All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[babyblob]

Some other polls are a bit more reassuring.

Two-thirds of Republicans and Trump voters saw the participants in the riot as either criminals or fools, and a further 17 percent didn't answer. 9% saw them as "concerned citizens" and 5% called them "patriots" which is way too high, but nowhere near a majority.

https://news.trust.org/item/20210108210622-t35pv

A PBS/ Marist poll shows 17 percent of Republicans believing perpetrators shouldn't be prosecuted, and 18 percent approved of the riots, which is too high but not the 45 percent in the YouGov poll.

http://maristpoll.marist.edu/pbs-new....AYe9ptLF.dpbs

I wonder if a difference is that the earlier YouGov poll occurred before many people learned more about what happened.

I dont really trust polls on this topic too much. if they say the Republicans largely support this or hate this. it does not matter. They are not asking every Republican (Impossible I know) So one poll could lean heavy with Hardcore Trumpers while other could lean with moderates while others could be a mix of the two. There really is no real balance on what you get. There could also be some who support what happened but are scared to speak up or say they hate it because of the current mood. Who knows for sure what is in the mind of each person.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

That's my assessment as well, and it worries me mightily. I don't think Trump can pull a second act, but I do worry somebody else can harness this energy.

On account of the fact that Trump is like Hitler in his management style (i.e. cultivating a sense of chaos so that underlings have to "Work towards the Fuhrer" or "Work towards the Donald" and anticipate his desires and plans), and doesn't like to organize a real party for fear of a system that he would be accountable to and would be held account with...Trump also doesn't have an immediate successor nor an epigone who can readily imitate what he has done.

But again, if Trump is brought to account and discredited, then you can control it. After being arrested and imprisoned after the failed Putsch, Hitler was politically finished and completely fringe. Had it not been for the Great Depression and the total f--kups by the mainstream German parties (introducing austerity after a Depression...which as can be seen in the EU in the last decade, proves these guys never learn), he wouldn't have come to power. And even then the stuff that led him to take command was a series of lucky stuff that went his way and could have been avoided.

[Kirby101]

He benefited Putin. You could be right about him being an asset. You can't establish it. Claiming it without evidence is unhelpfully angry hysteria.

You know. What MAGAssholes do about everything.

So he only does Putin's bidding part of the time?

[Mister Mets]

Here is a question. Can a president still be impeached after he leaves office if the process starts before he leaves office? if so then my mind will be firmly in the camp of impeachment being something they should pursue. I didnt know it would cost him his benefits or secret service. I just thought it removed him from office.

And hpw bad are the GOp sweating right now knowing they lost the senate and cant block Biden's cabinet? A lot of people who took part in this madness are now worried about the people coming in who will investigate the Hell our of this.

There had been an impeachment of a Secretary of War who had resigned from office before, so it can be done.

It can establish limits including an inability to run for office again.

Man. All these right wing extremists being identified by name, doing exactly the kind of thing we all know they dream about, posting live to their social media as they commit felonies...but I thought the coup was a false flag event staged by ANTIFA and BLM, not Patriots like these guys!?

BLM must have some real special effects wizards on staff. Either that, or ANTIFA's new mask technology is LIT...

It's also weird that Antifa was able to pull this off at the same time there were so many Trump supporters in town, somehow unable to fight back and defend the capitol.

[babyblob]

The only really good thing about the Trump style of government is that he never allowed someone who may be stronger then him to serve him. And these ass kisser were so busy competing to make daddy Trump happy they have no loyalty towards each other. So at least in the short term there are not many people who will take his place right away. Cruz and Howley can try but they will both be busy fighting each other because they both want the Oval office. I dont see anyone in Trumps inner circle or his ass kissers in congress gaining enough support from other ass kisses and lackeys to be strong right now.

If the moderates were smart and they were serious about taking the party away from Trumpers they would hit hard and fast. If Mitt is not planning a move right now he is a fool.

[babyblob]

There had been an impeachment of a Secretary of War who had resigned from office before, so it can be done.

It can establish limits including an inability to run for office again..

Thank you for the info. I wasnt sure. Now that I am aware of this I am not longer on the fence about impeachment as I was before.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Here is a question. Can a president still be impeached after he leaves office if the process starts before he leaves office? if so then my mind will be firmly in the camp of impeachment being something they should pursue. I didnt know it would cost him his benefits or secret service. I just thought it removed him from office.

Impeachment can continue after Trump's term is done. It's not a time limit.

If impeached in the house and convicted in the senate, Trump will be barred from a second term and finished as a political entity.

And even if there's no conviction, a twice-impeached one-term loser...that'll stink.

But here's the thing, Trump's Putsch has to be acknowledged, named and shamed politically. An act of this scale and damage and pure unmitigated evil (there's just no other word for it) has to be highlighted, outcomes be damned. It must go into the records. When the question comes on Jeopardy "who's the president so nice they impeached him twice?" it should be a one-syllable answer?

I would hope that somebody like retired general Colin Powell and these past high ranking administrators can force a meeting with 45 and just tell him, point blank, "It's over. Resign. Now.".

Colin Powell isn't in office anymore. Him defecting from neo-conservatism and publicly backing all three Dem candidates has made him non grata from the establishment, save for maybe Romney. And I don't know "Generals and others" forcing Trump to resign has an air of military control over civilian administration, and probably not a good precedent in and of itself.

.. No airports or federal facilities named after him.

There's a law proposed by incoming Rep. Jamaal Bowman that proposes this. And this kind of measure might pass.

[MiddleMan]

The differences should be articulated, so that we can establish neutral standards.

You misread my post if you think that I'm defending what happened. Hell, in that post I referred to Ted Cruz's call for a congressional audit as bullshit, which would make it clear that I didn't agree with it. The specific point I was addressing was whether Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley should go to jail. There have also been calls for their removals, so I'm considering that point as well.

Questioning whether two Senators should be arrested is different from suggesting that what happened is okay. I hope that you guys aren't so far gone that you can't see that distinction.

For the record, I am all for Cruz and Howley being removed, and then arrested and charged with treason

Cruz can f off to Texas, but its Howley Im worried about

[Revolutionary_Jack]

The spiral widens:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...itol-riot.html

On Wednesday morning, Ginni Thomas—wife of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas—endorsed the rally in Washington demanding that Congress overturn the election. She then sent her “LOVE” to the demonstrators, who violently overtook the Capitol several hours later. Two days later, Thomas amended her post with the addendum: “[Note: written before violence in US Capitol].” By that point, five people involved in the insurrection, including a Capitol Police officer, had died.

"On the morning of Jan. 6, Ginni Thomas—wife of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas—endorsed the protest demanding that Congress overturn the election, then sent her “LOVE” to the demonstrators, who violently overtook the Capitol several hours later. She has not posted since." pic.twitter.com/378CHMkFN5
— Mark Joseph Stern (@mjs_DC) January 8, 2021

Thomas, a conservative lobbyist and zealous supporter of Donald Trump, has fervently defended the president over the last four years. On her Facebook page, she frequently promotes baseless conspiracy theories about a “coup” against Trump led by Jewish philanthropist George Soros, a frequent target of anti-Semitic hate. Thomas draws many of these theories from fringe corners of the internet, including an anti-vax Facebook group that claimed Bill Gates would use the COVID vaccine to kill people. In recent months, she also amplified unsubstantiated corruption claims against Joe Biden while insisting, falsely, that the Obama administration illegally spied on Trump’s 2016 campaign, then tried to rig the election against him.

In turn, Trump has rewarded Thomas with an extraordinary amount of access to the Oval Office. Her advocacy group Groundswell got an audience with the president in early 2019. According to the New York Times, the meeting was arranged after Clarence and Ginni Thomas had dinner with the Trumps. (Clarence Thomas and Trump appear to be quite friendly: The justice took his clerks to meet with the president in the Oval Office at least once; Ginni attended as well.) At the White House, Groundswell’s members lobbied Trump against transgender service in the military, which he already prohibited in 2017. The ban took effect in 2019, around the time of Groundswell’s meeting, after the Supreme Court lifted lower court orders blocking it by a 5–4 vote. (Clarence Thomas did not recuse himself from the case; he has never recused from any case because of his wife’s lobbying activities.) The New York Times also reported that Ginni Thomas compiled lists of federal employees whom she deemed insufficiently loyal to the president. She sent her lists to Trump, urging him to fire the disloyal employees, though he seems to have largely ignored her. He has, however, stacked his administration with former Thomas clerks.

Throughout the 2020 campaign, Thomas remained active on Facebook, condemning Black Lives Matter, opposing COVID-19 shutdowns, and touting the “Walk Away” movement, which purports to spotlight Democrats who became Republicans under Trump. (At least two individuals featured in the “Walk Away” series, both Black, were actually models from royalty-free stock photos.) She also campaigned for Trump in person—and, according to the Intercept, spearheaded a dark-money operation to support the president. Cleta Mitchell, the Republican lawyer who participated in Trump’s shakedown of the Georgia secretary of state, led the project.

After Nov. 3, Thomas grew uncharacteristically quiet on Facebook; she did not share popular conspiracy theories about election fraud, perhaps because election challenges would inevitably come before her husband. She provided her clearest statement yet on Jan. 6, when she enthusiastically endorsed the D.C. rally designed to make Congress overturn the election result and give Trump a second term. There is no evidence that Thomas personally attended the rally, and her posts indicate that she watched the events on TV from another location.

Ginni Thomas’ activism on matters that come before her husband raises thorny ethical issues. Federal law requires justices to recuse themselves from any proceeding in which their “impartiality might reasonably be questioned.” It also compels justices to recuse if their spouse has “an interest that could be substantially affected by the outcome” of the case. In the coming months and years, Democrats will likely pressure Clarence Thomas to recuse himself from high-profile cases or to resign altogether. If Thomas steps down under Biden, progressives can restore a 5–4 divide on the Supreme Court, giving Chief Justice John Roberts control once again. Given Thomas’ staunch refusal to recuse thus far, though, there is little chance that he will take any steps to remediate his conflicts of interest, let alone retire during the presidency of a man he openly despises.

In all likelihood, Ginni Thomas will face no consequences for cheerleading a rally that sought to overturn an election, then laid siege to the Capitol in a failed insurrection. Her husband will ignore the controversy and continue to rule on cases that involve his wife’s lobbying efforts. We may never know how much influence a conspiracy theorist has on the highest court’s most conservative justice.

[Hypestyle]

... for any state-based investigative agencies looking at 45, I hope that they are resolute and not inclined to drop things for far lesser charges. A stiff example needs to be made of him, regardless of whatever the statistics suggest on proving federal charges against an ex-president that's still "popular" with his base..
all the taxes, personal and business-related, need to be fully exposed once and for all. I don't care who gets embarrassed.

[Tami]

There is a post on Parler requesting those who took park in the siege of the US Capitol to leave their name, city, and a list of crimes committed in order to receive a pardon for Trump.

Many people have already provided this information.

Twitter Link

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Twitter Link

Who is this Rosalind person, is there anyone in the WH with that name, or is this code?

[Tami]

AJC EXCLUSIVE: Georgia attorney among those who broke into U.S. Capitol

When hundreds of pro-Trump protesters stunned and horrified the nation by forcing their way into the United States Capitol Wednesday, self-described “Anti-Communist Counter-Revolutionary” McCall Calhoun was among the first through the doors.

“The Deep State cannot stop us,” he wrote on Parler, a social media network popular with Trump supporters, “They learned that today when we stormed the Capitol and took it. The word is we’re all coming back armed for war.”

Calhoun, a practicing attorney in Americus for 30 years, admitted his participation in the riot in an exclusive interview with the AJC in which he described the mob as patriotic and heroic.

Calhoun, who said he primarily does criminal defense work in his south Georgia city, said the assault on Congress was done out of frustration over what he said was a stolen election.

Clark Cunningham, a Georgia State University law professor who teaches legal ethics, had another way to describe it.

“I would say what he did – I would say what all of them did that entered the Capitol —is the serious federal felony of sedition. It’s the domestic equivalent of treason,” he said. “It wasn’t a sit-in. They knew the Congress was convened to do perhaps the most important thing a Congress can do: preside over the peaceful transfer of power from one president to another.”

[babyblob]

Twitter Link

This may be the most lazy yet brilliant FBI sting in history

[Tami]

Oops. An FBI agent just said on MSNBC the anti mask movement is making it a lot easier for facial recognition software tracking down the storming the Capitol crew.