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  1. #481
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    whoa!
    Yes! Yes!
    Bishop's thiccness+ Sage's bricKness!!
    XXX-Men
    Going to show my age here , thickness and brickness ? As in thick as a brick ?

  2. #482
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel909 View Post
    Going to show my age here , thickness and brickness ? As in thick as a brick ?
    ohhhh!
    sh!t dude idk I'm just tryna be hip.
    let's just pretend we have those ear plugs in and bob our heads
    GrindrStone(D)

  3. #483
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel909 View Post
    Going to show my age here , thickness and brickness ? As in thick as a brick ?
    It's thick with 2 Cs.

  4. #484
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    Quote Originally Posted by SchismOfMadroces View Post
    So, what is it then, that makes something a god? Storm can 100% come back from the dead thanks to The Five. How is being brought back by them any different than eating one of Idunn's apples, feasting on nectar and ambrosia, or any of the other varied and external forces that grant other gods their longevity and immortality?
    The Five are using science, not magic. That's what everyone Krakoa has access too, as well.

    What makes Loki's non-divine mythological background any closer to godhood than Storm's own mythological background?
    That's in the MCU, in the comics the gods are very real by every sense of the word. Storm's been worshipped as a goddess but she's a mutant with weather manipulating powers. That's why she's with the X-men.

  5. #485
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    Quote Originally Posted by SchismOfMadroces View Post
    So, what is it then, that makes something a god?
    I told you, the ability to transcend death in some way, even resurrect from it, and generally being beyond mortal limitations in term of physiology.

    Quote Originally Posted by SchismOfMadroces View Post
    Storm can 100% come back from the dead thanks to The Five.
    So? That's like Tony Stark uploading his consciousness in new automatons/bodies thanks to technology, that's not divine either, and neither is coming back to life thanks to the Five.
    It's even debated in the book if the RP are the real thing or just fancy cloning...

    Bottom line being, you take the Five away from Storm, she stays dead, so no, that's not a valid argument to make for her supposed godhood.

    Quote Originally Posted by SchismOfMadroces View Post
    How is being brought back by them any different than eating one of Idunn's apples, feasting on nectar and ambrosia, or any of the other varied and external forces that grant other gods their longevity and immortality?
    The Five are humans with superpowers, they aren't some divine or mystical force.

    Quote Originally Posted by SchismOfMadroces View Post
    What makes Loki's non-divine mythological background any closer to godhood than Storm's own mythological background?
    Because jotuns have a physiology Superior to humans, and that includes the mutant part of the human population.
    "The means are as important as the end - we have to do this right or not at all.
    Anything less negates every belief we've ever had, every sacrifice we've ever made."


    "Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

    "No justice, no peace."

  6. #486
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by People Of The Earth View Post
    I told you, the ability to transcend death in some way, even resurrect from it, and generally being beyond mortal limitations in term of physiology.



    So? That's like Tony Stark uploading his consciousness in new automatons/bodies thanks to technology, that's not divine either, and neither is coming back to life thanks to the Five.
    It's even debated in the book if the RP are the real thing or just fancy cloning...

    Bottom line being, you take the Five away from Storm, she stays dead, so no, that's not a valid argument to make for her supposed godhood.



    The Five are humans with superpowers, they aren't some divine or mystical force.



    Because jotuns have a physiology Superior to humans, and that includes the mutant part of the human population.
    Storm is a goddess now though. It's on paper.



    She's empowered by faith and has mystical/divine powers. You can reach godhood in Marvel, you don't have to be born with it. Look at Jane Foster or Dani Moonstar reaching Valkyrie status. Even Selene was able to become a Goddess during Necrosha.

    Also, Resurrection still allows her to cheat death like many Gods do when using external forces to reach immortality or longevity, like SchismOfMadroces said.

    It's not canon in any way that superior physiology is required to be a God in Marvel. It's common among Gods, but it's not like every God is like Thor, that's actually the minority. Most Asgardians are much less impressive than Storm when it comes to divine powers. She was able to defeat the Adversary, while the majority of Asgardians struggles against low level villains. Plus we still do not know how her physiology is changed when she reaches Hadari Yao levels of power.
    Last edited by Veitha; 04-02-2020 at 01:25 AM.

  7. #487
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Storm is a goddess now though. It's on paper.



    She's empowered by faith and has mystical/divine powers. You can reach godhood in Marvel, you don't have to be born with it.
    You are mistaking godhood and power-level, those are two different things.
    Storm is powerful but she's still a frail human who can be pushed around by russian soldiers with depowering tech and french mercenaries, that's Simply not godly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Look at Jane Foster or Dani Moonstar reaching Valkyrie status. Even Selene was able to become a Goddess during Necrosha.
    Jane Foster is not a goddess though, she's borrowing the power from one, same with Dani.
    Selene isn't one either, she's an extremely powerful mutant but mutant nonetheless.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Also, Resurrection still allows her to cheat death like many Gods do when using external forces to reach immortality or longevity, like SchismOfMadroces said.
    I'll repeat myself: the Five are neither divine nor mystical in nature.
    You can't use them as proof of Storm's supposed godhood, that's absurd.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    It's not canon in any way that superior physiology is required to be a God in Marvel.
    The question that other poster asked me was "what makes Loki closer to godhood than Storm" and my answer was simple physiology does.
    Jotuns are more durable than humans, they are stronger than them and lives hundreds of years.
    On average, they beat humans in every department and that includes the mutant part of humanity.
    So no, it's not canonically required, but it's a relevant Indicator nonetheless, a trait that is wildly found among gods in general, whether olympians, asgardians, other Earth-based gods or alien gods.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    It's common among Gods, but it's not like every God is like Thor, that's actually the minority. Most Asgardians are much less impressive than Storm when it comes to divine powers.
    Your average asgardian is Superior to your average human, whether sapien or mutant.
    Stronger, more durable, lives longer too, just like the jotuns are Superior to your average human either.
    I'm not comparing exceptional individuals among them because, by definition, they are above the standard set in their respective groups.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    She was able to defeat the Adversary, while the majority of Asgardians struggles against low level villains.
    That's not proof of godhood in itself, Squirrel Girl defeated Thanos once, she's not a goddess as a result of that Triumph, same for Captain America, Dr Strange or any hero who defeats major opposition.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Plus we still do not know how her physiology is changed when she reaches Hadari Yao levels of power.
    Can't be a goddess on part-time I'm afraid. She's a human with powerful abilities, but human nonetheless. Now, she wouldn't be the first human to be worshipped around because of her power, but it's just that - misguided worshipping.
    Last edited by People Of The Earth; 04-02-2020 at 01:56 AM.
    "The means are as important as the end - we have to do this right or not at all.
    Anything less negates every belief we've ever had, every sacrifice we've ever made."


    "Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

    "No justice, no peace."

  8. #488
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by People Of The Earth View Post
    You are mistaking godhood and power-level, those are two different things.
    Storm is powerful but she's still a frail human who can be pushed around by russian soldiers with depowering tech and french mercenaries, that's Simply not godly.



    Jane Foster is not a goddess though, she's borrowing the power from one, same with Dani.
    Selene isn't one either, she's an extremely powerful mutant but mutant nonetheless.



    I'll repeat myself: the Five are neither divine nor mystical in nature.
    You can't use them as proof of Storm's supposed godhood, that's absurd.



    The question that other poster asked me was "what makes Loki closer to godhood than Storm" and my answer was simple physiology does.
    Jotuns are more durable than humans, they are stronger than them and lives hundreds of years.
    On average, they beat humans in every department and that includes the mutant part of humanity.
    So no, it's not canonically required, but it's a relevant Indicator nonetheless, a trait that is wildly found among gods in general, whether olympians, asgardians, other Earth-based gods or alien gods.



    Your average asgardian is Superior to your average human, whether sapien or mutant.
    Stronger, more durable, lives longer too, just like the jotuns are Superior to your average human either.
    I'm not comparing exceptional individuals among them because, by definition, they are above the standard set in their respective groups.



    That's not proof of godhood in itself, Squirrel Girl defeated Thanos once, she's not a goddess as a result of that Triumph, same for Captain America, Dr Strange or any hero who defeats major opposition.



    Can't be a goddess on part-time I'm afraid. She's a human with powerful abilities, but human nonetheless. Now, she wouldn't be the first human to be worshipped around because of her power, but it's just that - misguided worshipping.
    The issue with this is that it's your idea of godhood here and your headcanon. None of your points have been explicitly said in a comicbook. Unless you have a comicbook that states that a requirement to be a God is to have a superhuman physiology, this is your standard of godhood here, not Marvel's.

    Storm wasn't just displaying huge power levels in that scan, she had just become a goddess/gained access to divine powers. The faith of Wakandans and their prayers was powering her, just like other Marvel Gods.

    Also, Jane Foster is currently the Valkyrie. She's reached godhood. Same for Selene during Necrosha, she was not just powerful, she became a Goddess. It's in the actual comicbook.

    She had risen as a Goddess and in doing so she alerted all the magical beings on Earth. Syrin became The Morrigan too, and she had no superhuman abilities besides her sonic powers before becoming a goddess. It has been established that godhood can be passed to new "hosts" in that specific story, so both humans and mutants can reach God status.

    You can ascend to godhood in Marvel, you do not have to be born one. And new Gods can appear. Mutants already did (see Selene, Syrin and now Storm, who is rising as a Goddess).

  9. #489
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    There's really no point of arguing whether if Storm is a goodness of not... Because it's confirmed that she is in the comic books. You can hate the fact that she is a goddess, but you can't take away that status from her.

  10. #490
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    The issue with this is that it's your idea of godhood here and your headcanon. None of your points have been explicitly said in a comicbook. Unless you have a comicbook that states that a requirement to be a God is to have a superhuman physiology, this is your standard of godhood here, not Marvel's.

    Storm wasn't just displaying huge power levels in that scan, she had just become a goddess/gained access to divine powers. The faith of Wakandans and their prayers was powering her, just like other Marvel Gods.

    Also, Jane Foster is currently the Valkyrie. She's reached godhood. Same for Selene during Necrosha, she was not just powerful, she became a Goddess. It's in the actual comicbook.

    She had risen as a Goddess and in doing so she alerted all the magical beings on Earth. Syrin became The Morrigan too, and she had no superhuman abilities besides her sonic powers before becoming a goddess. It has been established that godhood can be passed to new "hosts" in that specific story, so both humans and mutants can reach God status.

    You can ascend to godhood in Marvel, you do not have to be born one. And new Gods can appear. Mutants already did (see Selene, Syrin and now Storm, who is rising as a Goddess).
    Do you read books like Thor and Loki, who are entrenched in deity mythology? Guardians of the galaxy are currently in a war with the Olympic gods IIRC. How did Siryn become the Morrigan?

    It's been very established that the Five aren't mythical based or gods, they're mutants. They've all years of books showing this in the X-line. That's why they're on Krakoa rather than, say, Asgard or whatever because Krakoa is exclusive to mutants.

  11. #491
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Do you read books like Thor and Loki, who are entrenched in deity mythology? Guardians of the galaxy are currently in a war with the Olympic gods IIRC. How did Siryn become the Morrigan?

    It's been very established that the Five aren't mythical based or gods, they're mutants. They've all years of books showing this in the X-line. That's why they're on Krakoa rather than, say, Asgard or whatever because Krakoa is exclusive to mutants.
    I do read Thor, Valkyrie and Guardians. Do they have any argument against Storm being a goddess, or Selene having become a goddess?

    Syrin became The Morrigan after she killed the previous Morrigan and she then ascended to godhood.

    People of the Earth was trying to make a point about immortality being a requirement for Gods and SchismofMadroces said that Storm requiring the Five is no different than some Gods requiring ambrosia. We're not discussing if Krakoa is divine (yet lol). I'd like to add that science and tech do not interfere with divinity since you brought up the Olympus Gods who are currently pretty much tech based even if they're fueled by godhood. But we're not discussing that.

    Also, we do not know yet if Storm is immortal/enhanced when she reaches Hadari Yao status.

    Last thing I'm adding to this discussion is that the Orishas, the gods of Wakanda, canonically ascended to Godhood almost exactly like Storm, from human to God thanks to faith.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oneeightysix View Post
    There's really no point of arguing whether if Storm is a goodness of not... Because it's confirmed that she is in the comic books. You can hate the fact that she is a goddess, but you can't take away that status from her.
    Yeah, this should end this discussion hahaha.
    Last edited by Veitha; 04-02-2020 at 02:53 AM.

  12. #492
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    I do read Thor, Valkyrie and Guardians. Do they have any argument against Storm being a goddess, or Selene having become a goddess?
    It's establishing the various divine races in marvel and she's not in one of them.

    Syrin became The Morrigan after she killed the previous Morrigan and she then ascended to godhood.
    That checks out.

    People of the Earth was trying to make a point about immortality being a requirement for Gods and SchismofMadroces said that Storm requiring the Five is no different than some Gods requiring ambrosia. We're not discussing if Krakoa is divine (yet lol). I'd like to add that science and tech do not interfere with divinity since you brought up the Olympus Gods who are currently pretty much tech based even if they're fueled by godhood. But we're not discussing that.
    It's not the technology which makes the Olympic gods divine, that's simply tools they use. It's their divine nature which separates them from their cosmic brethren. The discussion was about the subject of godhood in Marvel, however, and that's a large category.

    Also, we do not know yet if Storm is immortal/enhanced when she reaches Hadari Yao status.
    Ok. I agree the power up by faith in Black Panther is a new development, normally she's not directed by the divine and Wakanda has its own rules with its deities.

  13. #493
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    It's establishing the various divine races in marvel and she's not in one of them.



    That checks out.



    It's not the technology which makes the Olympic gods divine, that's simply tools they use. It's their divine nature which separates them from their cosmic brethren. The discussion was about the subject of godhood in Marvel, however, and that's a large category.



    Ok. I agree the power up by faith in Black Panther is a new development, normally she's not directed by the divine and Wakanda has its own rules with its deities.
    You mean the 10 Realms? That's just a fraction of all the gods in the MU. There's literally countless gods and pantheons in the MU that are not related to the 10 Realms or even the Olympic race (see Chaos War, Aaron's Thor, the more recent King Thor, where it is not so subtly implied that what it takes to create Gods is mostly faith and prayers).

    You can still reach godhood if you're not part of a "divine" race such as Asgardians. I'm going to rewrite this since I've edited my post and maybe you didn't see it, but he Orishas, the gods of Wakanda, canonically ascended to Godhood almost exactly like Storm, from human to God thanks to faith. Selene did the same, even if briefly before she was stopped and reverted to human. So no point in dismissing Storm's new development.
    Last edited by Veitha; 04-02-2020 at 03:11 AM.

  14. #494
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    The issue with this is that it's your idea of godhood here and your headcanon. None of your points have been explicitly said in a comicbook. Unless you have a comicbook that states that a requirement to be a God is to have a superhuman physiology, this is your standard of godhood here, not Marvel's.
    That's the Reason why I keep referring her as a goddess in name only.
    The same way I keep referring to mutants as humans and part of Humanity, the same way sapiens are humans and part of Humanity as well.
    I Don't hold power over the terminologies used by others, but I can do so for myself at the very least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Storm wasn't just displaying huge power levels in that scan, she had just become a goddess/gained access to divine powers. The faith of Wakandans and their prayers was powering her, just like other Marvel Gods.
    Where were those divine powers when she was depowered by russian soldiers in Marauders #1 then? Or when Batroc kicked her around more recently?
    I told you earlier, being a god(ess) isn't part-time or partial to switch on/switch off status.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Also, Jane Foster is currently the Valkyrie. She's reached godhood. Same for Selene during Necrosha, she was not just powerful, she became a Goddess. It's in the actual comicbook.
    She reached godlike power, not godhood itself.
    Again, not the same thing.
    And she lost said godlike power to become a mutant again, a powerful one, but still a mutant.
    Jane Foster serves as a conduit for Brunnhilde and derive her force from the All-Weapon, the power is not her own.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    She had risen as a Goddess and in doing so she alerted all the magical beings on Earth.
    Not really, magical beings on Earth were alerted because of the mystical nature of her power-up, it didn't have anything to do with a supposed godhood.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    Syrin became The Morrigan too, and she had no superhuman abilities besides her sonic powers before becoming a goddess. It has been established that godhood can be passed to new "hosts" in that specific story, so both humans and mutants can reach God status.
    What happened with Morrigan is similar in nature to what happens with things like Mjolnir or the All-weapon: power that is picked-up/borrowed by an host.
    Said host becomes a conduit to that power, not the actual source of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    You can ascend to godhood in Marvel, you do not have to be born one.
    You highlighted how people could become extremely powerful (like Selene) or hosts to the gods (like Morrigan), or acquire godlike abilities via a proxy (like Jane Foster).
    Not them becoming gods themselves.
    I think the last one who actually ascended to godhood was Gorr and even his status is debatable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veitha View Post
    And new Gods can appear. Mutants already did (see Selene, Syrin and now Storm, who is rising as a Goddess).
    Selene gave herself a massive power boost with her ritual, that's all. She didn't ascend to godhood, acquiring godlike powers and being a god are not the same.
    Syrin isn't a new god for she received the position of Morrigan from the previous holder who herself had received it from the previous one - she's the host of it, Nothing else.
    And Storm is a goddess in name only, she's vulnerable to most mortal weaponry on Earth alone, she cannot revive or transcend death, being worshipped in Kenya and now Wakanda doesn't change any of that.
    Last edited by People Of The Earth; 04-02-2020 at 03:59 AM.
    "The means are as important as the end - we have to do this right or not at all.
    Anything less negates every belief we've ever had, every sacrifice we've ever made."


    "Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

    "No justice, no peace."

  15. #495
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Dang you're stubborn. Again, it's all your assumption against a lot of proof and things actually happening on paper.

    You can reach godhood from being human, see the Orishas in Wakanda for an example. Selene ascended, she became a goddess, she didn't just become uber powerful, she "became more than human and mutant". The definition of a God is not about wheter or not you are bulletproof, it is been widely established that it's also and mostly about faith and prayers that can turn you into a God. There's plenty of proof for that. Black Panther and Thor established it very well.

    The Morrigan godhood is essentially depicted as a Title that's been passed upon. It is a divine/mystic thing, why are you putting so much emphasys on genetics or species. There are entire species of Gods, yes, but there are also countless pantheons in the universe that are born thanks to faith and prayers. Even Hell Lord status can be achieved from humans or mutants. Ascension to divinity is something that exists and that's what's happening to Storm. You can not like it or you might have a different idea of godhood in Marvel, but it is what it is. It's in the actual comics. When Storm ascended it was "the hour when Gods again stalk the land". She's a goddess.

    The part time thing is obviously because she's powered by faith at the moment, like Selene needed a lot of souls to ascend to full godhood. That doens't make her transformation into Hadari Yao not valid. Thor was weaker without Mjolnir, was he not a God when unworthy? The Gods of Indigarr needed prayers to rise again, but they were still Gods, weren't they?

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