Conservative/Republican characters in movies/shows...

[Mister Mets]

How would a conservative character interact with the larger cast of coloured and LGBT people? Maybe they might not espouse openly bigoted comments to certain groups, but the conservative movement is basically unified in their opposition to trans people.

Some of this seems like interesting potential sources for conflict. Think about the most right-wing position a decent and reasonable person can hold on a controversy to do with race or LGBT issues, and that can be part of a conflict when someone is upset about the view.

On how conservatives will interact with trans people, there are going to be different responses and opinions from conservatives. Some conservatives view it as a mental health issue, the equivalent of something like anorexia or body integrity dysphoria. For various reasons, it's going to be difficult to depict someone who holds this view as a good guy, unless part of the story is the bigot realizing the error of their ways.

But there is a wide spectrum of other views that someone on the right can hold, from complete and total acceptance to ambivalence.

Regarding the potential conflicts between conservatives and people of color, it is worth noting that a big change in recent politics has been white liberals moving to the left, so members of minority groups, while still to the left, tend to be more moderate and accepting of different views.

https://www.vox.com/2019/3/22/182598...ing-trump-2020

Late term abortion comprise less than 2% of all abortions and is always medically necessary. It such a bullshit issue. Another issue the GOP lies about.

The available studies suggest the majority of third trimester abortions are not due to reasons of fetal health/ the health of the mother.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/...0.1363/4521013

If this were just about situations with serious medical complications, that would allow abortion opponents to agree to carefully established medical exceptions while pushing for a ban in other situations.

Modern means the last 50 years or so like the civil rights movement, so no goal posts being moved I only mentioned older events such as voting rights for women and other older issues to highlight my opinion that films present liberals as right n the long run not because of a bias but because that's reality...and you still haven't listed any changes that benefited society that were championed by conservatives and opposed by liberals that would suggest that it's not true.

Like I said, if there really is a bias in Hollywood about liberals being portrayed as being right in the long term then it should be easy to point to numerous issues that they are ignoring that would portray conservatives in a similar fashion, and yet when I ask for such examples I never get any responses and that lack of evidence I think points to why you can have characters that are conservative and are portrayed in a positive light , but not shows where conservative ideology as a whole is seen as positive. You can be a decent person and identify as conservative, but the ideology in the American political spectrum just has too much negative baggage to be positive.

I did mention electronic/ online voting. This is something liberals generally advocated for, until there was a greater recognition of the potential downside of hacking.

If we're going with 1970 as the beginning, and looking at issues where conservatives and liberals were on different sides (so conservatives wouldn't get credit for George W Bush's work on AIDS in Africa as this wasn't really a partisan issue) there are some example of conservatives on the correct side, like allowing the use of DDT to combat Malaria in Africa, the Reagan doctrine helping end the Cold War, the greater choice for parents with charter schools, and the rise in policing to push back against the rise in crime. It's hard to appreciate how bad it was; the murder rate in New York City in the early 1990s was about four times what it currently is.

[Kirby101]

There is no medical usage of "late term abortion" btw, that is a Republican word game, propaganda again.

[Steel Inquisitor]

I did mention electronic/ online voting. This is something liberals generally advocated for, until there was a greater recognition of the potential downside of hacking.

Varies. Liberals who lived through the W Bush years know how this is is a disaster.

[The Overlord]

It's a fair point that there may be a storytelling bias in favor of liberals, as agents of change. There are some other biases about the types of stories we tell that could contribute to a skewed vision of the world. Stories are much likely to be about survivors than the first to perish. They're more likely to be about the underdogs, even if some underdogs are on the wrong side (For example, anti-vaxxers are underdogs.)

But I don't think this is the complete story. Exploring political differences is a potential source of conflict for fiction. Red tape can be a source of complications in a lot of procedurals. There's potential drama in someone having to defend themselves against allegations of biogtry and wrongdoing.

There are many ways to tell stories about people trying to maintain a status quo. One option is to feature someone affected by new standards, especially in the periods of overcorrection where there's an overcompensation for past mistakes. Another is to feature someone who doesn't want to change being punished for that, like in The Man For All Seasons.

On the specific points about Republicans, I'm not sure how conservatives not reckoning with the southern strategy connects to the central question here. It's a shortcoming, but what does it have to do with the depiction of conservatives works of fiction? It's unlikely to be germane to a story, just as Democrats having a history of failing to acknowledge the history of socialist regimes is rarely relevant (except in something like The Americans.)

As for the Unite the Right rally, that was a small group of idiots. It's less representative of Republicans than extreme campus activists are of Democrats. Granted, extreme campus activists are more likely to be well-meaning.

I think the Southern strategy is a good reason why I think conservatism does not deserve my respect and really since the Southern strategy involves racists hiding their true intentions under dog whistles, what is the better story, someone falsely accused of bigotry or someone who hides their bigotry with dog whisles?

The problem with conserverving the status quo is the status quo often is not fair to many people, it was not fair to African Americans before the Civil Rights era (and still not completely fair to them now) and was not fair to gay people before 2015. I think it's hard for me to sympathize with a character who wants to persevere a status quo that is not just to some groups. I mean how would you do a conservative X-Men story?

The fact that one of the biggest conservative comic writers, Chuck Dixon went alt right does not help matters. Ditto with Ethan Van Sciver being a Comics Gate guy.

[The Overlord]

Some of this seems like interesting potential sources for conflict. Think about the most right-wing position a decent and reasonable person can hold on a controversy to do with race or LGBT issues, and that can be part of a conflict when someone is upset about the view.

On how conservatives will interact with trans people, there are going to be different responses and opinions from conservatives. Some conservatives view it as a mental health issue, the equivalent of something like anorexia or body integrity dysphoria. For various reasons, it's going to be difficult to depict someone who holds this view as a good guy, unless part of the story is the bigot realizing the error of their ways.

But there is a wide spectrum of other views that someone on the right can hold, from complete and total acceptance to ambivalence.

Regarding the potential conflicts between conservatives and people of color, it is worth noting that a big change in recent politics has been white liberals moving to the left, so members of minority groups, while still to the left, tend to be more moderate and accepting of different views.

https://www.vox.com/2019/3/22/182598...ing-trump-2020

The available studies suggest the majority of third trimester abortions are not due to reasons of fetal health/ the health of the mother.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/...0.1363/4521013

If this were just about situations with serious medical complications, that would allow abortion opponents to agree to carefully established medical exceptions while pushing for a ban in other situations.


I did mention electronic/ online voting. This is something liberals generally advocated for, until there was a greater recognition of the potential downside of hacking.

If we're going with 1970 as the beginning, and looking at issues where conservatives and liberals were on different sides (so conservatives wouldn't get credit for George W Bush's work on AIDS in Africa as this wasn't really a partisan issue) there are some example of conservatives on the correct side, like allowing the use of DDT to combat Malaria in Africa, the Reagan doctrine helping end the Cold War, the greater choice for parents with charter schools, and the rise in policing to push back against the rise in crime. It's hard to appreciate how bad it was; the murder rate in New York City in the early 1990s was about four times what it currently is.

The rise in policing also led to the mass incarceration problem and police militarization s why Black Lives Matter is a movement, it's not been a uniformity positive thing.

Also, Reagan handled the AIDs crisis pretty poorly and his economic policies created the income gap we see today. I would not put Reagan's record as equal to the Civil Rights movement. I think the Southern strategy taints the whole movement, IMO.

Conservatives are wrong all the time and never take responsibility for their mistakes, they just flipflop, they were wrong about the necessity of the Iraq War, they were wrong about gay marriage causing a disaster if it was legalized and they were wrong when they downplayed the coronavirus:

https://www.vox.com/2020/3/20/211867...erage-fox-news

https://www.newsweek.com/rush-limbau...ushing-1488580

Is this an ideology worthy of respect, where its adherents make errors all the time and never stand by their decisions?

[Wildling]

Ditto with Ethan Van Sciver being a Comics Gate guy.

Is EVS even a thing anymore? He had already left DC Comics before the current industrial shutdown where GOP people say if old, possibly dead soon people live in Corona-wrecked Florida they should be glad the Lord works in mysterious, possibly Trump-favoring ways.

[The Overlord]

Is EVS even a thing anymore? He had already left DC Comics before the current industrial shutdown where GOP people say if old, possibly dead soon people live in Corona-wrecked Florida they should be glad the Lord works in mysterious, possibly Trump-favoring ways.

He is still around:

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/etha...tailers-alike/

I do not think it puts conservatism in a good light when 2 of the biggest conservative comic book creators, Chuck Dixon and Ethan Van Sciver, went to the alt-right.

[Wildling]

He is still around:

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/etha...tailers-alike/

I do not think it puts conservatism in a good light when 2 of the biggest conservative comic book creators, Chuck Dixon and Ethan Van Sciver, went to the alt-right.

And while I'm sure Chuck left his mark at the time, I might have spotted EVS's name in passing in only one DC movie credits I remember.

I hope more people remember Brad Pitt mocking conservatives while winning an Oscar for his Tarantino movie, or during Covid-19 spoofs. As dope as Sinestro Corps War was drawn.

[jetengine]

The Masterpiece Cake Shop case was about a guy who did not want to make wedding cakes for gay marriages. He cited religious objections. If the court had ruled against him, he would not be able to stick to his principles and keep operating.

Yeah he should of lost that case. When I go to work I do my fucking job, I dont give my opinions because its not what I'm paid to do. This person is given money to bake not tell me what they think, so they can either shut the **** up and bake the cake or expect a lawsuit for discrimination. But its America so nope.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I think the Southern strategy is a good reason why I think conservatism does not deserve my respect and really since the Southern strategy involves racists hiding their true intentions under dog whistles, what is the better story, someone falsely accused of bigotry or someone who hides their bigotry with dog whisles?

The problem with conserverving the status quo is the status quo often is not fair to many people, it was not fair to African Americans before the Civil Rights era (and still not completely fair to them now) and was not fair to gay people before 2015. I think it's hard for me to sympathize with a character who wants to persevere a status quo that is not just to some groups. I mean how would you do a conservative X-Men story?

The fact that one of the biggest conservative comic writers, Chuck Dixon went alt right does not help matters. Ditto with Ethan Van Sciver being a Comics Gate guy.

When/how did Dixon go Alt-Right?

*edit*

Never mind, google answered. Sigh...

[ed2962]

Yeah he should of lost that case. When I go to work I do my fucking job, I dont give my opinions because its not what I'm paid to do. This person is given money to bake not tell me what they think, so they can either shut the **** up and bake the cake or expect a lawsuit for discrimination. But its America so nope.

That's a tricky one though. If that couple wanted a swastika cake and I was the owner, I don't think I'd bake it either.

[jetengine]

That's a tricky one though. If that couple wanted a swastika cake and I was the owner, I don't think I'd bake it either.

Thats the preeminent symbol of a hate group. Its very different.

[Kirby101]

The question I always ask, if it was a mixed race couple and the guy refused, would conservatives like Mets still support him. Was it okay for restaurants to not serve black people for religious objections? After all, until recently the Mormon Church considered black people undeserving. And many Southern Baptist still think mixed marriages should be illegal.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Thats the preeminent symbol of a hate group. Its very different.

And used as a banner for people who killed millions. That sends a very direct message.

As much as religious people like to think that they own marriage, the right to marry is 1) For all practical purposes, property of the state and 2) Something practiced by all religions. No one religion owns marriage, anymore than they might own the right to put their teachings in a book.

[Tuck]

The Tribunal that originally cited (ruled against?) the cake guy explicitly mocked his religious beliefs in the decision they made.

That's why SCOTUS overruled.

Being smug can bite you in the ass.