All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[hyped78]

How many innocent, unarmed children and teenagers shot down by police do you think is acceptable before protest should be considered?

Does the police in the US kill more white or black people every year? They kill more white people, in absolute figures. So then you say "but whites are a higher proportion of the population than blacks, hence blacks are killed at a higher rate". Yes, but who proportionately has the highest crime rates in the US?

Regarding "protest", I am all in favor of peaceful protest (which most of BLM protests were, let me emphasize this!) but not in favor of violent protests. I hope you feel the same.

[InformationGeek]

More with the ever charming Robin Vos of Wisconsin.

Speaker Vos (R) says it saddens him to "think how many Americans would be alive in our workforce doing things help make America great if we hadn't had easy abortion access."

Noting some exceptions, he adds "If you get pregnant ... you've made a commitment to deliver that child."

[Vakanai]

As a % of total population or - what is actually relevant - as a % of total violent crime offenders (homicide, robbery, aggravated assault)?

Are you really trying to blame black people right now?

[Godzilla2099]

As a % of total population or - what is actually relevant - as a % of total violent crime offenders (homicide, robbery, aggravated assault)?

How many innocent, unarmed children and teenagers shot down by police do you think is acceptable before protest should be considered?

The amount of people shot by the police is a tiny fraction compared to people shooting each other. These communities need to focus their energy and look in the mirror if they're looking to improve. Crime Rates have been out of control lately. 50 people shot in Chicago during Memorial Day Weekend (The Mayor's Response is Laughable. Beyond obvious he's not going to do jack crap)



What's even scarier is that more and more of these violent crimes are being committed by younger offenders.

[Username taken]

Are you really trying to blame black people right now?

It's a baffling sentiment.

If innocent men, women, and children are being murdered by the people ostensibly meant to protect them, I think protests are in line.

It's not even an American thing because we've seen people protest police brutality all over the world at different points in time. The difference is the US has an historical problem with disenfranchising certain groups and using everything under the sun to screw up said groups.

[Username taken]

The amount of people shot by the police is a tiny fraction compared to people shooting each other. These communities need to focus their energy and look in the mirror if they're looking to improve. Crime Rates and Statistics have been out of control lately. 50 people shot in Chicago during Memorial Day Weekend (The Mayor's Response is Laughable. Beyond obvious he's not going to do jack crap)



What's even scarier is that more and more of these violent crimes are being committed by younger offenders.

Correct me if I'm wrong, isn't violence against any race in the US propagated primarily from people from the same race?

It's a worthless statistic that doesn't even begin to address the structural problems with American society.

[Vakanai]

These communities need to focus their energy and look in the mirror if they're looking to improve.

You realize this is the same thing that racists have said for decades right? Blame minority communities for their problems and never look at the systemic issues.

[numberthirty]

You realize this is the same thing that racists have said for decades right? Blame minority communities for their problems and never look at the systemic issues.

While "Blame..." isn't what the did exactly, you can address both things at the same time.

That The Black Panthers ever made even a little headway is proof of that.

[Kirby101]

Does the police in the US kill more white or black people every year? They kill more white people, in absolute figures. So then you say "but whites are a higher proportion of the population than blacks, hence blacks are killed at a higher rate". Yes, but who proportionately has the highest crime rates in the US?

Regarding "protest", I am all in favor of peaceful protest (which most of BLM protests were, let me emphasize this!) but not in favor of violent protests. I hope you feel the same.

Yes I do. Here in New York, the damage from the BLM protests were attributed to gangs (mostly white) who used the protest as cover to loot stores. Most of the other violence was from the police against the protestors.

As to crime, there is a straight correlation between poverty and crime, regardless of race. Of course many people only care about street crime and ignore the white collar crime and the way corporations constantly rip of the public and put them in danger.

Do you have the figures for innocent people killed by police according to race?

[Kirby101]

I guess those soft on crime Democrats have figured it out, since the murder rate in Blue States is lower than in Red States.

[thwhtGuardian]

Turns out, they did condemn it Mets. Including the future President.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ts/3317862001/

Yeah, even in the false equivalence of equating the Jan. 6 insurrection to BLM protests the difference is still clear.

I don't get why it's so hard for Conservatives to denounce Jan. 6th as a truly terrible act.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Yeah, even in the false equivalence of equating the Jan. 6 insurrection to BLM protests the difference is still clear.

I don't get why it's so hard for Conservatives to denounce Jan. 6th as a truly terrible act.

Perhaps because in their heart of hearts, they didn’t believe it was, just patriots being patriots that day.

[Vakanai]

Perhaps because in their heart of hearts, they didn’t believe it was, just patriots being patriots that day.

Or they don't care about patriotism and just wish their unlawful coup had been successful. If the Jan 6 traitors had been successful does anyone believe the leaders of the Republican party would have stepped down in protest? Np, those who survived would try to lead the new fascist state under leader Trump.

[Mister Mets]

Every GOP pulls the BLM rioters out of their hats when talking about the 6th and both sides.

There is a huge difference. Most of the left spoke out against and denounced the violence in the BLM protests and encouraged protesters to stay peaceful as that was the right way to get their message across.

Meanwhile back in reality on the 6th we have a sitting president call the terrorists special people and he loves them. We have so many on the right talking about pradons and calling them heroes.

It is not at all a both sides issue.

Your comment about "most of the left" raises a question. Is there any place that kept track of the different responses to confirm that a majority of Democratic elected officials and candidates (which seems to be one working definition of "most of the left") were calling out anyone who caused property damage in black lives matter protests? Meanwhile, are the majority of Republican elected officials and candidates calling the people who broke into the capitol heroes?

Some Republicans are saying stupid things, but it does not appear to be a majority.

One complication with the black lives matter comparisons is that those protestors seemed more likely to receive deferred resolution agreements. It does seem that more January 6 rioters were prosecuted than rioters involved in BLM protests.
https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/24-m...20misdemeanors.
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/over-...demonstrations

Another difference in how it's discussed is that Republicans are criticized for not talking enough about it afterwards. The point is that they were angrier when the memories were raw. But with that comparison, Democrats aren't exactly eager to continue calling out BLM protestors who went too far.

1. Has Kevin McCarthy or any of the GOP leadership publicly rebuked Green for her outlandish comments and actions? Have a majority of “normies” from the Republican base noticeably criticized her for her behavior? Nope. Tacit approval. Unless we are shown otherwise we can assume she speaks for the majority.

2. False equivalence. The difference is intent. BLM protesters were not storming the Capitol and hunting representatives in order to overturn an election.

1. Congressional leaders rarely rebuke their members. It would be good if they did it more, but they just don't.

That said, McCarthy has called her out a few times.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...-videos-325579

One salient point is that Marjorie Taylor Greene seems to have gotten a bit more restrained since her reelection. She's similar in that way to Ilhan Omar, whose first term was much more troubled.

2. Process questions are about procedure, not intent. If someone lights a restaurant on fire, it's not all that important whether they're upset about something serious. They were wrong to do that.

Or they don't care about patriotism and just wish their unlawful coup had been successful. If the Jan 6 traitors had been successful does anyone believe the leaders of the Republican party would have stepped down in protest? Np, those who survived would try to lead the new fascist state under leader Trump.

How would the coup have worked?

[Malvolio]

Actually, intent counts a lot. If a restaurant owner burns down his own restaurant for the insurance money, a judge will often hand down a harsher sentence than they would to someone who burned down a business as a political statement, especially if the protester made sure the building was empty before burning it down.