The First Evil (Buffyverse) Vs The Masters of the Mystic Arts (MCU)

[KJS]

In the seventh and final season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, the First Evil waged war on the slayer line, using its agents to kill-off as many potential slayers as it could, before that epic final battle (when Willow turned all the remaining potentials into slayers and they took on the army of Ubervamps in the Hellmouth).

What would happen if the First Evil existed in the MCU and targeted the Masters of the Mystic Arts in a bid to kill-off the Sorcerer Supreme line?

Let's say both prime Doctor Strange and the Ancient One exist simultaneously for this battle, while every other Master of the Mystic Arts (and those who might become one) exist as well.

The First Evil has all of its agents from Buffy the Vampire Slayer (Bringers, the original Ubervamp and the Ubervamp army, Caleb and other humans dotted around the world - such as the female prisoner who tried to kill Faith).

Who else would the First Evil recruit and add to its ranks in the MCU? How far would it get in its attempts to take down the Masters of the Mystic Arts?

Go!

[Mider2009]

Didn’t see anything that impressive about the first evil, it needs a host no?

Never saw anything too impressive magic wise in the buffyverse

[The Drunkard Kid]

Didn’t see anything that impressive about the first evil, it needs a host no?

Never saw anything too impressive magic wise in the buffyverse

I mean, while the big stuff isn't common or easy, off the top of my head there were things like reality warping Wish Demons, reality warping wish spells, interdimensional portals, time manipulation, turning people into puppets/rats/etc..., mind wipes, inserting entire college degrees worth of info into someone's mind, the entire Slayer spell that can be used to essentially turn girls into super soldiers, soul manipulation magic, ressurection magic, making an entire town engage in musical shenanigans, turning a key-type-thingy into a teenaged girl and retroactively adding them into Buffy's family, trapping Glorificus (who is portrayed as something that seems to be analogous to MCU Dormammu, IIRC) into an infinitely weaker (though still extremely powerful by Buffy standards and decently powerful but MCU standards) humanoid form, implanting an elder God into a girl in such a way that they might become a *massive* plague if the process was interfered with (IIRC), doing something to severely depower said Elder God later on to prevent her from inadvertently blowing up most of America (again, IIRC), and so on.

[choptop]

Didn’t see anything that impressive about the first evil, it needs a host no?

Never saw anything too impressive magic wise in the buffyverse

How much of the show did you see?

[KJS]

Didn’t see anything that impressive about the first evil, it needs a host no?

Never saw anything too impressive magic wise in the buffyverse

I don't think you've ever seen Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Angel, have you?

As for the First Evil, it's the reason evil exists. Every evil being exists because of it and every act of evil occurs because it makes it happen. Its powers:

- It can take the form of dead people - convincingly, down to their scent - which is a powerful weapon in anyone's book when it comes to manipulating people and recruiting them to its cause. Imagine it appearing to Tony Stark as his mother, to Peter Quill as his mother, to Wanda Maximoff as her brother, or to Peter Parker as his uncle, for example.
- It can gather intel completely undetected, meaning it has the ability to stay one step ahead of its opponents.
- It can merge with its agents to make them superhumanly strong and durable. Think MCU Captain America level.
- It can create hypnotic triggers - especially in the minds of people with mental vulnerabilities (so, for example, if it wanted Bucky Barnes on its side, it could recruit him easily).
- It can alter reality on a small scale and replicate poltergeist-type activity (I'm referring to it terrorising Dawn Summers on one particular occasion).
- It already has an army of thousands of Ubervamps, Bringers, random humans and Caleb.
- It can appear as a monstrous head - which isn't all that great, but could be used to scare at least some people into working for it.
- Perhaps most importantly as far as this scenario is concerned, it could take control of people when they attempted to use magic.

Given its existing powers and resources, putting it in the MCU and giving it access to the characters in that universe, it's not going to be an easy victory for the Masters of the Mystic Arts by any stretch of the imagination.

[Powerboy]

I don't think you've ever seen Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Angel, have you?

As for the First Evil, it's the reason evil exists. Every evil being exists because of it and every act of evil occurs because it makes it happen. Its powers:

- It can take the form of dead people - convincingly, down to their scent - which is a powerful weapon in anyone's book when it comes to manipulating people and recruiting them to its cause. Imagine it appearing to Tony Stark as his mother, to Peter Quill as his mother, to Wanda Maximoff as her brother, or to Peter Parker as his uncle, for example.
- It can gather intel completely undetected, meaning it has the ability to stay one step ahead of its opponents.
- It can merge with its agents to make them superhumanly strong and durable. Think MCU Captain America level.
- It can create hypnotic triggers - especially in the minds of people with mental vulnerabilities (so, for example, if it wanted Bucky Barnes on its side, it could recruit him easily).
- It can alter reality on a small scale and replicate poltergeist-type activity (I'm referring to it terrorising Dawn Summers on one particular occasion).
- It already has an army of thousands of Ubervamps, Bringers, random humans and Caleb.
- It can appear as a monstrous head - which isn't all that great, but could be used to scare at least some people into working for it.
- Perhaps most importantly as far as this scenario is concerned, it could take control of people when they attempted to use magic.

Given its existing powers and resources, putting it in the MCU and giving it access to the characters in that universe, it's not going to be an easy victory for the Masters of the Mystic Arts by any stretch of the imagination.

This is pretty much it right here. The First Evil is clearly shown to have power over all evil beings even when the plot ignores having it use that power over all evil because, well, Buffy couldn't win if the First Evil constantly used it's high level powers that it is shown to have.

Being able to grant superhuman strength beyond even a slayer's strength is small potatoes. It could call upon beings like D'Hoffryn, the reality warping dude that controlled the reality warping Wish demons. That it didn't or did so to a minimal level is just classic ignoring of abilities because the heroine has to win. It's the same reason Willow went bonkers and had a huge fear of using her powers just when they got to be a manor reality warping level of power. Because it's a story, not a supernatural MMA fight. It's called "Buffy the Vampire Slayer", not, "Willow solves the problem in ten seconds and makes Buffy look irrelevant".

There's also the "Angel" characters the First Evil should have been able to call upon but didn't because it's a different show with a different story going on and on a different network.

By high-end logic, it has access to reality warping and even to stuff like time travel through beings like Illyria.

It's a tough argument though because it could be argued that Strange with the Time gem just locks it into a time loop, something that worked even on a being as powerful as MCU Dormammu, especially if we don't grant the First Evil anything but shown feats and not implied feats and assumed feats based upon it's cosmic level, albeit restricted highly in it's ability to affect the corporeal world. I perceive the FE as a cosmic being with most of the default nods we give to such beings with a restriction on it's ability to affect the solid world. But I also see it as something that is very hard to directly affect even by someone that can affect non-corporeal beings. Time Loop? Mind control? I'd see the FE as, "LOL. Nope. And you've got to be kidding?"

Granted Thor could wipe out most of it's minions by himself but since it's a scenario, the FE is insidious and if it controls beings that warp reality, well, let's hope the good guys have the Infinity gems or else.

[Tomzilla]

Despite being a huge fan of the Buffyverse, it’s easy (for me) to forget the First Evil existed. The Buffyverse has a myriad of powerful characters (e.g., Illyria, Jasmine, Willow, Spike, Glory, etc.) who’d fare well in the MCU. But the First Evil? It’s an omnipresent, malevolent spirit that predates the Old Ones/Powers That Be. It’s billions of years old and it’ll be haunting the Buffyverse long after its heroes are gone. Were it not for PIS/CIS, the First Evil would’ve wiped the Scooby Gang off the face of the earth, along with every other do-gooder. But what could it possibly do against the Ancient One, Dr. Strange, and the MCU as a whole?

Terrible, terrible things.

Firstly, I think it’d be an interesting twist if Strange and the Masters of the Mystic Arts discovered that the Ancient One drew power from the First Evil. She was able to draw power from the Dark Dimension without succumbing to evil, so it’d be interesting to see if she could do the same here. Given how tapping into magic/darkness/evil in the Buffyverse is the equivalent to inviting the First Evil into you, the Ancient One should tread carefully.

One burning question I have is whether or not the First Evil is a cosmic level entity. It only manifested on Earth, but since it has its evil fingerprints on every living being in every dimension (the Buffyverse is a collection of multiple universes/dimensions), I’d argue yes. Which doesn’t bold well for the MCU.

While the First keeps the sorcerers busy on Earth (or in other dimensions), using an assortment of MCU Villains and its own pawns as cannon fodder, the First takes a keen interest in Thanos. Thanos’s quest for the Infinity Gauntlet would give the First Evil the power to be omnipresent and omnipotent. The First Evil could do this without ever interacting with Thanos, although it would probably attract the Mad Titan’s curiosity/respect if it made its abilities to his conquest useful.

By the time the MCU heroes realize what’s going on, it’s too late. The First Evil has found a being strong enough to serve as its host if need be (Thanos is a massive upgrade over Caleb). Of course, Thanos’s willpower is immense, and if he didn’t want the First Evil invading his mind/body he might be able to resist. But the First Evil has power and influence over evil beings. At this point, I think Thanos w/ the Infinity Gauntlet realizes the First Evil is his ultimate enemy.

How all this ends it with Thanos w/ the Infinity Gauntlet declaring war on the First Evil. If there are any pure-hearted heroes left, they might form an uneasy alliance with the Mad Titan. But Thanos knows the First Evil is the embodiment of evil; it lives in every living being. As Caleb once said to the First Evil, “You're everywhere. You're in the hearts of little children, in the souls of the rich, you're the fire that makes people kill and hate, the cleansing fire that will cure the world of weakness. They're just sinners. You are Sin.”

With cold calculation, Thanos determines that the best way to eliminate the First Evil is by destroying everything and everyone in the MCU -- including himself. While the First taunts Thanos in the form of Gamora, Thanos does what he needs to do. Cue The Snap.

[Oswin]

I don't think you've ever seen Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Angel, have you?

As for the First Evil, it's the reason evil exists. Every evil being exists because of it and every act of evil occurs because it makes it happen. Its powers:

- It can take the form of dead people - convincingly, down to their scent - which is a powerful weapon in anyone's book when it comes to manipulating people and recruiting them to its cause. Imagine it appearing to Tony Stark as his mother, to Peter Quill as his mother, to Wanda Maximoff as her brother, or to Peter Parker as his uncle, for example.
- It can gather intel completely undetected, meaning it has the ability to stay one step ahead of its opponents.
- It can merge with its agents to make them superhumanly strong and durable. Think MCU Captain America level.
- It can create hypnotic triggers - especially in the minds of people with mental vulnerabilities (so, for example, if it wanted Bucky Barnes on its side, it could recruit him easily).
- It can alter reality on a small scale and replicate poltergeist-type activity (I'm referring to it terrorising Dawn Summers on one particular occasion).
- It already has an army of thousands of Ubervamps, Bringers, random humans and Caleb.
- It can appear as a monstrous head - which isn't all that great, but could be used to scare at least some people into working for it.
- Perhaps most importantly as far as this scenario is concerned, it could take control of people when they attempted to use magic.

Given its existing powers and resources, putting it in the MCU and giving it access to the characters in that universe, it's not going to be an easy victory for the Masters of the Mystic Arts by any stretch of the imagination.

Ya know, i think the First Evil would actually make a great villain for Dr. Strange, both comic and MCU versions. TFE coming up with various plots and schemes and Dr Strange dismantling them with varying succes.

But at the end of the day, TFE suffers from "I'm so powerful i can kill everything easily but i exist in a different spectrum of reality and can't do 1% of what im truly capable of" syndrom. Kinda like IT and Darkseid (though Darkseid is ofcourse a major threat even in his avatar form)

The uber vamps or caleb are nothing to Strange, unless we will involve massive PIS.

TFE is best used as a schemer in the shadows in the mcu, making other people do it's bidding, perhaps super powered beings like dormammu, or maybe Thanos (if he was similiar to his comic-book part) again, it would make for interesting stories.

[KJS]

Quick reminder: This isn't the First Evil Vs Doctor Strange - it's the First Evil trying to dismantle the Sorcerer Supreme line in the same way it attempted to do so with the Slayer line.

So, basically, the flunkies like Bringers (and probably even Caleb and the Ubervamp(s) in the MCU) would most likely be used to kill-off people with magic potential - like some guy in Dallas who drives a truck and has no idea he might have a future involving magic, or a young girl in Tokyo who hasn't left school yet.

It would enter the MCU scenario with a ready-made army to attack the weaker characters it needs to take out - the weaker flunkies are 100% important to the scenario - but when it comes to Strange and the actual sorcerers who already exist, it would indeed obviously need to recruit bigger evil guns, as well as exploit their use of magic, given that it can take over people when they use it.

[Marvel-Studios Rep]

Depends. If we go with what was actually shown of the First Evil, it probably gets curbstomped once enough research is done. If we go off statements and internal logic of the Buffy universe, it curbstomps.

[The Drunkard Kid]

Quick reminder: This isn't the First Evil Vs Doctor Strange - it's the First Evil trying to dismantle the Sorcerer Supreme line in the same way it attempted to do so with the Slayer line.

So, basically, the flunkies like Bringers (and probably even Caleb and the Ubervamp(s) in the MCU) would most likely be used to kill-off people with magic potential - like some guy in Dallas who drives a truck and has no idea he might have a future involving magic, or a young girl in Tokyo who hasn't left school yet.

It would enter the MCU scenario with a ready-made army to attack the weaker characters it needs to take out - the weaker flunkies are 100% important to the scenario - but when it comes to Strange and the actual sorcerers who already exist, it would indeed obviously need to recruit bigger evil guns, as well as exploit their use of magic, given that it can take over people when they use it.

He probably wouldn't really bother with Caleb or the Ubervamps in this scenario (or at least not have them as his main line of attack) when Mordo is right there and doing exactly that already.

[KJS]

He probably wouldn't really bother with Caleb or the Ubervamps in this scenario (or at least not have them as his main line of attack) when Mordo is right there and doing exactly that already.

Mordo wasn't picking off powerless people who might be sorcerers one day. The army that the First Evil specifically comes equipped with for this scenario could do that.

Moreover, there's no guarantee Mordo alone would succeed.