How should THE CREEPER be portrayed?

[Scott Taylor]

I hold the pretty strong opinion that just about every Ditko character (I'll give you Hawk & Dove and maybe Captain Atom, haha) should be treated with regard, to some extent, for Ditko's intentions with them, and almost every single one of them is portrayed with complete disregard for his original conception.

Making Blue Beetle a comedic goofball instead of a more mature gadgeteer Spider-Man, making the Question a zen new-ager or conspiracy theorist as opposed to a stoic paragon with an extremely unconventional but ruthlessly consistent moral code... you get the idea. There's a common trend of other DC writers and creators dismissing Ditko's ideas for his characters.


And, for the purposes of this thread, making the Creeper legitimately mentally ill, when to start, he was basically a less stoic and more casual Vic Sage, with powers, who pretended to be a supernatural creature.

Little to be found of the original take in many of the comics and cartoons I've seen since.

I'll be frank - I don't think that cartoonish mental illness played for laughs is a good look for any super-hero. I'd be willing to entertain the notion of Creeper being mildly high all the time, but that would be about as far as I'd want to go with that.

Spider-Man and his entire supporting cast were also quite different under Ditko than how they turned out. But I feel like the Ditko run is easily top five Spider-Man stories and pretty damn good arguments can be made for it being the best.

[John Venus]

Anybody else remember the Batman/Creeper team up in Batman: The Brave and the Bold in the 70's written by Alan Brennert wherein Batman and Creeper both fought a paper powered serial killer? Good times. I found it interesting that back then Creeper was just putting on an act and in reality was just an ordinary sane man.

I love the TNBA take on the character. Tying him into Joker was brilliant. I also like the fact that he uses a patch to maintain his normal sense of self but takes it off in order to become the Creeper. It's a great allegory for the mentally ill; he is sane and coherent so long as he takes his meds but goes off the rails if he doesn't. However, even if he does go off the rails, he is still deep down a good guy, just expressing himself differently and unconventionally. It also makes him a great foil for the 'irredeemable' Joker.

[kcekada]

I may be remembering this wrong, but weren't the Creeper's abilities enhanced when he switched to costumed form? I though it had something to do with a drug he ingested or was injected with that enhanced him -- but the effects were gone when he switched back to being only Ryder. They return when he transforms back into Creeper -- with the aid of some technological device. Whatever the case, I enjoyed the character in his 70s appearances -- Joker, Super-Team Family, etc.

I wouldn't change the original look. I wasn't even happy when they replaced the speedo with trunks. He's one character that should still be wearing his underwear on the outside!

[Robotman]

I hold the pretty strong opinion that just about every Ditko character (I'll give you Hawk & Dove and maybe Captain Atom, haha) should be treated with regard, to some extent, for Ditko's intentions with them, and almost every single one of them is portrayed with complete disregard for his original conception.

Making Blue Beetle a comedic goofball instead of a more mature gadgeteer Spider-Man, making the Question a zen new-ager or conspiracy theorist as opposed to a stoic paragon with an extremely unconventional but ruthlessly consistent moral code... you get the idea. There's a common trend of other DC writers and creators dismissing Ditko's ideas for his characters.


And, for the purposes of this thread, making the Creeper legitimately mentally ill, when to start, he was basically a less stoic and more casual Vic Sage, with powers, who pretended to be a supernatural creature.

Little to be found of the original take in many of the comics and cartoons I've seen since.

I'll be frank - I don't think that cartoonish mental illness played for laughs is a good look for any super-hero. I'd be willing to entertain the notion of Creeper being mildly high all the time, but that would be about as far as I'd want to go with that.

I think Ditko was obviously onto something great with The Creeper but I think the changes were for the better. His original main gimmick was having a device that swapped out his clothes. Jack Ryder in his business suit could press a button and he’s instantly in his weird Creeper getup. I mean the concept was kinda interesting as a spy gadget but once you get the main character using it as a crazed vigilante it loses its appeal fast. Focusing on the character’s insane traits is far more interesting. I know the Jekyll and Hyde thing has been done countless times but DC didn’t have any legitimately “crazy/zany” heroes at the time. Not really a surprise that that was the aspect that writers focused on going forward.

[John Venus]

Ditko's a great artist. Not necessarily a great writer. His concepts were often improved through other writers tinkering with them. The only one I'm on the fence about it is the Blue Beetle. I remember reading the character's original appearances online and there was something more appealing about the more serious adult Spider-man but with gadgets version than the goofball the character got turned into. But the goofball is the more popular and long lasting iteration of the character and the one that people know best so it could just be my taste not aligning with the mainstream.

[signalman112]

Anybody else remember the Batman/Creeper team up in Batman: The Brave and the Bold in the 70's written by Alan Brennert wherein Batman and Creeper both fought a paper powered serial killer? Good times. I found it interesting that back then Creeper was just putting on an act and in reality was just an ordinary sane man.

I love the TNBA take on the character. Tying him into Joker was brilliant. I also like the fact that he uses a patch to maintain his normal sense of self but takes it off in order to become the Creeper. It's a great allegory for the mentally ill; he is sane and coherent so long as he takes his meds but goes off the rails if he doesn't. However, even if he does go off the rails, he is still deep down a good guy, just expressing himself differently and unconventionally. It also makes him a great foil for the 'irredeemable' Joker.

Indeed I do, Alan Brennert didn't write many stories but when he did the stories were very good to excellent.

B&B178.jpg

[Sideways]

The Creeper has always been one of my favorite DC characters. I have all of his comics and comic appearances in the modern age to my knowledge and I am know working on some of the older issues. He needs to be dark.

[claytonemery]

I've always loved the Creeper -- who else has "Beware the" before his name? But he was never implemented fully. It was slipshod, and missed several opportunities.

I've created a fanfic comic strip and am trying to even out the Creeper's origin and style and PURPOSE. While keeping to Ditko's original.

So far I have this interpretation. It used some of the Vertigo Parisian Creeper, and some Baron Mordo. Attachment 101984

One huge addition from the Secret Origins was drugs. Jack Ryder, dressed as the Creeper, crashes a mob party. They beat and half kill him (this is pre-powers). THEN they inject him with a ton of dangerous designer drugs, enough to kill an elephant. Then they throw him in with Dr. Yatz.

Yatz gives Ryder the serum and the "activator" (bad name). But what that means is, when Jack Ryder sports the Creeper disguise, he ALSO brings the drugs into his system. So they make him nuts.

So, if you posit the Creeper is zonked on drugs, it makes more sense for him to be many kinds of crazy. Manic, sad, wild, aggressive.

This could have been better portrayed if the audience could SEE through the Creeper's eyes. Every vision would be distorted in a perfect Ditko style. (Instead, Shade the Changing Man got that, a real stinker.)

So the Creeper is battling mobsters, but suddenly they're MONsters. He's swinging wild because his vision is distorted, might hit a wall or a goon, but when he connects, it hits like a piledriver. He may crush a villain or bring down the roof.

Add in that, whenever he changes back to Jack Ryder, he's not sure what happened. Maybe a total blackout. Did I kill someone? Maybe fuzzy images that give him clues to solve a case.

Another option that was missed was the soldier-disguise thing. Never explored.

So there's definitely room for improvement.