All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[Johnathan]

Yeah, they still haven't ever won any Election on the national level. Seems like they struggle to get even 1% of the vote most of the time. Political movements that are destined to succeed have something called momentum. A far better strategy would be to run as Democrats, then change Party affiliation once in office. At this point, I wonder if their goal is to actually get elected.

At the same time, a big part of the problem is that progressives are pursuing political office. It's a serious mistake as the labor movement and the Civil Rights movement did not succeed by getting their activists into office.

I don't know when it started, but the idea that these movements need to hold office is doomed to failure. The constitution and wider bureaucracy of government is designed to prevent movement and to slow activity down. Political movements have much more freedom and influence when they concentrate collective power outside government. Like look at Jimmy Hoffa and Martin Luther King Jr. Politicians in office are hamstrung by the rules and laws of that office and that government - a government designed to place the interests of the wealthy and powerful over the common people.

So, it is smarter to support leaders outside government that can organize and motivate massive numbers of common people to force action on the part of the people in the offices. After all, the wealthy and powerful are using that wealth and power to force government to do what they want and they don't hold office. Even fake billionaire Trump is a lightweight compared to the real economic titans who would consider being a president several steps down for them.

[Jack Dracula]

If Democrats don't have the votes, there are other ways to pass the legislation.

Instead of having one giant 700+ page bill on voting reform, they could split it into smaller pieces.

I’m sure that if you’ve thought of that, the people whose job it is to think of these things have also thought of it. They obviously have their reasons for not doing so at this point.

[Tami]

Michael Flynn allies allegedly plotted to lean on Republicans to back vote audits

FBI agents and the House panel investigating the January 6 attack on the Capitol have both learned of an alleged plan by allies of retired army Lt Gen Michael Flynn to gather “intelligence” on top Republicans to “move” them to back election audits in key states Trump lost, said ex-whistleblower Everett Stern who talked to the panel and the FBI.

Stern, who runs the intelligence firm Tactical Rabbit and is a Republican vying for a Senate seat in Pennsylvania, in multiple interviews with the Guardian said two Flynn associates with the rightwing Patriot Caucus group enlisted his help in April in a scheme to seek potentially damaging information on two Republican members of Congress to prod them to back an audit of the 2020 vote that Joe Biden won.

Stern told the Guardian he spent several hours in November telling House panel investigators about the alleged drive by Flynn associates who sought campaign finance and other dirt on Pennsylvania’s Senator Pat Toomey and Congressman Brian Fitzpatrick to win their support for an audit to bolster Trump’s debunked charges that Biden’s win was fraudulent.

[Mister Mets]

I’m sure that if you’ve thought of that, the people whose job it is to think of these things have also thought of it. They obviously have their reasons for not doing so at this point.

It makes sense with reconciliation bills where there are a limited number of opportunities. Congress is limited to three of those bills a year, on certain types of legislation, affecting spending, revenues and the debt limit. They can only do one per year in each category, with taxing and spending typically combined. They can get an extra shot at it by considering fiscal rather than calendar years, but I can understand the need to combine bills in that case.

https://www.cbpp.org/research/federa...reconciliation

The main argument for massive bills is that some things have to work in concert, although it seems like you could have separate votes for making Election Day a national holiday, mandating the restoration of voting rights to felons, establishing criteria for independent redistricting commissions, or insisting that states accept eligible votes cast in provisional ballots on the wrong precinct.

What often happens is that it's a way to hide things that are controversial or unlikely to pass on the merits individually. The public generally supports Voter ID, so a bill that mandates that states would need to accept a wide range of forms of non-photographic identification in places where ID is required to vote may not be able to get 48 votes in the Senate. But a Senator questioned on that can say she voted for it as part of a package that includes less controversial stuff like chain of custody requirements.

[shooshoomanjoe]

Biden sent lethal aid to Ukraine. I hope things don't escalate there. We don't need more wars.

[Kirby101]

Biden sent lethal aid to Ukraine. I hope things don't escalate there. We don't need more wars.

I think the hope here is to make Putin think twice about invading. Make it more costly than he will chance. The alternatives are no military aid, which makes it easy for Putin, or send US and NATO troops, which might keep Putin away, or escalate things. It is a good measured response.

[Kirby101]

If Democrats don't have the votes, there are other ways to pass the legislation.

Instead of having one giant 700+ page bill on voting reform, they could split it into smaller pieces.

What GOP blinders do you have on to think the GOP will support any of the measures that Biden wants.
Mitch has made it clear, stop anything Biden wants to do, the Country be damned.
The only bills they will okay are ones that give more $ to their corporate overlords.

The country needs massive infrastructure spending. And you are okay with pennies to some small things.
The tide is rising and the GOP will agree to pebbles on the shore.

Oh, I forgot, maybe they will vote for the BBB if we outlaw all abortion, get rid of corporate taxes and stop teaching about slavery.

[JB]

Biden sent lethal aid to Ukraine. I hope things don't escalate there. We don't need more wars.

I agree. With Kyiv and Donbas still at war, that aid will be used to keep it ablaze as it has since 2014. Just like Russia has sent aid to Donbas. It's a proxy war that I hope doesn't turn into an overt war. It's the last thing the entire world needs.

[Tami]

Virginia attorney general urges Supreme Court to overturn Roe

Virginia’s new Republican attorney general announced Friday night that the state was withdrawing from a legal brief defending a woman’s access to abortion, arguing that the landmark Roe v. Wade decision should be overturned.

In a major about-face for the state on the hot-button issue, Jason Miyares said Virginia would no longer be part of a friend-of-the-court brief before the Supreme Court arguing Mississippi’s restrictive ban on abortion after 15 weeks of pregnancy was unconstitutional.

Late last year, Miyares’s Democratic predecessor, Mark Herring, signed onto the brief urging the Supreme Court to find that the Mississippi law ran afoul of the Roe decision. He was joined by 23 other attorneys general.

The Supreme Court is considering a challenge to the Mississippi law by the state’s last abortion clinic, which says the law creates a near total ban on abortion in the state.

[Mister Mets]

What GOP blinders do you have on to think the GOP will support any of the measures that Biden wants.
Mitch has made it clear, stop anything Biden wants to do, the Country be damned.
The only bills they will okay are ones that give more $ to their corporate overlords.

The country needs massive infrastructure spending. And you are okay with pennies to some small things.
The tide is rising and the GOP will agree to pebbles on the shore.

Oh, I forgot, maybe they will vote for the BBB if we outlaw all abortion, get rid of corporate taxes and stop teaching about slavery.

If you don't want to pass stuff with Republican votes, you need to elect more Democrats to congress. With a 50/50 Senate and narrow house majority, it is difficult to find the votes to pass ambitious legislation.

[Kirby101]

If you don't want to pass stuff with Republican votes, you need to elect more Democrats to congress. With a 50/50 Senate and narrow house majority, it is difficult to find the votes to pass ambitious legislation.

This is true. I am continually saddened that these Americans, who support these legislation by almost 2 to 1, continually elect Republicans who will never support them. In the case of the BBB, it's 80%. The imbalance in population in the Senate is one reason it is this close, but more it's people who don't understand what is really happening in Washington. The Republican Senators who are stopping this will bare no consequences from their voters. Unfortunately. It has beco9me increasingly clear that people do not vote with their brains.
And the sad thing is, with just a few Republicans who say they are moderate, like Collins or Romney, these would pass. But instead, nothing will happen, and the voters will blame the Democrats for not passing things in an evenly divided Senate, with to recalcitrant Senators and a completely obstructionist GOP. As if giving Congress to the GOP will get anything done. They will deplore the "gridlock", say stupid stuff like "why doesn't Congress...?" and then vote for a Party with no plans, whose only objective will be blocking Judges.

[JB]

If you don't want to pass stuff with Republican votes, you need to elect more Democrats to congress. With a 50/50 Senate and narrow house majority, it is difficult to find the votes to pass ambitious legislation.

The passing of the infrastructure bill gave me hope that more progress could be made but here we are.

In other news just hitting the wires:

Russia war fears escalate as Germany and US order Ukraine evacuation amid invasion threat
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world...est-putin-news

The German Federal Foreign Office is working on plans to evacuate its embassy employees in Ukraine should the country’s situation worsen, Bild has reported. The US is one step ahead of Germany, with non-essential staff at its embassy begging evacuations “as early as next week”, according to a US Government source cited in CNN.

[Malvolio]

Well, thank you for wasting our time quoting the posts I referenced when I said, "maybe once a month..." and did a search to see how often it happened.

Not that it makes him much more relevant around this forum.

I've got this concept that Bill Maher does not, and should not "speak for liberals" and the less that's said about him, the better off everyone will be.

In all fairness, you didn't just say "once a month." You also said, "...everybody just seems to point out how s***ty he is and wonder why he's still on HBO." I defended Maher and so did Iron Maiden and Username taken. I don't like the idea of putting everyone into a box of "I love this guy 100%" or "I hate this guy 100%." To be sure, some people do easily fit into boxes like that. But for me, Bill Maher is not one of them. Yes, sometimes I do think he's an *******. He is these days when it comes to his opposition to Covid restrictions. But he is right when he points out absurdities on the left that make it difficult for some people to bring themselves to vote for Democratic candidates. I wish more people would consider those absurdities instead of reflexively getting defensive about it.

[Johnathan]

I think the hope here is to make Putin think twice about invading. Make it more costly than he will chance. The alternatives are no military aid, which makes it easy for Putin, or send US and NATO troops, which might keep Putin away, or escalate things. It is a good measured response.

This is a good point. Russia has more to lose in an outright military confrontation. It's similar to responses and actions taken to support Taiwan against China or Japan and South Korea against North Korea.

[kidfresh512]

In all fairness, you didn't just say "once a month." You also said, "...everybody just seems to point out how s***ty he is and wonder why he's still on HBO." I defended Maher and so did Iron Maiden and Username taken. I don't like the idea of putting everyone into a box of "I love this guy 100%" or "I hate this guy 100%." To be sure, some people do easily fit into boxes like that. But for me, Bill Maher is not one of them. Yes, sometimes I do think he's an *******. He is these days when it comes to his opposition to Covid restrictions. But he is right when he points out absurdities on the left that make it difficult for some people to bring themselves to vote for Democratic candidates. I wish more people would consider those absurdities instead of reflexively getting defensive about it.

The issue people have with this "both sides" bs is it's not in any way equal. Are there some left leaning policies that are out of touch with what an average American might want? Sure, but they are fringe. The policies that are currently being pushed and voted on are by all measures extremely popular.

GOP don't even have any plans or policies. They only want to stop the libs and spread lies and misinformation. Make it harder for black people to vote rather than try to woo minorities with policies that appeal to their needs. So there is always a kneejerk reaction when people try to highlight some fringe policy on the left that no one is actually checking for anyway.

When someone tells me "I just can't bring myself to vote for a Democrat" .And Then I think but you can vote for a Republican? Who literally stands for nothing now except the cultish following of crazies. Again NO policies, they only push conspiracies and try to make people fear some dark boogeyman. Heaven forbid students get an education and learn about how the country was built. No thats ,"woke", the catchall for I want to be as offensive as I want with no consequences.