View Poll Results: You okay with Wallace West?

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  • Yes

    44 43.56%
  • No

    13 12.87%
  • He can exist

    22 21.78%
  • I ignore him completely

    20 19.80%
  • Why are you saying Wally weird?

    2 1.98%
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  1. #46
    hate cant reach you here Harpsikord's Avatar
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    I'm currently of the mind that he can exist and that it does nothing to me, for me, or against me. He just is, which is a big problem with the character in general. He's so flat and that leads to him being used for whatever role might fit him best (whining about Barry, being Slade's lackey/flunky, questioning Damian's leadership, whatever the writer needs) and that's just... so unattractive to me. He needs some purpose that sets him apart from Barry, Wally, and Bart and he needs a name change that makes him more identifiable. When you say Wallace West people are gonna think the redheaded Wally, not this kid, so why not call him... Ace? Or something? And set him up as the cool, edgy Flash, equivalent to Jason Todd. It'd make him unique and dare I say maybe even interesting.

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  2. #47
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harpsikord View Post
    I'm currently of the mind that he can exist and that it does nothing to me, for me, or against me. He just is, which is a big problem with the character in general. He's so flat and that leads to him being used for whatever role might fit him best (whining about Barry, being Slade's lackey/flunky, questioning Damian's leadership, whatever the writer needs) and that's just... so unattractive to me. He needs some purpose that sets him apart from Barry, Wally, and Bart and he needs a name change that makes him more identifiable. When you say Wallace West people are gonna think the redheaded Wally, not this kid, so why not call him... Ace? Or something? And set him up as the cool, edgy Flash, equivalent to Jason Todd. It'd make him unique and dare I say maybe even interesting.
    That's supposed to be August Heart/Godspeed.

  3. #48
    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harpsikord View Post
    I'm currently of the mind that he can exist and that it does nothing to me, for me, or against me. He just is, which is a big problem with the character in general. He's so flat and that leads to him being used for whatever role might fit him best (whining about Barry, being Slade's lackey/flunky, questioning Damian's leadership, whatever the writer needs) and that's just... so unattractive to me. He needs some purpose that sets him apart from Barry, Wally, and Bart and he needs a name change that makes him more identifiable. When you say Wallace West people are gonna think the redheaded Wally, not this kid, so why not call him... Ace? Or something? And set him up as the cool, edgy Flash, equivalent to Jason Todd. It'd make him unique and dare I say maybe even interesting.
    it's intellectually dishonest to say anyone is thinking of red hair Wally as "Wallace West", everyone who knows of the character knows him as Wally. the only people who would, would be people who simply don't know that Wallace exists and are making the logical conclusion from Wally to Wallace; anyone who knows both can understand the difference. also Ace sounds as silly and dated as Dick but without the nostalgia of Robin to get a pass. Wallace as a name is fine, changing it further would be about as a clever as changing Bart, or Jai, or Irey's name (meaning not).

    also we don't need Wallace to be "edgy", consistently the people who actually like the character have complained about how poorly that was done when they introduced him. plus, they already have a Red Hood style speedster with Godspeed. what they need to do is put him in stories where he has agency, not just reacting to things that happen around him and, like with Cyborg, show him having fun and getting creative with his powers.
    Last edited by lemonpeace; 03-30-2020 at 08:50 PM.
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  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by The no face guy View Post
    I am quite aware of that thank you.
    Then why did you list among your favorite male heroes that have been replaced?

  5. #50
    Astonishing Member 9th.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    it's intellectually dishonest to say anyone is thinking of red hair Wally as "Wallace West", everyone who knows of the character knows him Wally. the only people who would, would be people who simply don't know the Wallace exists and are making the logical conclusion from Wally to Wallace; also Ace sounds as silly and dated as Dick but without the nostalgia of Robin to get a pass. Wallace as a name is fine, changing it further would be about as a clever as changing Bart, or Jai, or Irey's name (meaning not).

    also we don't need Wallace as the "edgy", consistently the people who actually like the character have complained about how poorly that was done when they introduced him, and they already have a Red Hood style speedster because Godspeed exists. what they need to do is put him in stories where he has agency, not just reacting to things that happen around him. and like with Cyborg, show him having fun and getting creative with his powers.
    Wallace is what I call him, it doesn't need to be harder than that. There are more complicated things in comics that people are completely ok with.
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  6. #51
    Astonishing Member 9th.'s Avatar
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    I'd be cool with a writer giving him a new "gimmick" to further set him apart from the others. Maybe speed clones or something.
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  7. #52
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harpsikord View Post
    He needs some purpose that sets him apart from Barry, Wally, and Bart and he needs a name change that makes him more identifiable. When you say Wallace West people are gonna think the redheaded Wally, not this kid, so why not call him... Ace? Or something? And set him up as the cool, edgy Flash, equivalent to Jason Todd. It'd make him unique and dare I say maybe even interesting.
    Well, one argument is that changing his name will only confuse things further. He's Wallace, the redhead is Wally, and that's honestly enough to get on with; if he becomes "Paul, the kid formerly known as Wallace formerly known as Wally" it'll be too much. But I have suggested he go by his middle name and be called Rudy. I don't think it would trip readers up that much. Though I have a vague memory of being told that was a quasi-racist name for some reason?

    As for something that sets him apart, I agree, he does need something. But honestly? As far as his niche goes I think him being the Flash's sidekick is enough. For now. There's damn few teen heroes who actually operate as sidekicks these days, so it's not just a unique niche for the Flash family, but DC as a whole. Let him patrol with Barry, actually learn from somebody more experienced, and hang with the Teen Titans (I like the idea of him leading, that's good) on weekends. The fact that Wally did this isn't a hurdle; sidekicking is a tradition, even if almost no one does it right now.

    I'd play up the fact that, unlike everyone else below the age of 17 today, Wallace is learning from the best. That should make him far more competent than other young heroes around his age who haven't been wearing masks for long (yknow, his peers). And that would play well into the idea of him becoming the leader of the Teen Titans too. So yeah, "Wallace West: Super Sidekick" is where I'd want him. For now. He'll grow beyond that role eventually, but for now I think it's as good a place as any for him to develop.

    I don't like the idea of saying "Nobody is filling this archetype/niche/role, so we're gonna put Wallace in there." How does that benefit him? We've got people complaining about how Wallace is a non-personality who just fits whatever the story needs. Pushing him into a specific niche is just defining and limiting who he is by who other people are. At least as a sidekick, the only character Wallace has to bend around is Barry. It's not great optics, I know, the only black character also being the only sidekick. But I think it'd be best for the character's development if he stayed where he is, stayed the course, and got to actually develop as a character instead of getting pushed into a position just because no one else is currently filling it.
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  8. #53
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9th. View Post
    I'd be cool with a writer giving him a new "gimmick" to further set him apart from the others. Maybe speed clones or something.
    How about they work on giving him a personality that stands out first and worry about the powers second? His powers aren't the problem. Him being about as interesting as dish soap is the problem.
    Last edited by Blue22; 03-30-2020 at 10:39 PM.

  9. #54
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9th. View Post
    Maybe speed clones or something.
    Bart already can do that.
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  10. #55
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9th. View Post
    I'd be cool with a writer giving him a new "gimmick" to further set him apart from the others. Maybe speed clones or something.
    One could look to the Hulk family for how iterations of the same hero can be still be different or lead to different powersets/ expressions. The "Speed Force" doesn't always have to result in someone exactly like the Flash.

    Or Wallace could end up with one of those other new "forces?"

  11. #56
    Fantastic Member The no face guy's Avatar
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    Overall I think he is a great character! He has a good wholesome personality, and his teenage angst works with Barry's paternalism. More importantly, I think it's great to have a regular Kid Flash back. Give it 15 years and if his popularity increases, he could take over as the Flash (Try it now and sales would most likely plummet)

    Wally West is the character DC really dropped the ball on. He is bar none one of the most popular characters in the DC universe, which is why I imagine the Titans was selling so good for the few years before they replaced the original line up with the Marv Wolfman characters, to coincide with the Netflix show.

    They should have kept a comic that gave fans of Wally, Roy and Donna a regular monthly read, where they could make regular cameos in the Flash, Wonder Woman & Green Arrow once it's rebooted. All in all, a really bad business move sales why for DC.

  12. #57
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    He's a much better character now. While I did not have a problem him replacing wally west, since DC was just springboarding off of the success from the DC TV show. I did have a problem with him being written as a stereotype. This was made even worse by the fact that they saw a Wally West done mostly right via the TV show. So it's not they didn't have a basis. Instead, they went with the stereotype which was very off putting. Of course, that got fixed, and now I thoroughly enjoy the character. Plus it's awesome that we have a black speedster. One of the things I've always had a problem when it comes to DC (and Marvel) is the fact that we're never really among the fastest, or the strongest characters, when in sports it's complete opposite. Wally West at least gives DC the prospect of having us sit at the table at least in speed category area.

  13. #58
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leo619 View Post
    He's a much better character now. While I did not have a problem him replacing wally west, since DC was just springboarding off of the success from the DC TV show. I did have a problem with him being written as a stereotype. This was made even worse by the fact that they saw a Wally West done mostly right via the TV show. So it's not they didn't have a basis. Instead, they went with the stereotype which was very off putting. Of course, that got fixed, and now I thoroughly enjoy the character. Plus it's awesome that we have a black speedster. One of the things I've always had a problem when it comes to DC (and Marvel) is the fact that we're never really among the fastest, or the strongest characters, when in sports it's complete opposite. Wally West at least gives DC the prospect of having us sit at the table at least in speed category area.
    He is the slowest speedster and even excluding speesters he cannot match most guys. I don't watch the cw show much. i can't comment on that. So how is wallace getting a seat at any table? Icon is pretty strong, fast... Etc. So, is val zod.

  14. #59
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    I was always okay with him.
    I was also always okay with Wally fans wanting the real Wally back because Wallace is obviously a completely new character, and doesn't fit his generation that already exists in the New 52 like Kori, Dick, and Roy
    Of course, I'm okay with the criticism that they're using delinquent black kid being "fixed" by a white mentor trope.
    I'm especially okay with Wally and Wallace side by side because they're such different characters. If they're the same then that will be more of a problem for me.

    What I wasn't okay with was the language some people used against Wallace back then. There's this one guy in the Newsarama comment section who always has an insult ready in any news about Wallace. You'd think people have better things to do.

  15. #60
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harpsikord View Post
    I'm currently of the mind that he can exist and that it does nothing to me, for me, or against me. He just is, which is a big problem with the character in general. He's so flat and that leads to him being used for whatever role might fit him best (whining about Barry, being Slade's lackey/flunky, questioning Damian's leadership, whatever the writer needs) and that's just... so unattractive to me. He needs some purpose that sets him apart from Barry, Wally, and Bart and he needs a name change that makes him more identifiable. When you say Wallace West people are gonna think the redheaded Wally, not this kid, so why not call him... Ace? Or something? And set him up as the cool, edgy Flash, equivalent to Jason Todd. It'd make him unique and dare I say maybe even interesting.
    I’d like to say because of DCeased Wallace is the Flash who survived the zombie outbreak of earth...but then again Blackest Night happened so probably not as unique as we would like to think.
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