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  1. #1831
    Mighty Member babyblob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetengine View Post
    If peaceful protests get you shit then violence may.
    I can understand violence for the sake of social change. I dont agree with it but I understand it. Looting a target is not violence for the sake of social change. It is a handful of people taking advantage of a horrible situation for personal gain.

    I am sure that 99 percent of the protesters are upset about what happened and are wanting change. But there is that 1 percent who show up because they are looking for trouble.

    Its like those alt right idiots who show up armed at those protests to reopen states. I doubt some of them care about the shut down. They just want to wave their guns and hope for a confrontation with police.
    Last edited by babyblob; 05-29-2020 at 03:30 AM.
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  2. #1832
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    I have no patience for looters who raise havoc for no other reason than because they enjoy it. They should be arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law since they fuck things up for peaceful protestors.
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  3. #1833
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    The same people who constantly talk about MLK rarely seem to listen to him.

    To "end" riots you have to address the conditions that created the anger and frustration in the first place.

    Peaceful protests serve no purpose if there is no change as a result -- it's the equivalent of telling people they can abuse you without consequence.

    As one commenter pointed out, in their efforts to "progress" Europeans rarely practiced the "nonviolence" they often claim to admire in others.

    Especially with regards to non-whites -- like George Floyd or Breonna Taylor or Botham Jean -- and other people of color.
    Last edited by aja_christopher; 05-29-2020 at 03:56 AM.

  4. #1834
    Astonishing Member Kusanagi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aja_christopher View Post


    The same people who constantly talk about MLK rarely seem to listen to him.

    To "end" riots you have to address the conditions that created the anger and frustration in the first place.

    Peaceful protests serve no purpose if there is no change as a result.

    As one commenter pointed out, Europeans -- like the officers who killed Floyd -- rarely practiced the "nonviolence" they often claim to admire in others.

    Especially with regards to non-whites and other people of color.
    Seriously, the lockdown protests weren't even a month ago, they featured white men with guns at various capitals.
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  5. #1835
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    Noteworthy that both became more moderate as they got older.

    And that both were killed as they rose in "non-violent" prominence.

    I'll add that the protesters in Minneapolis were people from all backgrounds so many understand this isn't a "black vs. white" issue anymore.

    It's an American issue and it needs to be resolved if we intend to move forward as a nation.
    Last edited by aja_christopher; 05-29-2020 at 04:31 AM.

  6. #1836
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kusanagi View Post
    Seriously, the lockdown protests weren't even a month ago, they featured white men with guns at various capitals.
    They don't always need guns.



    Suppressing the vote works as well -- while police officers cover the violent aspect of said partnership.
    Last edited by aja_christopher; 05-29-2020 at 04:32 AM.

  7. #1837
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    I have no patience for looters who raise havoc for no other reason than because they enjoy it. They should be arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law since they fuck things up for peaceful protestors.
    Just burn down all the police stations in the city I say. Then the cops will know what it feels like to be the victims of targeted, systematic abuse and oppression.

    And I’m generally not in favor of the death penalty because there’s a chance that the courts can get it wrong and execute innocent people. But that cop is on film murdering. Inject.

  8. #1838
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    Just burn down all the police stations in the city I say. Then the cops will know what it feels like to be the victims of targeted, systematic abuse and oppression.

    And I’m generally not in favor of the death penalty because there’s a chance that the courts can get it wrong and execute innocent people. But that cop is on film murdering. Inject.
    That won't solve anything -- regardless of the actions of these officers, people need (trustworthy) police in society.

    And those police need to be overseen and kept in check by the public that they serve.



    What is needed is to remove Republicans from power so that we can enact -- and keep -- legislation in place that addresses these problems directly.

    Whether Americans will do that remains yet to be seen.
    Last edited by aja_christopher; 05-29-2020 at 04:47 AM.

  9. #1839
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    I have no patience for looters who raise havoc for no other reason than because they enjoy it. They should be arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law since they fuck things up for peaceful protestors.
    This whole situation is absolutely gut wrenching because we all lose. Both the left and the right will use this ordeal to strengthen their case against each other. instead of learning to change society for the better, we end up even more divided. The disturbing images on George Floyd’s death will haunt us while Fox News and right wing media will focus on looting and the burning of police stations to show how “lawlessness” requires more force and oppression.

  10. #1840
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Two CNN reporters and their crew, each reporting on the protests (don't call them riots) from different locations. One Reporter left alone, the other is arrested. The difference? The first Reporter is White, the second, Black.

    A CNN crew has been arrested while covering Minneapolis protests, and the governor has apologized

    Just thinking how this reminds me of the reports on how Donald and Fred Trump, back in the 70's, were caught in a government sting operation. The government sent in one couple, Black, to try and rent an apartment. That couple was turned away with some excuse that there were no more apartments for rent. Then they sent in another couple, White, to rent the same apartment, and the Trumps were eager to take them as tenants.

    I bet, when the time comes to check on how many protestors were arrested, there will be a much higher number of Black protestors arrested than White Protestors.
    Last edited by Tami; 05-29-2020 at 04:50 AM.
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  11. #1841
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeastieRunner View Post
    Race riots, collusion with a foreign government, ignored a pandemic.

    If Trump wins reelection, I smell a dictatorship in the making.

    Please America ... figure it out ...
    Race riots are probably not going to hurt Trump

    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    My larger point is imagine if the GOP spent as much time protecting actual humans being murdered by police as opposed to foetuses. It was a rhetorical flourish, if you will. As you say Mister Mets, you have the power to select better candidates in primaries... Are you?

    Also, I’m aware about the death statistics of young African-Americans. But surely we all expect people who are sworn to protect and serve (or some variation of) would not be the frequent cause of so many avoidable murders?
    I do my best in primaries. Opportunities are limited in New York City.

    As for rhetorical flourishes, it shouldn't create a false view of the extent of the problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by aja_christopher View Post
    MLK was shot and killed advocating for peaceful non-violent change.

    Then people rioted worse.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_assassination_riots

    Then change was legislated.

    That's not an advocation of violence.

    That's an advisement to listen to the oppressed before they turn to violence.

    -----
    "On April 5, at 11:00 AM, Johnson met with an array of leaders in the Cabinet Room. These included Vice President Hubert Humphrey, U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice Earl Warren, Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall, and federal judge Leon Higginbotham; government officials such as secretary Robert Weaver and D.C. Mayor Walter Washington; legislators Mike Mansfield, Everett Dirksen, William McCulloch; and civil rights leaders Whitney Young, Roy Wilkins, Clarence Mitchell, Dorothy Height, and Walter Fauntroy.

    Notably absent were representatives of more radical groups such as SNCC and CORE. At the meeting, Mayor Washington asked President Johnson to deploy troops to the District of Columbia. Richard Hatcher, the newly elected black mayor of Gary, Indiana, spoke to the group about white racism and his fears of racially motivated violence in the future. Many of these leaders told Johnson that socially progressive legislation would be the best response to the crisis.[21] The meeting concluded with prayers at the Washington National Cathedral.[22]

    Some responded to the riots with suggestions for improving the conditions that engendered them. Many White House aides took the opportunity to push their preferred programs for urban improvement. At the same time, some members of Congress criticized Johnson. Senator Richard Russell felt Johnson was not going far enough to suppress the violence. Senator Robert Byrd suggested that Washington, D.C. ought to be occupied indefinitely by the army.

    Johnson chose to focus his political capital on a fair housing bill proposed by Senator Sam Ervin. He urged Congress to pass the bill, starting with an April 5 letter addressed to the Speaker of the United States House of Representatives, John William McCormack.[22][25][26]

    These events led to the rapid passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1968, Title VIII of which is known as the "Fair Housing Act"."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_assassination_riots


    -----
    "Another impetus for the law's passage came from the 1966 Chicago Open Housing Movement. Also influential was the 1963 Rumford Fair Housing Act in California, which had been backed by the NAACP and CORE.[8][9] and the 1967 Milwaukee fair housing campaigns led by James Groppi and the NAACP Youth Council.[10] Senator Walter Mondale advocated for the bill in Congress, but noted that over successive years, a federal fair housing bill was the most filibustered legislation in US history.[11] It was opposed by most Northern and Southern senators, as well as the National Association of Real Estate Boards.[8] A proposed "Civil Rights Act of 1966" collapsed completely because of its fair housing provision. Mondale commented:

    A lot of [previous] civil rights [legislation] was about making the South behave and taking the teeth from George Wallace…. This came right to the neighborhoods across the country. This was civil rights getting personal.:[11]

    Two developments revived the bill.[11] The Kerner Commission report on the 1967 ghetto riots strongly recommended "a comprehensive and enforceable federal open housing law,"[12][13] and was cited regularly by Congress members arguing for the legislation.[14] The final breakthrough came with the April 4, 1968 assassination of Martin Luther King, Jr., and the civil unrest across the country following King's death.[15][16] On April 5, Johnson wrote a letter to the United States House of Representatives urging passage of the Fair Housing Act.[17]

    The Rules Committee, "jolted by the repeated civil disturbances virtually outside its door," finally ended its hearings on April 8.[18] With newly urgent attention from legislative director Joseph Califano and Democratic Speaker of the House John McCormack, the bill (which was previously stalled) passed the House by a wide margin on April 10.[15][19]"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_...f_1968#History
    After the King Assassination Riots, Richard Nixon won the next presidential election (and George Wallace won five states.)
    The next election Nixon would win 49 states.
    In the next 40 years after the King Assassination Riots, Democrats would win a majority of the popular vote once, when Jimmy Carter gets 50.1% in the aftermath of the biggest presidential scandal ever.
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  12. #1842
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Two CNN reporters and their crew, each reporting on the protests (don't call them riots) from different locations. One Reporter left alone, the other is arrested. The difference? The first Reporter is White, the second, Black.

    A CNN crew has been arrested while covering Minneapolis protests, and the governor has apologized

    Just thinking how this reminds me of the reports on how Donald and Fred Trump, back in the 70's, were caught in a government sting operation. The government sent in one couple, Black, to try and rent an apartment. That couple was turned away with some excuse that there were no more apartments for rent. Then they sent in another couple, White, to rent the same apartment, and the Trumps were eager to take them as tenants.

    I bet, when the time comes to check on how many protestors were arrested, there will be a much higher number of Black protestors arrested than White Protestors.
    I heard a snippet of Jimenez's arrest on KYW (Philly's all-news radio station), and that made me do a double take. But, I had no idea another reporter, a white reporter had been approached by cops yet wasn't arrested. Crazy, but predictable.
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  13. #1843
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Lensman View Post
    Neo-liberalism has bought into as well, but I think you are correct in identifying where it entered the mainstream.
    One thing libertarians and the far left have in common is blaming liberals for conservative bullshit. Knock that off.
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  14. #1844
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    After the King Assassination Riots, Richard Nixon won the next presidential election (and George Wallace won five states.)
    The next election Nixon would win 49 states.
    In the next 40 years after the King Assassination Riots, Democrats would win a majority of the popular vote once, when Jimmy Carter gets 50.1% in the aftermath of the biggest presidential scandal ever.
    And the Democrats outpaced the Republicans in the Senate by 20% in the popular vote, and 10% in the House. Since when do Republicans care about the popular vote?
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  15. #1845
    Extraordinary Member PaulBullion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    On the one hand? Sure.

    On the other hand? How much has rioting changed the actual picture? Never mind looting or torching drug stores or auto parts stores.
    Stone Wall, anyone? Boston Tea Party? Storming of the Bastille?
    "How does the Green Goblin have anything to do with Herpes?" - The Dying Detective

    Hillary was right!

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