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  1. #13021
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    Its cool to see you have some Dems in there and want Biden to win. So not a stright party ticket.

    But I do want to ask why if you want Trump out that you still want Mitch and Grahm to win their races when they are huge Trump Boosters and his lackeys and will Block Biden at every turn. If the Gop retains the Senate and if Mitch and Grahm stay in pretty uch nothing will change.

    So isnt a vote for Biden and rooting for the other two kind of counter productive? Not trying to start a thing just want to hear your reasons.
    Mitch isn't a guy who would hold a Democratic President from going too far to the left, but someone who will obstruct them in all things merely for being a Democrat. In the long run, he may be more destructive towards the Republic than Trump.

    Graham is merely a political remora* - and as such will emulate the traits of the of whoever he has attached himself to. He acted more like John McCain before Trump won the White House, and he'll attach himself to whomever looks like they will emerge from the post-Trump fight for right-wing leadership next.





    * What the hell, Samsung? A remora is a type of fish, stop trying to correct it to remote!
    "Theory: The Phoenix doesn't corrupt the characters, it corrupts the authors." Gambit, King of Thieves

  2. #13022
    Astonishing Member Panfoot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    Nope, Im taking NOTHING for granted, not with a desperate Trump willing to say and do anything short of murder to win the election, and not with a glaringly complicit Republican Party more than eager to help him if itll keep them in power. Ive said this before and Ill keep on saying it until polls close on November 3rd, Democrats should act like Biden is trailing and fight like hell to get him across the finish line. Its the only way to be sure.
    Personally I'm not even consider it real until the inauguration day, we know Trump and his cronies are gonna try every single dirty trick in in the book, so as far as I'm concerned the game isn't over until he's out the white house door.

  3. #13023
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    Its cool to see you have some Dems in there and want Biden to win. So not a straight party ticket.

    But I do want to ask why if you want Trump out that you still want Mitch and Graham to win their races when they are huge Trump Boosters and his lackeys and will Block Biden at every turn. If the Gop retains the Senate and if Mitch and Graham stay in pretty much nothing will change as they will block everything Biden and The Dems try and do.

    So isnt a vote for Biden and rooting for the other two kind of counter productive? Not trying to start a thing just want to hear your reasons.
    For many people here, their main problem with Trump is that he's a Republican. Everything else is extra. My problems with Trump are the things that distinguish him from McCain and Romney, two people I voted for who I think would have made good Presidents.

    I am Republican, so I would generally prefer President Biden face some limitations.

    The policies and proposals that Joe Biden can only get through on a party line vote are unlikely to be the kind of stuff I'll agree with him on.

    I do think there is a major opening for bipartisanship right now, as it's in everybody's best interests. The country will do better if Biden succeeds. It's obviously essential for the Democratic party, but it's not as threatening for Republicans when the Democratic President is unlikely to go for a second term. As a Senator, Biden has had a significant record of bipartisan accomplishment, and will understand how Washington works better than most Presidents have.

    While I do probably have a higher opinion of Mitch McConnell and Lindsey Graham than most people here do, I'm also not impressed by their Democratic opponents. In the races where I support Democrats, the Republicans are uniquely terrible or the Democrats seem better than average. Jamie Harrison and Amy McGrath don't seem to be on the level of Doug Jones or Mark Kelly.
    Last edited by Mister Mets; 10-18-2020 at 08:15 AM.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  4. #13024
    Astonishing Member babyblob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    For many people here, their main problem with Trump is that he's a Republican. Everything else is extra. My problems with Trump are the things that distinguish him from McCain and Romney, two people I voted for who I think would have made good Presidents.

    I am Republican, so I would generally prefer President Biden face some limitations.

    The policies and proposals that Joe Biden can only get through on a party line vote are unlikely to be the kind of stuff I'll agree with him on.

    I do think there is a major opening for bipartisanship right now, as it's in everybody's best interests. The country will do better if Biden succeeds. It's obviously essential for the Democratic party, but it's not as threatening for Republicans when the Democratic President is unlikely to go for a second term. As a Senator, Biden has had a significant record of bipartisan accomplishment, and will understand how Washington works better than most Presidents have.
    The thing is yes there is room for bipartisanship right now. But the truth is even on ideas of Bidens that the Gop may agree with our dont have a problem with wont pass is the GOP retains the senate. There will be no Biparartanship because Mitch will not do anything to help Biden. Only hurt him because as started above he is a Dem and because he will be butt hurt that Biden beat Trump and will want revenge on that.

    And not to mention that any law Biden does manage to get passed will be challenged by GOP lawyers and taken to a Gop packed SC

    I honestly think we are years away from real Bipartsanship because lets face it if Trump loses in what The GOP will sure to call a rigged election they will do nothing but try and stop everything Biden does.
    Last edited by babyblob; 10-18-2020 at 08:28 AM.
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  5. #13025
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    The GOP has not shown any willingness for bipartisanship for years. Your boy Mitch McConnell openly stated he would do everything to make sure Obama was a failure.
    The Barrett nomination is the epitome of partisanship.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  6. #13026
    Astonishing Member Panfoot's Avatar
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    After years of McConnell's naked partisan obstructionism followed by the blatant corruption the Republicans have allowed Trump to get away with as long as it furthers there goals, calls of bipartisanship are completely laughable.

  7. #13027
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    San Diego is overhauling their system of grading in order to fight racism. Among the changes, students will no longer be penalized for handing in late work.

    https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...c_knsd_twt_shr

    The San Diego Unified School District (SDUSD) is overhauling the way it grades students. Board members say the changes are part of a larger effort to combat racism.

    This is part of our honest reckoning as a school district, says SDUSD Vice President Richard Barrera. If were actually going to be an anti-racist school district, we have to confront practices like this that have gone on for years and years.

    According to data presented by the district, under the old grading system, teachers fail minority students more than White students a lot more.

    During the first semester of last year, 30% of all D or F grades were given to English learners. One in four, 25%, of failing marks went to students with disabilities.

    By ethnicity, 23% went to Native Americans. Another 23% of failing grades went to Hispanics. And 20% of D or F grades went to Black students.

    By comparison, just 7% of failing marks went to White students.

    In an effort to change that racial imbalance, the school board voted unanimously this week to make several big changes to its grading system.

    Academic grades will now focus on mastery of the material, not a yearly average, which board members say penalizes students who get a slow start, or who struggle at points throughout the year.

    Another big change, teachers can no longer consider non-material factors when grading. Things like turning work in on time and classroom behavior will now instead count towards a student's citizenship grade, not their academic grade.

    I think this reflects a reality that students have described to us and its a change thats a long time coming, says Barrera.

    Student School Board Member Zachary Patterson, who is also a junior at University City High School, says while some classmates expressed concerns about grade inflation, overall the feedback from his peers is positive.

    I know students all across the school district are really happy with the idea that these other accountability measures are no longer going to be defining their understanding of knowledge, says Patterson.

    After Patterson expressed concerns at this weeks meeting, the board will also review potential student disparities stemming from its zero-tolerance disciplinary policy on cheating in the coming weeks.

    Nearly 106,000 students attend a San Diego Unified School District school.
    This seems misguided. When there are no penalties for handing in late work, fewer students will complete it on time, and they'll have a tougher time catching up, especially since many classes build on earlier material. History classes tend to be in sequential order. If you're reading a novel in English class, it helps to have read the earlier chapters. Math and Science build on earlier concepts.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  8. #13028
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    So Mets, you don't like Trump because of who he is. Is there any policy from the last four years instituted by Trump and the defended by the GOP Congress and Senate that you disagree with. We know you approved of his massive tax cut for the rich and his roll back of environmental and business regulations. You also were on board for his trade war tariffs and attacks on the AcA, and you seem to have no problem with the way McConnell has made the Supreme Court a purely partisan vote. So other than Democrats passing GOP policies, what "bipartisanship" do you want to see?
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  9. #13029
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    The GOP has not shown any willingness for bipartisanship for years. Your boy Mitch McConnell openly stated he would do everything to make sure Obama was a failure.
    The Barrett nomination is the epitome of partisanship.
    It is a major goal of politicians that the leader of the other party does not succeed, mainly because there are going to be some significant policy differences. Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer did not want Trump to succeed. Harry Reid and Tom Daschle did not want Bush to succeed. It's the responsibility of the executive to get things done despite that. One strategy would be a mix of legislation that both sides can agree on, and sticking to particular norms during party line votes.

    There has been plenty of nasty partisanship in the past.

    Chuck Schumer led the first partisan filibuster of a nominee to the circuit court against Miguel Estrada, early in Bush's term.

    https://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS...ada.withdraws/

    Internal documents from Dick Durbin's office suggest that part of the reason for the opposition to Estrada was that Democrats were concerned he would be a potential Supreme Court nominee, which made him especially dangerous as he is latino.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/gop-sta...-in-memo-leak/

    Harry Reid lied about a credible source claiming that Mitt Romney hadn't paid any taxes. His later justification was “Romney didn’t win, did he?”

    https://time.com/3765158/harry-reid-...mney-no-taxes/

    There has been a lot of bad behavior here, and it hasn't just been from Republicans.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  10. #13030
    Astonishing Member babyblob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    For many people here, their main problem with Trump is that he's a Republican. Everything else is extra..
    my main problem with Trump is not that he is Republican. My main problem with Trump is the lies the corruption in his office. Refusing to denounce White Supremacy, and Qannon, The misinformation he and his lackys are spreading about Covid. Laughing and clapping while his followers chat Lock Her Up referring to a governor who was targeted by a kidnaping plot. I dont give a damn that he is a Republican as there are some Republican views that I agree with. it is just that he is a horrible human being and a bad president. And people who make excuses for him like Fox news and the senate who lets him get away with shit are just as bad.
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  11. #13031
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    So Mets, you don't like Trump because of who he is. Is there any policy from the last four years instituted by Trump and the defended by the GOP Congress and Senate that you disagree with. We know you approved of his massive tax cut for the rich and his roll back of environmental and business regulations. You also were on board for his trade war tariffs and attacks on the AcA, and you seem to have no problem with the way McConnell has made the Supreme Court a purely partisan vote. So other than Democrats passing GOP policies, what "bipartisanship" do you want to see?
    I'd like to see more of an effort at passing major legislation that both sides can agree on. There will be some party line stuff, but that shouldn't be all of the legislation.

    For example, I think it was a mistake to do the Affordable Care Act as one omnibus bill. It would have been better to split it into several bills, some of which would have gotten more support (provisions like keeping adult children on parents' insurance plans until they're 26, bans on annual/ lifetime caps for essential benefits, etc.) , and some of which would have probably gotten the same amount of votes as the actual bill.

    A stimulus bill could done in several sections. There could be one bill with less benefits that can get the support of a majority of Republican Senators, and another bill that goes further and gets less votes.

    This might not work. It's possible that Republicans will be intransigent, responding to moderate circuit court nominees the same they would to the most progressive nominees. In that case, Democrats will be able to say they tried and just go for party line votes whenever possible using whatever tools are at their disposal. But I would like to see a legitimate effort at bipartisanship.

    My main objections to Trump aren't about policy. It's primarily about the ridiculous stuff he says, and some incompetent appointees to major political posts.

    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    my main problem with Trump is not that he is Republican. My main problem with Trump is the lies the corruption in his office. Refusing to denounce White Supremacy, and Qannon, The misinformation he and his lackys are spreading about Covid. Laughing and clapping while his followers chat Lock Her Up referring to a governor who was targeted by a kidnaping plot. I dont give a damn that he is a Republican as there are some Republican views that I agree with. it is just that he is a horrible human being and a bad president. And people who make excuses for him like Fox news and the senate who lets him get away with shit are just as bad.
    I'm generally in agreement here. My main objections are to his behavior.
    Last edited by Mister Mets; 10-18-2020 at 09:21 AM.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  12. #13032
    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    My problems with Trump are the things that distinguish him from McCain and Romney, two people I voted for who I think would have made good Presidents.

    I am Republican, so I would generally prefer President Biden face some limitations.
    This raises some questions.

    1) Based on Obama's two terms, what leads you to believe that either McCain and Romney would have been better had they won? Obama had a successful Presidency, introduced major reforms in office, led the cleanest administration of the last 50 years. How would McCain and/or Romney improved on the Presidency we did get.

    2) Trump governed his first two years with the Republicans having majorities in both Senate and House. Would you have prefered limitations on the Republican agenda in that time? The only major Republican policy achievement was the tax cuts in that period. Does that satisfy you?

    3) Why is the alternative, for you, the alternative to Republican dominance (as we got in 2016-2018, and by extension of McConnell's obstructionism of the Senate, across the last four years), Democratic bipartisanship?

  13. #13033
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    Now Trump is saying he wants to be President for 12 more years. Discounting the amendment that prevents that, (which Republicans were major supporters for) Trump is already incredibly unpopular and is only going to scrape by if he wins at all, plus he'd actually have to rebuild the economy himself instead of relying on Obama's work. Does he really think what popularity he has left will survive four more years, let alone twelve?

    As for the Republicans, in my view the Extremists have to be voted out, if only so that the sane members of the Republicans can start retaking control of the party. The ones who actually recognise when the Democrats have a good idea and build on it, rather than the kind of idiots who seem obssessed with destroying anything that benefits the Government that wasn't passed by their party. (This goes for any Government really, but it's worth addressing).

  14. #13034
    Astonishing Member Joker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    For many people here, their main problem with Trump is that he's a Republican. Everything else is extra. My problems with Trump are the things that distinguish him from McCain and Romney, two people I voted for who I think would have made good Presidents.

    I am Republican, so I would generally prefer President Biden face some limitations.

    The policies and proposals that Joe Biden can only get through on a party line vote are unlikely to be the kind of stuff I'll agree with him on.

    I do think there is a major opening for bipartisanship right now, as it's in everybody's best interests. The country will do better if Biden succeeds. It's obviously essential for the Democratic party, but it's not as threatening for Republicans when the Democratic President is unlikely to go for a second term. As a Senator, Biden has had a significant record of bipartisan accomplishment, and will understand how Washington works better than most Presidents have.

    While I do probably have a higher opinion of Mitch McConnell and Lindsey Graham than most people here do, I'm also not impressed by their Democratic opponents. In the races where I support Democrats, the Republicans are uniquely terrible or the Democrats seem better than average. Jamie Harrison and Amy McGrath don't seem to be on the level of Doug Jones or Mark Kelly.
    This post just contradicts itself all over the place man. This kinda shit is why people don't take you seriously on here.
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  15. #13035
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    This raises some questions.

    1) Based on Obama's two terms, what leads you to believe that either McCain and Romney would have been better had they won? Obama had a successful Presidency, introduced major reforms in office, led the cleanest administration of the last 50 years. How would McCain and/or Romney improved on the Presidency we did get.

    2) Trump governed his first two years with the Republicans having majorities in both Senate and House. Would you have prefered limitations on the Republican agenda in that time? The only major Republican policy achievement was the tax cuts in that period. Does that satisfy you?

    3) Why is the alternative, for you, the alternative to Republican dominance (as we got in 2016-2018, and by extension of McConnell's obstructionism of the Senate, across the last four years), Democratic bipartisanship?
    1) As a Republican, I'm more likely to agree with the policy goals of Republicans than Democrats. I disagree with much of what the Obama administration did: The Iran Nuclear Deal, The Department of Education guidelines which mandated schools place severe restrictions on the ability of students accused of sexual harassment to clear their names, their lack of a plan against increased Russian aggression (Obama had told Romney “The 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back because the Cold War’s been over for 20 years.” when he was critical of it), the ineffectiveness against the lowering life expectancy (a problem that is generally pretty rare), opposition to fracking (one of the major reasons for the economic recovery, as well as a source of energy independence from Middle Eastern oil and a reason the Russian economy took a nosedive.) There's a reason his presidency correlated with a massive increase in Republican officeholders, and at the end of it, enough voters picked Trump, probably the worst presidential candidate in generations over Obama's former Secretary of State.

    I also do agree with the conservative judicial philosophy. I was a little pissed off a week ago that someone here made the common mistake of assuming that originalists would be against constitutional amendments, when part of originalist philosophy is adhering to the constitution as written, including amendments. But I think part of the reason people are so mistaken on this is that they have to come up with a caricature to argue against because originalism otherwise just seems so sensible in determining the role of a judge.

    2) I probably would agree with the Trump policies that could get through a Republican House and Senate. However, Trump didn't get to do much because he was incompetent. I'm guessing that the Biden administration will be better at it, so I'm concerned about what they would be able to do in the next two years, especially since the main understanding of politics right now is that the important thing is to get control of the presidency and both houses of congress, and do as much as possible in that time.

    3) As a Republican, I would probably disagree with the outcomes of a period of Democratic dominance. Some of my suggestions for how the party could be more bipartisan don't require Democrats to make major compromise. They can simultaneously pass bipartisan legislation, and go for other stuff on a party line vote.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joker View Post
    This post just contradicts itself all over the place man. This kinda shit is why people don't take you seriously on here.
    If people don't take me seriously here, it's primarily because I'm not a straight-ticket Democrat.

    Where do I contradict myself?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChangingStation View Post
    Now Trump is saying he wants to be President for 12 more years. Discounting the amendment that prevents that, (which Republicans were major supporters for) Trump is already incredibly unpopular and is only going to scrape by if he wins at all, plus he'd actually have to rebuild the economy himself instead of relying on Obama's work. Does he really think what popularity he has left will survive four more years, let alone twelve?

    As for the Republicans, in my view the Extremists have to be voted out, if only so that the sane members of the Republicans can start retaking control of the party. The ones who actually recognise when the Democrats have a good idea and build on it, rather than the kind of idiots who seem obssessed with destroying anything that benefits the Government that wasn't passed by their party. (This goes for any Government really, but it's worth addressing).
    A problem in politics is that the extremists tend to be in safer states.

    Susan Collins is one of the most endangered Republicans, but she's also the most moderate. Her problem is that she's in a Democratic leaning state.

    There are going to be some exceptions. Rick Santorum was pretty extreme, and in a swing state, so he lost big in a bad year for his party.
    Last edited by Mister Mets; 10-18-2020 at 10:07 AM.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

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