X-Men/Fantastic Four #3 Discussion

[JB]

What'd I miss? Did Sue unleash yet?

[Ferro]

That's because the X-Men are non-entities in the story. It's a FF story with Mutants added in for a commercial reason, not a narrative reason.

wich is pretty much every x-men crossover with the rest of the MU, they are there to sell variants and issues, and to be vilefied.
every
single
time

[Veitha]

What'd I miss? Did Sue unleash yet?

Oh my god hahahahah

[Iron Maiden]

It's hard to take Doom seriously trying to gain moral superiority when he recently killed a bum in his comic for wanting to get on his train car.

Ah c'mon that was Tom & Jerry cartoon violence. Cantwell has said that the issue was supposed to be taken like a Hope & Crosby road picture, hence the title Road to Latveria. Doom even used a pay phone to call up Reed. You can't take the whole thing seriously

[Lucyinthesky]

Charles Xavier was an ideologue, an intellectual, once.
Now, it's not that he is not allowed to talk back, it's like he has nothing to say.
He had no empathy, hiding his face behind a helmet. Now he has no retort.

It feels… wrong.

I also felt it was wrong because it was biased marvel if you are going to fundamentally change the pov of characters like proffesor X whose intelectual pov has always been part of him and whose dream developed the story for one of your best selling franchises, at least allow the man to explain himself, give his reasons for the way he´s been acting lately, be it right or wrong, let the reader decide that but at least let the character explain himself if you don´t then there are obvious bias imo. I kind of agree with some not all of what Dr Doom said and was looking forward to see Charles own pov but there wasn´t one because it seem the point of view of the X-me in this story doesn´t matter much.

[Ferro]

Ah c'mon that was Tom & Jerry cartoon violence. Cantwell has said that the issue was supposed to be taken like a Hope & Crosby road picture, hence the title Road to Latveria. Doom even used a pay phone to call up Reed. You can't take the whole thing seriously

we are x-stans, we love vilains with moraly ambigious ways we just hate how hypocrisy always comes into play from the rest of the MU when the x-men crossover, doom of all people cant speak about what anyone does.
I don't care what he does im just tired of the double standars that always apply in these crossovers, never to the benefit of mutants.

[stormphoenix]

I also felt it was wrong because it was biased marvel if you are going to fundamentally change the pov of characters like proffesor X whose intelectual pov has always been part of him and whose dream developed the story for one of your best selling franchises, at least allow the man to explain himself, give his reasons for the way he´s been acting lately, be it right or wrong, let the reader decide that but at least let the character explain himself if you don´t then there are obvious bias imo. I kind of agree with some not all of what Dr Doom said and was looking forward to see Charles own pov but there wasn´t one because it seem the point of view of the X-me in this story doesn´t matter much.

That's because they are Marked as "Bad-Guys". Doesn't matter what the X-Men do now they are bad guys.

[Ferro]

That's because they are Marked as "Bad-Guys". Doesn't matter what the X-Men do now they are bad guys.

im very much tired that they are both the cash cows and the punching bags of MU

[Lucyinthesky]

That's because they are Marked as "Bad-Guys". Doesn't matter what the X-Men do now they are bad guys.

Even bad guys are allowed to explain themselves, that´s where the whole villain monolgue comes from, otherwise they would not say a thing during their fights with the hero and that would just be boring, here they didn´t even allow Charles to say anything.

[zinderel]

im very much tired that they are both the cash cows and the punching bags of MU

Amen. I’m with you on your call for X-Men to get their own separate universe, now. I didn’t used to be, but over the last decade or so, I’ve become much more ok with the idea, both to limit the crossovers that NEVER portray the X-Men well, and to remove some of the temptation to make them villains for standing up for their future that so many writers seem to have...

If there have to be non-mutant superheroes, create them in RESPONSE to mutants, a la homo novissima. Set up the world along the Man/Mutant/Machine/Alien sci-fi pillars that made X-Men awesome in the first place and that Hickman has been really running with and taking in new directions. Heck, if I’m dreaming, I’d love to see Disney buy up some underused DC properties (if the rumors of WB considering canning the DC publishing arm are true), and put, say...mutants and the Wildstorm universe characters together. Imagine Xavier vs. Henry Bendix verbal sparring matches. A New Mutants/Gen13 mashup...? Or Iceman and Midnighter/Apollo flirting...? Wolverine and Jenny Sparks having run into one another periodically throughout the 20th century...

Change the ‘comet-activated’ metahuman explanation to ‘mutants’, introduce Kherubim and Daemonites as ancient rivals of the Shi’ar to take the place of the Kree and Skrulls, and boom...you got a start...

[Ferro]

Amen. I’m with you on your call for X-Men to get their own separate universe, to limit the crossovers that NEVER portray the X-Men well. If there have to be non-mutant superheroes, create them in RESPONSE to mutants, a la homo novissima. Heck, if I’m dreaming, I’d love to see Disney buy up some underused DC properties (if the rumors of WB considering canning the DC publishing arm are true), and put, say...mutants and the Wildstorm universe characters together. Imagine Xavier vs. Henry Bendix verbal sparring matches. Or Fuji and Sunfire interacting? Or Iceman and Midnighter/Apollo flirting...

Change the ‘comet-activated’ metahuman explanation to ‘mutants’, introduce Kherubim and Daemonites as ancient rivals of the Shi’ar to take the place of the Kree and Skrulls, and boom...you got a start...

you can have the replacements to traditional super heroes to be like the squadron supreme: obvious antagonists that clash and are moraly grey/interesting, and even other forms of super heroics to opose krakoa and mutants, or even alied!
the current x- office has been slaying the worldbuilding, having krakoa + their own universe it could be so juicy , it just take a year to fill it up with interesting new possibillities under their own control.
And it would stop the other proprieties from leaching while tarnishing the x-men

[zinderel]

you can have the replacements to traditional super heroes to be like the squadron supreme: obvious antagonists that clash and are moraly grey/interesting, and even other forms of super heroics to opose krakoa and mutants, or even alied!
the current x- office has been slaying the worldbuilding, having krakoa + their own universe it could be so juicy , it just take a year to fill it up with interesting new possibillities under their own control.
And it would stop the other proprieties from leaching while tarnishing the x-men

Amen. I still enjoy the heck out of a lot of Marvel properties, but I’d prefer to never see another half-assed crossover that misrepresents mutants, even if it means not seeing anymore Wolverine/Spidey hangouts...

[Ferro]

Amen. I still enjoy the heck out of a lot of Marvel properties, but I’d prefer to never see another half-assed crossover that misrepresents mutants, even if it means not seeing anymore Wolverine/Spidey hangouts...

Oh I really don't they simply don't compare and there was always this invisible seperation anyways, I like it better that way but now that these instances of parasitism, because it's pretty much parasitism, get worse and worse I find myself wanting that barrier to become a canon seperation trough difrent universes

[stormphoenix]

im very much tired that they are both the cash cows and the punching bags of MU

Yeah, *sigh*

Even bad guys are allowed to explain themselves, that´s where the whole villain monolgue comes from, otherwise they would not say a thing during their fights with the hero and that would just be boring, here they didn´t even allow Charles to say anything.

I know I know. I agree with what you're saying. But it doesn't matter the X-Men are not allowed to explain themselves. Look back to ALL of the DOX books. The X-Men have been explaining themselves this entire time and NOBODY CARES.

So.....F**K Em. LOL

[Lucyinthesky]

Yeah, *sigh*



I know I know. I agree with what you're saying. But it doesn't matter the X-Men are not allowed to explain themselves. Look back to ALL of the DOX books. The X-Men have been explaining themselves this entire time and NOBODY CARES.

So.....F**K Em. LOL

I was talking during crossovers but I get your point. I like the main status quo and looking forward to see a little more of it, that should be all, I guess.