All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[Kirby101]

It's the Republicans who are moving Right. The Dems standing still look like they are moving Left.

[Gray Lensman]

It's the Republicans who are moving Right. The Dems standing still look like they are moving Left.

The Dems are still moving left - much of what Biden is trying to do would have been considered too radical under Clinton and even Obama. They are, however, not moving to the left anywhere NEAR as fast as the Republicans have moved to the right already. While the latter have long been primed for the changes they went through, the speed was enough to stun even longtime party wonks (as evidenced by Boehner's recent words).

[Kirby101]

The Dems are still moving left - much of what Biden is trying to do would have been considered too radical under Clinton and even Obama. They are, however, not moving to the left anywhere NEAR as fast as the Republicans have moved to the right already. While the latter have long been primed for the changes they went through, the speed was enough to stun even longtime party wonks (as evidenced by Boehner's recent words).

Clinton raised taxes on the rich and wanted Universal Healthcare. Obama wanted trillions for infrastructure but was stymied by Mitch and the Republicans. I admit that on social issues the Dems are more progressive now, but so is the rest of the country. It is only the GOP mouthbreathers that remain in last century.

[Tami]

Clinton raised taxes on the rich and wanted Universal Healthcare. Obama wanted trillions for infrastructure but was stymied by Mitch and the Republicans. I admit that on social issues the Dems are more progressive now, but so is the rest of the country. It is only the GOP mouthbreathers that remain in last century.

I can see a shift, but it's not a tectonic shift. The Republicans began shifting as soon as they absorbed the Dixiecrats and no longer identified with the same values espoused by Lincoln.

You could say that when the Republicans absorbed the Dixiecrats, they became schizophrenic/Bi-polar. The problem is, with the Republicans, is that this was a classic case of split personality where one side acted as if the other side didn't exist, while the other side was lying beneath the surface, coming out when it could, then retreating again.

The problem with the Republicans now is that the other side, the darker side, the far left side, is taking full control and pushing out the original personality.

The Tea Party wasn't something new, it was a manifestation of something that had been with the Republicans for a long time, but it was the first manifestation of the other side taking control.


As for Democrats, the shift began as early as FDR, as early as the breaking away of the Dixiecrats, as early as the social movements of the '60s. It a direction the Democrats have been heading in for some time now.

[Hypestyle]

One interesting wrinkle with the Gaetz stories is that we haven't heard from any of the women.

When that happens, when telegenic young women give interviews about how they were betrayed and taken advantage of, Gaetz's problems will become more worse.

It will be interesting, depending on who is willing to talk, and to what kind of news outlet and the format (print, TV, radio). If it's a right-leaning outlet, the women will be attacked.

[Gray Lensman]

Clinton raised taxes on the rich and wanted Universal Healthcare. Obama wanted trillions for infrastructure but was stymied by Mitch and the Republicans. I admit that on social issues the Dems are more progressive now, but so is the rest of the country. It is only the GOP mouthbreathers that remain in last century.

Your chart has one big error already - Biden has been governing to the left of Obama and where Hilary campaigned. He is asking for unity, but is (smartly) refusing to be beholden to it. If the Republicans unite in opposition to a popular proposal, he is perfectly willing to just run over them as much as the process allows. I think he is aware that they aren't negotiating in good faith, or from a place close enough to what he is angling for to make compromise worthwhile and this credit, isn't going to fall for the ruse.

Not to mention 'moving to the left' to me means 'from a starting position of where they were the last time they held power' as opposed to 'in relation to other parties worldwide'.

[Tami]

Your chart has one big error already - Biden has been governing to the left of Obama and where Hilary campaigned. He is asking for unity, but is (smartly) refusing to be beholden to it. If the Republicans unite in opposition to a popular proposal, he is perfectly willing to just run over them as much as the process allows. I think he is aware that they aren't negotiating in good faith, or from a place close enough to what he is angling for to make compromise worthwhile and this credit, isn't going to fall for the ruse.

Not to mention 'moving to the left' to me means 'from a starting position of where they were the last time they held power' as opposed to 'in relation to other parties worldwide'.

I agree you can't compare the U.S. to other nations, just as you can't compare them to us or to each other. That's like placing me on the same scale of medical knowledge as Dr. Fauci, and, as smart as I am, I never went to Medical School.

That's the worst fallacy. How each country defines left, right, moderate, or whatever is based on their unique histories, social structure, political structure, and society in general.

[The Cool Thatguy]

So it turns out Trump hasn't been subtle about ripping off his supporters. Shocking!

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/03/u...NL6qKmcsEsW9Rc

[Tendrin]

Your chart has one big error already - Biden has been governing to the left of Obama and where Hilary campaigned. He is asking for unity, but is (smartly) refusing to be beholden to it. If the Republicans unite in opposition to a popular proposal, he is perfectly willing to just run over them as much as the process allows. I think he is aware that they aren't negotiating in good faith, or from a place close enough to what he is angling for to make compromise worthwhile and this credit, isn't going to fall for the ruse.

Not to mention 'moving to the left' to me means 'from a starting position of where they were the last time they held power' as opposed to 'in relation to other parties worldwide'.

These charts are never accurate, largely because they're operating from a white, class reductionist place more often than not and misunderstand European political alignments.

[PwrdOn]

These charts are never accurate, largely because they're operating from a white, class reductionist place more often than not and misunderstand European political alignments.

If all of Europe is a bunch of white class reductionists, and all non-white countries are authoritarian dictatorships, what country out there is a good model for leftists to aspire to?

[Tami]

If all of Europe is a bunch of white class reductionists, and all non-white countries are authoritarian dictatorships, what country out there is a good model for leftists to aspire to?

Our own. Who says America needs role models? Why can't we be innovative and become role models for others?

[PwrdOn]

Their own. Who says America needs role models? Why can't we be innovative and become role models for others?

Because America is practically synonymous right wing capitalism worldwide, and has probably been the single greatest force in holding down left wing movements pretty much wherever we have a military presence, which is everywhere. The American left has never accomplished a goddamn thing yet we love to pat ourselves on the back for meaningless milestones like getting a black woman elected to an entirely powerless position, or celebrating that there are no longer any kids in cages at the border, because all of the fences have been replaced with plastic sheets.

[numberthirty]

Our own. Who says America needs role models? Why can't we be innovative and become role models for others?

Taking a honest look at our track record?

I wouldn't put a dime and a lone White Castle Slider on us.

[OopsIdiditagain]

I thought these charts were for economics and/or types of governments? Why do people use them for liberal vs conservative?

[Tendrin]

If all of Europe is a bunch of white class reductionists, and all non-white countries are authoritarian dictatorships, what country out there is a good model for leftists to aspire to?

Good thing I didn't say any of that.