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  1. #1906

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    The main relevance of the popular vote in that context is that it is helpful in winning the electoral college (and before anyone brings up Hillary Clinton and Al Gore, neither won a majority of the popular vote.)

    As for congressional elections, it was a different time for Democrats. No one thought the segregationist Senators who had at that point recently filibustered the civil rights bill were on the side of the rioters.

    It hurt Republicans that some morons went to the capital to march with guns.

    It doesn't help Democrats when people pissed off at cops are taking over police stations and burning out pharmacies.

    My point was more that leading the UK during World War 2 might have been the most important act of any prime minister ever, so that you were responding to an odd dismissal.

    This is an underappreciated problem.

    The big box stores can afford the losses, but it might discourage them from coming back.

    Local businesses might not have the resources to recover.

    Wouldn't this approach encourage riots, by letting people know that if they riot, they'll benefit from it?
    NO. It encourages the state to make sure that a democracy represents the will of the people so they don't have to.

    I know you're a Republican, so that concept no longer makes any sense to you, but that's it.

    Quote Originally Posted by williamtheday View Post
    Was George Fowley supposed to have asked himself that while he was dying? Was the truck driver beaten within an inch of his life by rioters in 1992 supposed to have asked himself that? How about the woman run down by that scum in Charlottesville?
    The driver beaten in 1992 was Reginald Denny.

    And you're missing the point. You're putting the onus on people caught up in the violence.

    The responsibility relies on the state to not put the populace in a powerless situation where they feel there only alternative is violence.
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  2. #1907
    Astonishing Member jetengine's Avatar
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    Its like France. People joke that they riot at the drop of a hat but frequently its because their governments do shitty things, and the fear of a riot ensures a politician has to think twice before doing something dumb.

  3. #1908
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    Quote Originally Posted by williamtheday View Post
    Was George Fowley supposed to have asked himself that while he was dying? Was the truck driver beaten within an inch of his life by rioters in 1992 supposed to have asked himself that? How about the woman run down by that scum in Charlottesville?
    If the respective states did thier jobs-none of that happens

    NO way on Earth should ANY group of people rush the capital with guns and not go home in body bags or jail. Yet we saw that. All over hair salon and getting Chili's food.

    Far too many times we have seen double standards.

    Because certain segments of folks dislike a set of people for no more than the color of skin.


    Because someone did NOT make an example out of Zimmerman.

    Because someone did not remove folks who had piles upon piles of complaints on them.

    Because UNQUALIFIED folks were allowed to be cops and got so scared they shot black men. Despite having backup.

    Because we got folks who were silent as a group of so-called comic fans felt entitled to go after people like Heather Antos.

    We keep seeing this mess over and over again. Because SOMEBODY did not put their foot down.

  4. #1909
    Horrific Experiment JCAll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuro no Shinigami View Post
    States are better able to manage their resources without a federal government intervention
    That may be so, but the situation is that there weren't/aren't resources. States fighting eachother for tests and supplies, and fighting the Fed who want to stop them for some insane reason.
    Just the worst possible way things could have gone.

  5. #1910
    Astonishing Member Electricmastro's Avatar
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    What Iím really concerned about at this point isnít so much the looting and property destruction, as stuff can be replaced, but lives cannot, and if this escalates in such a way that death threats will be made against not only the police officers, but also their families and children, then thatís surely a different matter entirely that Iím sure is worth considering at this point, as well as the lives of innocent, non-police civilians that may get caught in the crossfires in this pursuit of destruction.

    And now that quite a bit has been destroyed and surely quite a number of innocent people have had their lives put at risk in the course of that destruction by now, Iím also wondering where the situation goes from here and what solutions, if any, are to be put in place.

  6. #1911

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    The idea that we just couldn't have any idea how racist cops could be so out of control...

    Trump literally encouraged cops to treat suspects roughly. And now he's encouraging them to open fire on looters. Just like he gave tacit approval to white supremacists for months, and we ended up with Charlottesville.

    This... really isn't that complicated of an issue anymore. George Floyd was deliberately choked to death in front of witnesses, with cameras, for eight excruciating minutes. And yet, it took days to make even a single arrest. The other three cops present, two of whom helped hold Floyd down, are currently still free... and anyone who has a problem with it and is protesting in the street is getting attacked.

    This is a failure of the state to do anything about several previous incidents, and this one is simply the most brazen we've seen. But something should have been done long ago about this problem. Michael Brown got gunned down, Freddie Gray got taken for a "rough ride", Sandra Bland got mysteriously killed in custody, and Eric Garner got choked to death... and yet, Trump emboldened the cops to be even more brutal. And so it was...
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  7. #1912
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    It hurt Republicans that some morons went to the capital to march with guns.

    It doesn't help Democrats when people pissed off at cops are taking over police stations and burning out pharmacies.
    I think this is probably not as straightforward as you would like to think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Wouldn't this approach encourage riots, by letting people know that if they riot, they'll benefit from it?
    I was going to write initially that nobody wants a riot, even the rioters, but then realized how wrong that is.

    Only underprivileged populations don't want riots. Otherwise there would never not be riots. It's a means of last resort, and ought to be entirely understandable.

    Privileged people, on the other hand, are all-to anxious to riot. Because their favorite team loses. Or their favorite team wins. Or they are required to wear masks. Sometimes they don't riot. Sometimes they dare the government to instigate a riot (showing up at the capitol with assault weapons and masks).

    It's the privileged folks who are itching for a fight. The underprivileged just want the system to work the same for everyone.
    Last edited by JamesonAnders; 05-29-2020 at 02:06 PM.

  8. #1913
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    I received an email about a civil vigil and protest to be held this weekend. I probably won't go, but kinda feel bad about that. It would be nearly an hour drive for me.
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  9. #1914
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    So much pearl clutching here. What about the businesses??? What about the pharmacies??? Do you really think people who are being executed by the STATE really give a shit about whether a Walmart exists? They’re fighting for their lives.

    Americans all love their violence and killing, but only when it’s directed against someone else. You celebrate like no other about slaughtering the British. The Indians. The Mexicans. You loved sending all those boys over to Europe and Korea. You couldn’t kill enough Vietnamese, or Iraqis or Afghans. Where do I even start with Latin America?

    But as soon as the violence is turned against the white, patriarchal, capitalist power structure, then it’s awful. Looting is awful. Look how upset y’all are about people stealing TVs and t-shirts. Black people are losing their lives because the STATE hates them and their existence and is happy to kill them.

    The USA was born out of a violent revolution. It’s time for another. If you think that’s a bad idea then surely you are against the first one that happened in 1776. All men are created equal? Pfft. Cops still treating some as three-fifths.

  10. #1915
    "Comic Book Reviewer" InformationGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    I received an email about a civil vigil and protest to be held this weekend. I probably won't go, but kinda feel bad about that. It would be nearly an hour drive for me.
    There's going to be one in my community as well here in central Wisconsin.

  11. #1916
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    The USA was born out of a violent revolution. It’s time for another. If you think that’s a bad idea then surely you are against the first one that happened in 1776. All men are created equal? Pfft. Cops still treating some as three-fifths.
    The implication here is that violent revolution begets violent revolution. How about we just mature a bit and have a peaceful revolution? If we don't believe that's truly possible, then we need to just find a way to live with the riots and stop complaining about them.

  12. #1917
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    So much pearl clutching here. What about the businesses??? What about the pharmacies??? Do you really think people who are being executed by the STATE really give a shit about whether a Walmart exists? They’re fighting for their lives.

    Americans all love their violence and killing, but only when it’s directed against someone else. You celebrate like no other about slaughtering the British. The Indians. The Mexicans. You loved sending all those boys over to Europe and Korea. You couldn’t kill enough Vietnamese, or Iraqis or Afghans. Where do I even start with Latin America?

    But as soon as the violence is turned against the white, patriarchal, capitalist power structure, then it’s awful. Looting is awful. Look how upset y’all are about people stealing TVs and t-shirts. Black people are losing their lives because the STATE hates them and their existence and is happy to kill them.

    The USA was born out of a violent revolution. It’s time for another. If you think that’s a bad idea then surely you are against the first one that happened in 1776. All men are created equal? Pfft. Cops still treating some as three-fifths.
    Not all revolutions are violent. There is more than one way to create change.
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  13. #1918
    Ultimate Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    What Iím really concerned about at this point isnít so much the looting and property destruction, as stuff can be replaced, but lives cannot, and if this escalates in such a way that death threats will be made against not only the police officers, but also their families and children, then thatís surely a different matter entirely that Iím sure is worth considering at this point, as well as the lives of innocent, non-police civilians that may get caught in the crossfires in this pursuit of destruction.

    And now that quite a bit has been destroyed and surely quite a number of innocent people have had their lives put at risk in the course of that destruction by now, Iím also wondering where the situation goes from here and what solutions, if any, are to be put in place.
    The people fighting ARE innocent civilians. What donít you get about that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Not all revolutions are violent. There is more than one way to create change.
    Colonialism and pathetic police state started as slave patrollers that would catch any runaway Black slave. Why would those same institutions not be morally reprehensible but also something that canít be taken down without sort sort of direct action. Itís time to stop being naive. The kneeling protest was peaceful, ďHands Up, Dont ShootĒ was peaceful. Instead of worrying about private property being damaged, worry about all the Black ppl who were unjustly murdered by a racist institution.
    Last edited by Tycon; 05-29-2020 at 02:39 PM.

  14. #1919
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    So much pearl clutching here. What about the businesses??? What about the pharmacies??? Do you really think people who are being executed by the STATE really give a shit about whether a Walmart exists? Theyíre fighting for their lives.

    Americans all love their violence and killing, but only when itís directed against someone else. You celebrate like no other about slaughtering the British. The Indians. The Mexicans. You loved sending all those boys over to Europe and Korea. You couldnít kill enough Vietnamese, or Iraqis or Afghans. Where do I even start with Latin America?

    But as soon as the violence is turned against the white, patriarchal, capitalist power structure, then itís awful. Looting is awful. Look how upset yíall are about people stealing TVs and t-shirts. Black people are losing their lives because the STATE hates them and their existence and is happy to kill them.

    The USA was born out of a violent revolution. Itís time for another. If you think thatís a bad idea then surely you are against the first one that happened in 1776. All men are created equal? Pfft. Cops still treating some as three-fifths.
    What should this new violent revolution call for?

    And how do you think voters, elected officials, and the military would respond?

    Trump lost Minnesota by two points in 2016. Do you think swing voters would agree with rioters that he should not be in power?

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesonAnders View Post
    I think this is probably not as straightforward as you would like to think.



    I was going to write initially that nobody wants a riot, even the rioters, but then realized how wrong that is.

    Only underprivileged populations don't want riots. Otherwise there would never not be riots. It's a means of last resort, and ought to be entirely understandable.

    Privileged people, on the other hand, are all-to anxious to riot. Because their favorite team loses. Or their favorite team wins. Or they are required to wear masks. Sometimes they don't riot. Sometimes they dare the government to instigate a riot (showing up at the capitol with assault weapons and masks).

    It's the privileged folks who are itching for a fight. The underprivileged just want the system to work the same for everyone.
    Do you think we can trace a correlation between privilege and willingness to riot, to show that there is more rioting in privileged sections of the country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Electricmastro View Post
    What Iím really concerned about at this point isnít so much the looting and property destruction, as stuff can be replaced, but lives cannot, and if this escalates in such a way that death threats will be made against not only the police officers, but also their families and children, then thatís surely a different matter entirely that Iím sure is worth considering at this point, as well as the lives of innocent, non-police civilians that may get caught in the crossfires in this pursuit of destruction.

    And now that quite a bit has been destroyed and surely quite a number of innocent people have had their lives put at risk in the course of that destruction by now, Iím also wondering where the situation goes from here and what solutions, if any, are to be put in place.
    It's probably premature to worry about widespread death threats to families of police officers. It's essentially criticism of something that hasn't happened yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by worstblogever View Post
    NO. It encourages the state to make sure that a democracy represents the will of the people so they don't have to.

    I know you're a Republican, so that concept no longer makes any sense to you, but that's it.
    How has the blue state of Minnesota failed to have a democracy that represents the will of the people?
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  15. #1920
    Ultimate Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    How has the blue state of Minnesota failed to have a democracy that represents the will of the people?
    By arresting a black news reporter before the police officer that murdered George Floyd in cold blood. That’s how. That shows the citizens that the fraternity of thugs that they call “law enforcement” care more about their brethren than the people they’re “supposed” to protect.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    What should this new violent revolution call for?
    The abolishment of the police.

    https://plsonline.eku.edu/insidelook...rican-policing

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