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  1. #28696
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Lensman View Post
    Every time someone says "Democrat Party" they have swallowed a Republican talking point hook, line, and sinker. If you can't call it the Democratic Party, most people here can't take anything else you might have to say seriously.
    If you're going to get that caught up on those last two letters being that important?

    You've probably lost the plot just as completely as folks who are going with "Democrat..." Party.

    Years down the line, no one is going to care if it was "Democratic..." or "Democrat.."

    It will be about what they did or did not do with the opportunity that voters gave them.

  2. #28697
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Kevin McCarthy Says Nobody’s Questioning The Election, But Lots Of Republicans Are

    He might want to talk to the rest of his party about that. Ain't that the truth. Craven Kevin doesn't have much control over his party, if he has any at all.

    **********

    Republicans Try To Rewrite History During Capitol Attack Hearing

    “There was no insurrection,” Republican Georgia Rep. Andrew Clyde said of the Jan. 6 attack. Suuuuuuuure there wasn't, Andy. But, THIS tells a different story:

    Chilling Bodycam Video Shows Seething Trump Mob Attack D.C. Police Officer

    **********

    White Supremacists Are The Biggest Domestic Terrorism Threat, Top Biden Officials Say

    “I have not seen a more dangerous threat to democracy than the invasion of the Capitol,” Attorney General Merrick Garland said. I'm glad SOMEONE finally said what everybody already knew.

    **********

    Former U.S. Military Leaders Sign Bizarre Open Letter Pushing Election Lies

    Over 120 retired generals and admirals signed on to a letter falsely claiming the 2020 election was stolen in a move other veterans say erodes democratic norms. What the fuck is this shit? As a veteran myself, I'm furious about this nonsense!

    **********

    Ruling Paves Way For Longer Sentence For Derek Chauvin Over George Floyd’s Death

    Still even with the aggravating factors, legal experts have said, the former police officer is unlikely to get more than 30 years when he is sentenced June 25. I certainly hope that Chauvin will get more time.

    **********

    Caitlyn Jenner Says She Didn’t Vote In 2020; Voting Records Say Otherwise

    The California gubernatorial candidate told CNN she “couldn’t get excited about” Election Day, but Los Angeles County election records show she did vote. Suddenly, I'm thinking Jenner is trolling us all and her gubernatorial campaign is nothing more than a scam for some new "reality" show.
    Last edited by WestPhillyPunisher; 05-13-2021 at 01:28 AM.
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  3. #28698
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    THIS nonsense is from one of the country's elected representatives, and yes, it's real:

    Cawthorn celebrates Cheney departure from Republican leadership with 'na na na na' tweet

    Last edited by WestPhillyPunisher; 05-13-2021 at 01:44 AM.
    Avatar: Here's to the late, great Steve Dillon. Best. Punisher. Artist. EVER!

  4. #28699
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    Kevin McCarthy Says Nobody’s Questioning The Election, But Lots Of Republicans Are

    He might want to talk to the rest of his party about that. Ain't that the truth. Craven Kevin doesn't have much control over his party, if he has any at all.

    **********

    Republicans Try To Rewrite History During Capitol Attack Hearing

    “There was no insurrection,” Republican Georgia Rep. Andrew Clyde said of the Jan. 6 attack. Suuuuuuuure there wasn't, Andy. But, THIS tells a different story:

    Chilling Bodycam Video Shows Seething Trump Mob Attack D.C. Police Officer

    **********

    White Supremacists Are The Biggest Domestic Terrorism Threat, Top Biden Officials Say

    “I have not seen a more dangerous threat to democracy than the invasion of the Capitol,” Attorney General Merrick Garland said. I'm glad SOMEONE finally said what everybody already knew.

    **********

    Former U.S. Military Leaders Sign Bizarre Open Letter Pushing Election Lies

    Over 120 retired generals and admirals signed on to a letter falsely claiming the 2020 election was stolen in a move other veterans say erodes democratic norms. What the fuck is this shit? As a veteran myself, I'm furious about this nonsense!

    **********

    Ruling Paves Way For Longer Sentence For Derek Chauvin Over George Floyd’s Death

    Still even with the aggravating factors, legal experts have said, the former police officer is unlikely to get more than 30 years when he is sentenced June 25. I certainly hope that Chauvin will get more time.

    **********

    Caitlyn Jenner Says She Didn’t Vote In 2020; Voting Records Say Otherwise

    The California gubernatorial candidate told CNN she “couldn’t get excited about” Election Day, but Los Angeles County election records show she did vote. Suddenly, I'm thinking Jenner is trolling us all and her gubernatorial campaign is nothing more than a scam for some new "reality" show.
    The Military Revolt Against Joe Biden

    This piece of appalling partisan invective was newsworthy mainly because it was signed by retired military officers who, in so doing, violated the norms of their profession and contributed to the erosion of healthy civil-military relations in the United States.

    Perhaps we should not be shocked to discover that, at a time when American society is reeling from extreme partisan polarization—when significant numbers of prominent politicians are openly promoting falsehoods such as the bogus claim that Trump’s resounding defeat at the ballot box was due to electoral fraud—some fraction of the retired military community has fallen prey to the same myths. If a problem exists in civilian society, one can expect to see it in the military assigned to protect that society as well.

    The letter’s content is not necessarily the issue. It is a dog’s breakfast of partisan hyperbole and misleading innuendo about the 2020 election of the kind that is ubiquitous in the darker corners of the internet and the worst fringes of the Republican Party.
    What makes the letter so disturbing is that the 124 signatories are all retired members of a profession whose treasured principles demand that it be subject to civilian command and should remain separate from parochial partisan politics. This is a group of men—and it appears they are all men—who repeatedly pledged an oath of allegiance to the U.S. Constitution and are now doing their level best to undermine it and, in particular, the crucial principle of civilian control.

    In the letter, the group calling itself “Flag Officers 4 America” writes: “We are in a fight for our survival as a Constitutional Republic like no other time since our founding in 1776. The conflict is between supporters of Socialism and Marxism vs. supporters of Constitutional freedom and liberty.”

    Though they do not clearly say they believe the 2020 election was illegitimate—as a majority of Republicans appear to believe—the signatories come close, and they question Biden’s “mental and physical condition.” They add: “Aside from the election, the Current Administration has launched a full-blown assault on our Constitutional rights in a dictatorial manner, bypassing the Congress, with more than 50 Executive Orders quickly signed, many reversing the previous Administration’s effective policies and regulations.”
    This is the same group of retired officers who during the 2020 election declared that if Trump were defeated by Biden, “our historic way of life is at stake.”
    Well, if there was One Michael Flynn, it shouldn't be surprising that there would be many more just like him.

    I'm doing a Google search on this and one thing that was listed but that I didn't click on was Stormfront, and as expected the brief blurb begins by referring to them as Heroes. I think that every person who signed that letter should be investigated by the FBI for possible connections to extremists.
    Last edited by Tami; 05-13-2021 at 02:46 AM.
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  5. #28700
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    The Military Revolt Against Joe Biden







    Well, if there was One Michael Flynn, it shouldn't be surprising that there would be many more just like him.

    I'm doing a Google search on this and one thing that was listed but that I didn't click on was Stormfront, and as expected the brief blurb begins by referring to them as Heroes. I think that every person who signed that letter should be investigated by the FBI for possible connections to extremists.
    And it wouldn't shock me if most, if not all those assholes were white and enjoyed the rampant racism Trump fomented while in office. Yeah, a connection to white supremacist organizations shouldn't be ruled out.
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  6. #28701
    Ultimate Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Hey, WBE! Got Matt Maddock in the queue?

    A Michigan lawmaker who's been at the center of efforts to question the 2020 election introduced a bill Tuesday that would require "fact checkers" to register with the state.

    Rep. Matt Maddock, R-Milford, wrote the legislation, which was co-sponsored by eight other Republican House members, about five months after Maddock floated the idea of licensing fact checkers on Twitter.
    https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...rs/5043399001/

  7. #28702
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    I'm not sure this statement is unusually crazy for Lin Wood. Guy's kinda nuts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Malvolio View Post
    Even if Desantis, Cruz or Cheney are thinking of running, not one of them will even announce an exploratory committee until Trump either announces his candidacy for the 2024 election, or announces that he is definitely not running. For now, as far as other potential Republican Presidential candidates are concerned, Trump is Schrodinger's Candidate.
    We don't really know what the political environment will be in a few years.

    There are a few who seem to want to run who would currently not hint that they want to run against Trump: Mike Pence, Ron DeSantis, Marco Rubio, Rick Scott (lotta Florida guys), former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, former South Carolina Governor/ UN Ambassador Nikki Haley,

    Liz Cheney does not seem afraid to challenge Trump in a primary. Neither does Maryland Governor Larry Hogan.

    There are going to be all sorts of considerations in two years when people enter presidential primaries. What will the situation be for Trump after two years of investigations, and two years off Facebook and Twitter? Politics also seems to be in a bit of a holding pattern, because Biden's just getting started (hasn't even announced most ambassadors to countries yet), and because the populace is still getting vaccinated. Things will soon be very different, when we find out what the new normal is, and get into new political disagreements.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    The Military Revolt Against Joe Biden




    Well, if there was One Michael Flynn, it shouldn't be surprising that there would be many more just like him.

    I'm doing a Google search on this and one thing that was listed but that I didn't click on was Stormfront, and as expected the brief blurb begins by referring to them as Heroes. I think that every person who signed that letter should be investigated by the FBI for possible connections to extremists.
    This reminds me of the military personnel insisting Macron is ruining France.

    It probably comes down to retired generals and flag officers being a group that leans older and conservative, in addition to there being so many that the 124 writing the equivalent of a pissed off Facebook post "Biden is senile and pushing us to a Marxist form of tyrannical government! represent a small percentage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zauriel View Post
    Ah, if they moved to your state, that explains why Montana population has increased. Now Montana got a one extra Congressional seat due to the 2020 census. I wonder if the residents within the new congressional district will vote democratic or republican. I hope the Republicans don't resort to gerrymandering for this new Congressional seat.
    Montana was pretty conservative to begin with. Trump won the state 56.8% to 41.41%, so even if one district is a little more conservative, most methods of sorting the state will result in two districts that usually go for Republicans.

    There is a bit of a question of what type of Californians are moving to Montana. It may be that more conservative Californians are moving to this state, while progressives would prefer Nevada or the cities of Texas.

    Quote Originally Posted by CSTowle View Post
    Because I want this to happen it definitely won't. My guess is they regroup and take back the White House in '24. Democrats will probably do OK in midterms, we're turning the corner and economy will be on an upswing. But 4 years is a long time, and Biden wasn't 100% this past year. Add 3 more, and a candidate lower on the ticket whose charisma netted them a hefty 1% in the Democratic Primaries and things are wobbly. Probably won't be a Trump to kick around then. Here's hoping we get to at least replace a Justice before that happens.
    What does doing OK in the midterms mean?

    Parties tend to lose seats in midterm elections, and Democrats have the narrowest Senate majority possible, as well as a narrow House majority.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  8. #28703
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    The question is why choose this topic to write too in a culture and climate here you have fascism legitimized by an opposition party. Yglesias acts as if the Dems lost the election and writes as such. His take would still be bad but editorially it would at least have some validity for justification in terms of "public interest".



    I wasn't making a specific argument, just giving an off-the-cuff response to a writer who has an overinflated sense of self, who was also seen as not an especially good boss at Vox and not really worker-friendly, and I also think it's worth reminding everyone of people who supported the Iraq War trying to pass themselves as wise old men, or speaking as if they had the wisdom of the old-left. In fact, Yglesias was a Clintonian war-hawk (as was Ezra Klein).



    If they offer an opinion or present a persona without a hint of self-criticism and self-awareness, then yes. Yglesias is offering a bog-standard critique against "identity politics" which is a total misunderstanding and using the latest issue to sharpen his knife simply because his particular brand of political analysis no longer has real currency or popularity among his readers. He's not offering analysis but a bruised ego.

    People here criticize "arsonists coming in as firefighters" in describing Bush-Era Neocons now posing as latter-day "where did we go wrong" anti-Trump GOP...but that applies to the left as well, to Clintonian war-hawks. It's people like Matt Yglesias who bear responsibility for the "problems" as he understands it in the left in terms of polarization and generational rejection. And yet he doesn't own up to it, never owns up to his own mistakes. Their support for the Iraq War and the Clinton-era policies begat this huge series of problems in the left, which in America was overcome with considerable difficulty. Today Clintonism is at least for the time a spent force (happily so). Obama is now seen as the great redeemer of the Democrat party with Clinton recognized as the false dawn he truly was.

    This brings me to the worst of them all, rat-faced traitor of the Labour Party, Tony Blair who wrote a self-aggrandizing Aunty Agony piece about the election:
    https://www.newstatesman.com/politic...ft-he-planning

    Another arsonist coming in posing as a firefighter, offering bad analysis, bad advice, and worse opinions. Not once does he own up to the fact that his policies fractured UK politics, that he destroyed Labour electorally with his blind and unnecessary support for the Iraq War and of course he doesn't in the wisdom of Walter Sobchak "stick-to-his-lane" by offering comments on US politics of which he hopelessly doesn't understand like railing against "Defund the Police" which
    a) wasn't in any way a factor in the US elections 2020 to start with,
    b) wasn't adopted or had purchase in the UK during the recent Council elections.
    c) was some 6 months ago, and we live in a Post-Capitol Putsch landscape.

    Trash like Blair and their brand of politics should never be validated again.
    Ygleisias seems to think it's possible that Democrats will lose impending elections. There are plenty of people who think that Trump was a terrible candidate and President, and that Biden was uniquely electable, which means that Biden barely winning represents serious potential problems for Democrats going forward.

    People write about what interests them and what they can say something unique about. In the same week he wrote about Tema Okun, other recent posts have been about Liz Cheney, the job report, the people who aren't working from home, why government should make vaccinations mandatory, the necessity of ambitious spending now, and housing deregulations.

    https://www.slowboring.com/

    He doesn't control the reception to his work. The post about Tema Okun ended up getting the most attention.

    There isn't necessarily wrong with that. This is an individual whose work is used to teach institutions how to handle sensitive topics. If a dollar of taxpayer money goes to support someone who thinks logical thinking is unique to white people, that's a problem at a time when the country is paying more attention to reckoning with its racist past and present.

    If people like Yglesias have made mistakes in the past, and driven young progressives to overcorrect, that doesn't excuse people who are in the wrong now. If Yglesias, Tony Blair or whoever is wrong, it's fine for their critics to say why. And if people to their left are wrong, the critics should point that out as well. This seems to be the left-wing equivalent of saying that Trump and the people on his side shouldn't be criticized because other Republicans were in the wrong before.



    Quote Originally Posted by CSTowle View Post
    My feeling is a decent writer/commentator should be able to discuss any number of topics. I agree our main concern as a country should be seeing how dangerously close we came to throwing off democracy and how the long-held assumption that democracy was even a thing people in this country cherished and would fight for (rather than paying lip service to, as so many in power often do) appears to be a much closer thing than anyone should be comfortable with and trying to figure out a way to prevent anything like what happened both on Jan. 6th and throughout the Trump Administration.

    That said, there's no reason a writer/commentator can't take the time (minutes/hours?) to write an article about a subject of concern for them. Even if it's not the top priority in the country. I feel like that would be an absurd standard to hold any writer/commentator to, needing to only focus on whatever the largest concern in a given time period was.

    As to the topic of attitudes on race/anti-racism, I have the concerns I previously listed and agree with some of his points in part because I believe it's important that those of us who consider ourselves to be on the left are able to make the best arguments on a given topic to keep those who either don't have the time or interest to pay close attention to these matters (middle or lower class white folk who have the privilege of not having to think about these things, perhaps the greatest white privilege, but still have real concerns of their own) receptive or hopefully in agreement with the general cause of equality.

    Bad messaging, or hostile messaging that as I've said before probably feels good and in a way can even be empowering on an individual basis, does the opposite of that. Take "Defund the Police". Whatever you think of the concept (I support wholeheartedly, major police reform and a real investment in drug counseling and mental health issues are badly needed) it was so absolutely boneheaded a way to phrase it that I'm still not certain it wasn't dreamed up by Russian internet trolls or the Heritage Foundation. It drove people away exactly when support was on an upswing.

    I don't think anybody here, whatever side of the aisle, disagrees with their cause. But messaging matters. Allies matter. Even if they're "poor allies" or "bad allies". Sometimes (often) when a fight is important you have to take whatever help you can get. And changing a culture that we're all born into and have almost no say on, aside from discussing it with other people and trying to decide where we stand and what we can do, is hard work that continues and evolves over generations. Nobody should pretend they hold the pinnacle of humanity's wisdom/wokeness/enlightenment because nobody does. But if you have insight others don't/can't have personally that's a valuable thing you can share. But you need to find someone willing to receive it.

    Maybe he was acting in bad faith, maybe he has personal issues/sensitivity to the topic and is prickly about it. Or maybe he has some of the same concerns I and others have about the potential harm of bad messaging, and wanted to write about it to hopefully make people think. I don't know. All I can say is where I agree or disagree. And I think it's a topic worth discussing, even if there are other (more important) things to talk about.
    Bad messaging is definitely a problem on racial issues. Its difficult to be taken seriously if you're saying things that are untrue.

    One explanation for why for absurd antiracist Professional Development events is that companies just want to be seen as doing something, so they pay a corporate consultant some money. But even if an ineffective consultant teaching nonsense doesn't backfire by convincing enough ordinary people that either the left is absurd on race, or that some of the racist tropes are accurate, it's a problem when institutions are claiming to make substantial changes, and just doing something that looks good on paper. Bad consultants also mean less opportunities for good consultants.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  9. #28704
    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Ygleisias seems to think it's possible that Democrats will lose impending elections.
    Well, duh, everyone knows that it's possible. When you have one party not playing the game and cheating openly with voter suppression, intimidation, lies and spurring on violence, and the other side is trying to govern, it's entirely possible to lose.

  10. #28705
    Extraordinary Member Malvolio's Avatar
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    Let me make something clear here. I didn't mean to say that every Republican thinking about running for President in 2024 is afraid of Trump. They just want to know what kind of primary they're getting into. Is it a primary with Trump, or a primary without Trump?
    Watching television is not an activity.

  11. #28706

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Hey, WBE! Got Matt Maddock in the queue?



    https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...rs/5043399001/
    If they're a state legislator who was at the capitol on 1/6, they're in the queue already.
    X-Books Forum Mutant Tracker/FAQ- Updated every Tuesday.

  12. #28707
    Invincible Jersey Girl Tami's Avatar
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  13. #28708
    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    "Long distance information, give me Memphis Tennessee
    Help me get in touch with my Marie"



    In this case because infrastructure is creating difficulties getting there.

  14. #28709
    Silver Sentinel BeastieRunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    "Long distance information, give me Memphis Tennessee
    Help me get in touch with my Marie"



    In this case because infrastructure is creating difficulties getting there.
    Well played good sir. Well played indeed.
    "Always listen to the crazy scientist with a weird van or armful of blueprints and diagrams." -- Vibranium

  15. #28710
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    Gaetz associate expected to plead guilty in federal case

    Man, I really wouldn’t want to be Matt Gaetz right now....
    Last edited by Amadeus Arkham; 05-13-2021 at 11:40 AM.
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