1. #23311
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    So Mr. President how’s the whole unity thing going?

    Does anyone here really believe the GOP is going to work with Biden and not do anything they can to stifle his agenda at every level with the filibuster? I wish I could be that naive....
    I suppose Biden had to try, even if in his heart of hearts, he knew preaching unity with Republicans who, mere weeks earlier, sided with Trump in a failed crusade to overturn the election was unlikely to bear fruit. The GOP will throw every monkey wrench they have into the machinery to stymie Biden’s agenda in the hope of disillusioning voters in time for the 2022 midterms.
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  2. #23312
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    I suppose Biden had to try, even if in his heart of hearts, he knew preaching unity with Republicans who, mere weeks earlier, sided with Trump in a failed crusade to overturn the election was unlikely to bear fruit. The GOP will throw every monkey wrench they have into the machinery to stymie Biden’s agenda in the hope of disillusioning voters in time for the 2022 midterms.
    At least this way people know who it is that truely wanted Unity, and who it is that only wanted to escape punishment by creating a distraction.
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    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    “The President Threw Us Under the Bus”: Embedding With Pentagon Leadership in Trump’s Chaotic Last Week

    On the evening of January 5—the night before a white supremacist mob stormed Capitol Hill in a siege that would leave five dead—the acting secretary of defense, Christopher Miller, was at the White House with his chief of staff, Kash Patel. They were meeting with President Trump on “an Iran issue,” Miller told me. But then the conversation switched gears. The president, Miller recalled, asked how many troops the Pentagon planned to turn out the following day. “We’re like, ‘We’re going to provide any National Guard support that the District requests,’” Miller responded. “And [Trump] goes, ‘You’re going to need 10,000 people.’ No, I’m not talking bullshit. He said that. And we’re like, ‘Maybe. But you know, someone’s going to have to ask for it.’” At that point Miller remembered the president telling him, “‘You do what you need to do. You do what you need to do.’ He said, ‘You’re going to need 10,000.’ That’s what he said. Swear to God.”
    I could not recall the last time a contingent that large had been called up to supplement law enforcement at all, much less at a demonstration—the Women’s March and the Million Man March sprang to mind—and so I asked the acting SECDEF why Trump threw out such a big number. “The president’s sometimes hyperbolic, as you’ve noticed. There were gonna be a million people in the street, I think was his expectation.” Miller maintained that initial reports on the anticipated crowd size were all over the map—anywhere from 5,000 to 40,000. “Park Police—everybody’s so hesitant to give numbers. So I think that was what was driving the president.”
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    Mighty Member SquirrelMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    It's dumb. It happens in politics.

    Hillary Clinton claimed to be under sniper fire during a visit in Bosnia with Sheryl Crowe and Sinbad to visit US troops.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...selections2008

    Richard Blumenthal, the Senator from Connecticut, is another example. He repeatedly talked about his service in Vietnam, when he took multiple deferments before getting a posting in a Marine Reserve unit in DC.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/18/n...lumenthal.html
    Whataboutism is my life elixir.

  5. #23315
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Chocolate war leaves the world's top cocoa producer stuck with beans

    Nobody is suffering more from a global chocolate standoff than the Ivory Coast cocoa farmer.

    Less than two years after the top cocoa producer teamed up with neighboring Ghana to force companies from Hershey to Nestle to pay more for their beans, the attempt to exert control over prices is backfiring. Buyers are refusing to pay up, beans are piling in warehouses upcountry and farmers are so desperate that some even slept outside the offices of Ivory Coast's cocoa regulator demanding action.

    "We have suffered with our cocoa piling up," said Baba Kampe, a 45-year-old farmer with 8 hectares (20 acres) in Daloa who was among those sleeping outside the regulator's offices Monday. "It has been difficult to feed our children."

    The cooperation to charge the $100 billion chocolate industry a premium of $400 per metric ton was intended to boost income for some of the world's poorest growers, the West African nations said. But for many cocoa traders, processors and chocolate makers, it was an OPEC-style attempt to boost prices that lacked the supply-and-demand economics key to that cartel's success.
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  6. #23316
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    Have you been alive in America the last four years? For almost half the population, it works. I guarantee that Cotton will pay no political price for lying about his service.
    I should have had the disclaimer "Not including Donald Trump"

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  8. #23318
    Sans Pants ChadH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Well, the other problem is that even if a Republican feels Trump is guilty, there's always the problem of how much of their constituency feels the same way and whether they would hold a vote against Trump against the politician himself/herself when they come up, for re-election.

    But then you'll have politicians who publicly say they voted one way when they actually did the opposite.

    (Not the politicians would ever lie to try and win votes or anything . . . )
    Ultimately it isn't important what they claim after the fact, but more that they're given the opportunity to vote with their conscience without the risk of repercussion.
    The fact that McConnell would hold his fellow party members accountable is objectively unethical.
    That sort of intimidation wouldn't be allowed in a regular criminal court and absolutely should not be in a case of this magnitude.
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  9. #23319

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    It's dumb. It happens in politics.

    Hillary Clinton claimed to be under sniper fire during a visit in Bosnia with Sheryl Crowe and Sinbad to visit US troops.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...selections2008

    Richard Blumenthal, the Senator from Connecticut, is another example. He repeatedly talked about his service in Vietnam, when he took multiple deferments before getting a posting in a Marine Reserve unit in DC.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/18/n...lumenthal.html
    WHOA. Whataboutism?

    Classy. Reminds me of someone you claim you don't like.
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  10. #23320
    Astonishing Member JackDaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadH View Post
    Ultimately it isn't important what they claim after the fact, but more that they're given the opportunity to vote with their conscience without the risk of repercussion.
    The fact that McConnell would hold his fellow party members accountable is objectively unethical.
    That sort of intimidation wouldn't be allowed in a regular criminal court and absolutely should not be in a case of this magnitude.
    At some point if fit for office you have to show some guts surely.

    Anonymous votes do have disadvantages..it allows people to get away with voting in ways that might be against their proclaimed public stance.

    The next time elections came round the electorate would not really know the true voting record.

    Accountability to the public would be reduced...surely undesirable in a democracy.

  11. #23321
    Silver Sentinel BeastieRunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackDaw View Post
    At some point if fit for office you have to show some guts surely.

    Anonymous votes do have disadvantages..it allows people to get away with voting in ways that might be against their proclaimed public stance.

    The next time elections came round the electorate would not really know the true voting record.

    Accountability to the public would be reduced...surely undesirable in a democracy.
    I agree that Legislative votes should always be public and private citizen votes should always be anonymous.

    Parties, special interest groups, and term limits are things that have a greater affect on how legislators vote, IHMO.
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  12. #23322
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    ...

    So Mr. President how’s the whole unity thing going?

    Does anyone here really believe the GOP is going to work with Biden and not do anything they can to stifle his agenda at every level with the filibuster? I wish I could be that naive....
    Worth noting that Sanders had a more realistic approach to what was obviously going to come to pass.

    Might be time for Biden to discuss this approach with him.

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    Apparently the COVID Vaccine has a new name, the "Fauci Ouchie"

    Twitter fell in love with the name given to it by a 6 year old girl.
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  14. #23324
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadH View Post
    Ultimately it isn't important what they claim after the fact, but more that they're given the opportunity to vote with their conscience without the risk of repercussion.
    The fact that McConnell would hold his fellow party members accountable is objectively unethical.
    That sort of intimidation wouldn't be allowed in a regular criminal court and absolutely should not be in a case of this magnitude.
    As folks have pointed out in the past, it's not really a "Court..." case.

    You have to take it for what it is.

  15. #23325
    Sans Pants ChadH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    As folks have pointed out in the past, it's not really a "Court..." case.

    You have to take it for what it is.
    I'm not claiming it's a regular court case. It's actually of greater importance. It affects the entire country and thus requires a certain level of impartiality only acquired through anonymous voting.


    Quote Originally Posted by JackDaw View Post
    At some point if fit for office you have to show some guts surely.
    Heh, no. Republican Senators aren't known for having an abundance of guts.
    I mean, unless it's a fake display of courage against imaginary oppression.

    Anonymous votes do have disadvantages..it allows people to get away with voting in ways that might be against their proclaimed public stance.
    That's the point I'm trying to make. We want them to vote with their conscience without concern for the official record or the need to pander to the party base.

    The next time elections came round the electorate would not really know the true voting record.

    Accountability to the public would be reduced...surely undesirable in a democracy.
    It would only be for matters of extreme importance. I don't mean for every single vote.
    Last edited by ChadH; 01-23-2021 at 03:36 PM.
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