that more closely equivalent to the digital delivery of music and video? Comparable to downloading music or video and exporting it to a blank CD (should you need one, like in an older car) or DVD.

[ohfellow]

Instead of trying to find their way back into retail, publishers might just double down on the bookstores where they already have distribution deals. Whether they'd try to move floppies through bookstores like they do the direct market or just go all OGN's?

I have been thinking for a while that DC has been testing those waters with their Prestige Plus format, which is magazine-sized, square bound, and features card stock covers that have been beautifully embossed.

Most of these Prestige Plus releases have been thin, but others (like Harleen) have been released with near-GN numbers of pages, and there can be many more of these produced in the future. Three issues of Harleen have pretty much the equivalent content of nine of the other Prestige Plus titles DC has been publishing (Joker/Harley Criminal Sanity; Joker Killer Smile; Wonder Woman Dead Earth; Birds of Prey; The Question).

DC has also been releasing a virtual flood of Graphic Novels for Kids (previously called Zoom) and Graphic Novels for Young Adults (previously called Ink). These have been very successful, with new ones releasing just about every month. They are out-of-continuity, are for younger readers, and often read like the authors simply recast their generic ideas to use barely recognizable DC characters - but it doesn't have to be that way.

Isn't DC planning to hire more TV writers to replace veteran comic book writers? (Frankly I shudder about that, for many reasons, but that's a different discussion.) And DC's Kids and YA books almost all have been written by established and acclaimed young reader novelists.

There are hints in this that DC is trying out different content models. Still print. But changing.

I've bought all of these through my LCS, to support them. I could get a much bigger discount in many other places, but I choose not to. (There are also ways to get monthly comics cheaper than through your LCS. I don't.)

[kjn]

It's probably already been observed in this long discussion, and perhaps is incredibly obvious, but:

Delivery methods are not the same as content consumption.

Listening to music hasn't changed. (Elements peripheral to the fundamental experience, like "album sides" and liner notes, have obviously changed - and yes, many people miss them. But listening to music is the same. A discussion of the value of sides, covers and liner notes is beyond the scope of this discussion.)

Is it? There are more than a few differences. Today we live in a world of universal and changing mixtapes. Listening to a selection of songs chosen by the artist in their specific order is nowadays of course possible, but it's not the primary way anymore. Distribution is also fundamentally changed, especially with the rise of independent-focused distributors like Bandcamp.

Digital comics are not just delivered differently. There is a fundamental difference in the reading experience.

True, to a degree. To me the first comparison for digital comics shouldn't be music or video, but books and e-books, because physical books—like physical comics—can be directly used by the reader, unlike music or video which requires an intermediate device.

Compared to the e-book market, the market for digital comics looks seriously immature (heck, the entire "mainstream" US comics market looks immature compared to books, and then I'm not thinking about contents but distribution formats and marketing). The CB* format is primitive. The digital comics are still facsimiles of the print comics.

Heck, the real action and creativity in the comics market has been with webcomics for a long time, and those have been digital from the get-go.

[cranger]

Is it? There are more than a few differences. Today we live in a world of universal and changing mixtapes. Listening to a selection of songs chosen by the artist in their specific order is nowadays of course possible, but it's not the primary way anymore.

There was always radio which people were actually listening to before albums became huge and there were always albums people skipped most of the tracks, but when I fire up Spotify 90% of the time I am listening to a full album (in order) still.

Heck, the real action and creativity in the comics market has been with webcomics for a long time, and those have been digital from the get-go.

I hope people who really actually want to see comics in a digital format give more stuff that is already out there a chance, the current comic book format isn't even suitable for physical anymore.

[ohfellow]

Is it? There are more than a few differences. Today we live in a world of universal and changing mixtapes. Listening to a selection of songs chosen by the artist in their specific order is nowadays of course possible, but it's not the primary way anymore. Distribution is also fundamentally changed, especially with the rise of independent-focused distributors like Bandcamp.

All true. With the advent of tape, people were making mixtapes, kind of lovingly. It was more difficult, and people put a lot of care and thought into it. In a way more meaningful than the playlists today that are so easy to make, and can be automatically generated.

Before that, you could still with effort play a track from one album, then a track from another. Which is what professional deejays did, radio and dance - much easier when you have two turntables. People did do that at home even with just one turntable - enthusiastically introducing a friend to an artist by playing examples from different albums.

But it's ultimately all still the listening to music.

True, to a degree. To me the first comparison for digital comics shouldn't be music or video, but books and e-books, because physical books—like physical comics—can be directly used by the reader, unlike music or video which requires an intermediate device.

Compared to the e-book market, the market for digital comics looks seriously immature (heck, the entire "mainstream" US comics market looks immature compared to books, and then I'm not thinking about contents but distribution formats and marketing). The CB* format is primitive. The digital comics are still facsimiles of the print comics.

Heck, the real action and creativity in the comics market has been with webcomics for a long time, and those have been digital from the get-go.

Yes, e-books are the same idea, and yet many people still love their physical libraries and often don't part with books once purchased. Some people love e-books and some prefer printed matter, and countless people enjoy both. (And many people get rid of all of their books, seeing them as clutter.)

And some people like audiobooks! Which is reasonable since, reading or listening, you have to visualize on your own. With comic books, you only have to imagine the action between the panels.

[Waterfall]

This is a middle finger to international fans.

[Vampire Savior]

I'm pretty convinced that comics fans will say what they will, and put up any excuse they want to put up, but ultimately it comes down to them being stuck in their ways and not wanting to do something different, even if it makes sense (like now). I believe that whoever could fix digital to be the best things ever, and these people would still come up with some excuse as to why they don't like it. They will blame the digital experience, but that's because that takes the scrutiny off of them and puts it on something else. I don't really buy it, because you're literally reading something on a screen right now, and we've gotten to the point where people do this on a very regular basis.

This falls in line with other general behavior from them, like only being interested in characters created from the 1930s to maybe the 1960s or 70s, which is incredibly bizarre when you sit and think about it. To tell you the truth, I never related with this type of mindset and always found it odd. This is the real reason why the industry is dying. It's not SJW's or anything like that (though that doesn't really help). Actually, if anything, it's hyper conservatism. It's doggedly not wanting to change.

Thing is, only comics fans like what they like. Only they will hunt down specialty stores and have "pull boxes" (I've never had one of those). Only they will spend $40 to $50 a week or so on a stack of bad comics, just because that's what they've been doing for however long. Only they will be interested in making sense of poorly written events that rattle the universe only to have it rattled again one month after it had been rattled.

I understand the dilemma the publishers are in. This is the audience they have and no one else is really interested in their content. But this whole thing is largely the publishers' fault and no one else is going to get them out of this. I guess their best hope is their YA graphic novels, but...somehow I'm not sure that will be enough. Those anthologies they put in Wal-Mart won't do it. I don't think people like anthologies, and stuffing them full of semi-random junk content won't get a lot of interest from people.

As for me, I've always loved the comics medium, but always hated the industry, and never related with a lot of the fans. If the whole mainstream comics industry went away, I don't think I would mind, and I sort of think it kind of has to, otherwise it will just keep trudging along as it is now, and it's kind of embarrassing when there are billion dollar corporations backing it and more interest in the comics characters owned by them than ever (no thanks to the comics).

[ohfellow]

I'm pretty convinced that comics fans will say what they will, and put up any excuse they want to put up, but ultimately it comes down to them being stuck in their ways and not wanting to do something different, even if it makes sense (like now)....

You, and many others expressing more or less your opinion, write far too well and in far too much detail to be merely trolling.

You talk about people being stuck in their ways, yet this insistence on ridiculing, or being kind of contemptuous of, people who prefer books, is obsessive itself, and I can't comprehend why anyone finds it necessary to do this.

Of course I'm looking at a screen right now. And I read news articles on the screen. I don't read longer-form material this way.

Reading and writing on web pages or emails or texts is not like looking at artwork! Do you have screens, or do you have actual photos or artwork on your walls or tables?

I'm sure you sometimes sit in a chair, and sometimes lie in a bed. Maybe you've sat on a stool? Why do you have different preferences? Do you have one favorite chair for some kinds of activities, but not others? Do you usually put your phone in the same pocket? Do you have any preferences at all?

Do you only eat broccoli? If you like broccoli and not cauliflower, is there something wrong with you? It's all eating, right?

You just wrote "If the whole mainstream comics industry went away, I don't think I would mind" - so why are you participating here?

And the last sentence of your signature - well, call me stuck in my ways, but I find it offensive. Maybe you and others here take pleasure just being in-your-face about things.

(EDIT: The person I was replying to changed their signature significantly to eliminate the wording I was referring to, which had to do with a different bodily function than they are currently describing. Of course the signature could change again in the future, rendering everything I am stating here still meaningless. Once a sig is changed, it is changed for all posts ever written, leaving no evidence of it in the forums. I am glad they changed it, but wanted to mention this in case anyone stumbling on this in the future wonders just what the heck I was griping about. Thank you.)

I am not singling you out. I've read so many opinions like yours, here and other places. It just gives no credence to preferences. People are accusing others of secretly being retailers or speculators. It's -- astounding to me.

Yet you talk about people being close-minded? These attacks on those with specific preferences strikes me as close-minded. It's dismissive of others.

Finally got this off my chest, having read this kind of thing for a week.

[Clark_Kent]

Fair enough. I would argue that your premise is flawed because you see digital as an upgrade. That argument has gone on too long and my impression is that people who are determined to see digital as the only format or whatever the end goal is just do not want to acknowledge at all why people see them as distinct offerings. So I will make that objection and move on.

What I will openly discuss is how sure are you digital is not just the future, but the now? That is, if the direct market is allowed to fall and digital does not catch on, I don't think they can rebuild the direct market or will want to. Monthly print comics will be all but dead, kept on by people who love the format. Digital would also be all but dead, pretty much falling to a state as seen by these other web toon type apps. Even if digital was my thing, I cannot for the life of me see any reason why I would want to see it overtake physical or risk the whole thing just to see if it could.

Well, first up, thank you for the civil response. I've had this discussion elsewhere and usually people resort to calling me names, so I appreciate it!

To your first point, yes, I do believe digital is an upgrade and the superior reading experience. I will fully & whole-heartedly admit that my entire argument, 100%, is based on this opinion. And I also admit that my way of thinking very well could be flawed, which of course would destroy my entire position lol But, on most subjects that are subjective, all we can do is base things off of our own opinions. I find digital to be the superior format for several reasons, the largest 2 reasons being reading & portability. When I read comics on my Kindle Fire, I can read them in any light, any time of day. Print comics, particularly ones which utilize dark colors / pages the majority of the time (think The Batman Who Laughs mini series, Blackest Night, etc), get difficult to read in low light. Perhaps if you have excellent vision then this wouldn't be a problem, but I find evenings and night to be a difficult time to read physical books if you don't have good lighting. Reading digitally fixes this.

As for portability, well I have over 800 books on my Kindle Fire 10 right now. A mix of single issues & collections. I have my Kindle 10 in my bag here at work. I have more than that in a mix of hard and soft covers at home on my shelves, and dammit I do adore my Infinite Crisis omnibus! But the problem is, it's at home. It's too big to lug around without damaging it, and if I want to read IC then I have to drive home and get it. So I love having a massive collection always with me, limited only by my micro SD card storage. So I do find digital to be absolutely superior...in addition to these things, I never have to worry about sagging spines or breaking in a book correctly. I don't need to worry about accidentally catching tape on my book when I take it out of plastic. No accidental dog eared pages, and digital always picks up where you left off.

Now, also, I'm coming at this 100% from a purchase & read point of view. Those with a collector's mentality, of course, see digital as the end of days and I can respect that. A lot of comic fans want every issue with no gaps, they won't buy a book with a ding in it, etc. And I absolutely can get behind that, I enjoy collecting things too. But again, if we're talking simply reading, I have to go with digital. My Fire 10 is as light, if not lighter, than a 6-issue tpb. My arms or wrists never get tired of holding it. If I read in bed, I can rest one end of the tablet on my chest & read without messing up any pages. It's awesome. And with Amazon's $20/month deal, all I had to do was skip buying coffee a couple times.

Now, to your second point (apologies for being long-winded), I do see how it's a risk...and it's true that if you go all-in on digital and it fails, then it may be impossible to rebuild from there. I guess my response would be this: if the industry is so precariously on the edge of a knife that changing the predominate format to digital over physical would destroy it, then perhaps the industry doesn't deserve to be saved. I'm not calling for a complete end to physical copies, but I think it's long past time to print fewer of them. Perhaps music isn't a good analogy, but they still make vinyl for the niche audience who want those records...I think comics should be the same. Make digital the focus, cut print copies of floppies by 80% (ramp up the collections instead), and march on. If it fails, well, you just accelerated things by a few years. But if you advertise & make digital worth it (give readers extras, like links to wiki's and options to purchase collections) then maybe the industry could take advantage of this super hero golden age we live in.


It's a risk, yes, but sometimes to save a dying industry you must be willing to take risks. The alternative is a slow death anyway. In my opinion.

[Ascended]

I have been thinking for a while that DC has been testing those waters with their Prestige Plus format, which is magazine-sized, square bound, and features card stock covers that have been beautifully embossed.

There are hints in this that DC is trying out different content models. Still print. But changing.

DC is indeed experimenting with different formats, with product aimed at those audiences. For all his questionable decisions I have always given Dan Didio a lot of credit for this, because it seems to very much have been his baby. And we need that sort of thing. We need more product, across a wider distribution net, aimed at different groups. The direct market is a dead end, even if its fans (and the ongoing continuity) are worth keeping, and I'm glad that DC has tried these other options and not given up when the first attempts failed (like the Earth-1 OGN line).

The question now is, with everything that has happened; was that enough, and where do we go from here? As I've said, I don't think this is going to cripple the direct market. It's gonna hurt, a lot, but I don't think the pandemic will last long enough to put the direct market, the publishers, or (most) retailers in the dirt. But I do think this could be a wake up call for publishers that's force them to take bold action where they've only tiptoed up to now. And what they do when the dust settles, if they do anything, should be pretty interesting to see.

As for the digital side of things....a few years ago, when all of print was really looking like it'd become a small niche market like comics already are, digital made sense as the primary alternative to the direct market. And if publishers would make digital comics with digital audiences in mind I suspect it'd be quite successful. But in the last few years we've seen a resurgence in print (some have blamed retro-obsessed hipster Millennials for this but I dunno if its true). Print's not what it used to be of course, and some industries like newspapers are still very much dying, but print in general has pulled out of its decline somewhat. So now trades and OGN's are looking like the most promising alternative. But as I've said, I think the best solution is to diversify; it shouldn't just be OGN's or digital or anything else getting the "big push" to replace the direct market, publishers should push hard to break big into all of those formats, and any others we're forgetting.

[Zaresh]

As a digital-then-trade fan, this sucks. But I can understand why they do it: they probably don't want to loss actual sales, and don't expect digital to sell that much more. Also, it gives them extra time for whatever they were going to do for summer.