All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[PwrdOn]

I’ve read a fair bit about QAnon but never gone to the sources, as it were. This is a 10-minute interview with Jake Angeli, one of the leaders of the Capitol insurrection yesterday. It’s a fascinating plunge into the QAnon universe.

Angeli considers himself a shaman who can see in multiple dimensions. As part of the Q-movement, he is able to “read between the lines” of Trump’s tweets, corporate symbols, and the daily news. The evil forces in his worldview are the globalists, an elite cabal with underground research bases across the world, kept in line by the power of central banks and by blackmail. The forces of good are the true patriots who have infiltrated the highest levels of the elite, with Donald Trump in particular playing a larger than life role. These patriots are fighting behind the scenes against the globalist pedophiles who secretly control everything.

Like any good cult or dangerous political movement, it articulates a series of truths that are generally ignored or at least not acted upon at a policy level: central banks really do have enormous power and their decisions benefit some and hurt others. There is a plutocratic elite, particularly in the United States, that doesn’t really have to follow the rules. Environmental degradation is real. But it quickly takes those truths and verges into dangerous conspiratorial territory. It becomes unhinged.

Just listening to Angeli for 10 minutes has convinced me we’re not just talking about different media ecosystems or J.D. Vance’s Appalachia here. This is a religion. And it brings together a lot of (half-)truths and provides a lot of meaning that is hard to find in American society otherwise right now. It’s not a coherent movement to govern given its current ideological makeup, so in that sense it will never succeed. It can only wreak destruction. It doesn’t have the bureaucratic competence or attachment to reality to actually address the problems of plutocracy, environmental degradation, or monetary policy. But it can carry people along with the sense of meaning it provides.

The challenge is to provide Americans who might be tempted to follow Angeli down the Q-rabbit hole a comparable sense of meaning that is actually tethered to reality.

Currently, we are failing.



It's a friggin' cult.

This researcher is worth a follow for keeping an ear to the Q ground: https://twitter.com/_MAArgentino?s=0...bukZAdQAbO0d5I

There is also this:
https://krebsonsecurity.com/2021/01/...qZ5zV8EKFtMXEk

I'm most intrigued by the epistemic and hermeneutic facets of QAnon participation.

This is sort of the same line of reasoning that people used in 2016 when they were claiming that Trump won because of economic anxiety or whatever. But the problem I see with this idea is, is there something uniquely despondent about the lives of these MAGA people that pushes them to constantly resort to violence and conspiracy theories? Everyone struggles with finding meaning in their lives or trying to make sense of what's going on in the wider world, that's just part of life in the modern age. But the difference is, most of us aren't going around trying to overthrow the government to cope with our own anxieties and, if we ever tried, nobody would be trying to excuse that behavior after the fact or suggest that we are just lost souls in need of nurture. You could make this exactly same argument about ISIS members and, quite frankly, at least the material conditions of their lives make their actions somewhat easier to rationalize than Trump voters, most of whom live quite comfortably and are willing to go to such extremes over completely imagined oppression.

[AnakinFlair]

At one point, wearing fur or those kind of clothes was seen as a "gay fashion thing", or something bohemian types do, or you know pimps.

Not saying I feel bad that the right wing has co-opted fashion choices that were once subversive since I never got the whole fur thing myself...but it's a new thing.

I mean the horned dude who seems to be the face of these terrorist attack is dressing in a style that was once stereotypical of San Francisco in its pre-gentrified gayborhood days.

Where's PETA to throw paint on him when you need them?

[BeastieRunner]

This is sort of the same line of reasoning that people used in 2016 when they were claiming that Trump won because of economic anxiety or whatever. But the problem I see with this idea is, is there something uniquely despondent about the lives of these MAGA people that pushes them to constantly resort to violence and conspiracy theories? Everyone struggles with finding meaning in their lives or trying to make sense of what's going on in the wider world, that's just part of life in the modern age. But the difference is, most of us aren't going around trying to overthrow the government to cope with our own anxieties and, if we ever tried, nobody would be trying to excuse that behavior after the fact or suggest that we are just lost souls in need of nurture. You could make this exactly same argument about ISIS members and, quite frankly, at least the material conditions of their lives make their actions somewhat easier to rationalize than Trump voters, most of whom live quite comfortably and are willing to go to such extremes over completely imagined oppression.

Exactly!

There is no excuse for this type of rampant radicalization on US soil.

We need to be taking better care of our education system, mental health, social services, etc.

You know ... all those things the GOP en mass likes to defund.

[babyblob]

Exactly!

There is no excuse for this type of rampant radicalization on US soil.

We need to be taking better care of our education system, mental health, social services, etc.

You know ... all those things the GOP en mass likes to defund.

I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist. But the GOP keeping money away from programs that if well funded would cost them followers. Sounds fishy to me.

[BeastieRunner]

I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist. But the GOP keeping money away from programs that if well funded would cost them followers. Sounds fishy to me.

Well ... they're pretty open about defunding things like NPR, AmeriCorps, the Education Department, Free and Reduced Lunches, public Mental health offices, etc.

[Joker]

Qanon followers are mentally ill. That man is mentally ill. He cannot see in different dimensions, he is mentally ill.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Qanon followers are mentally ill. That man is mentally ill. He cannot see in different dimensions, he is mentally ill.

That corny dialogue at the end of Revenge of the Sith feels pretty realistic these days, confronting someone so utterly beyond sense:

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Lisa Murkowski seems to be testing waters for a defection:
(https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...9nKmaioiGxj9Cs)

GOP Sen. Lisa Murkowski (Alaska) said Friday that she believes President Trump should resign immediately, becoming the first Senate Republican to call for him to step down after riots at the Capitol.

“I want him to resign. I want him out. He has caused enough damage,” Murkowski told the Anchorage Daily News.

Murkowski's comments come two days after rioters breached the Capitol as Vice President Pence and lawmakers were counting the Electoral College vote.


Trump, who has since said he will support an orderly transfer of power, has issued claims for weeks that the election was "rigged" and encouraged his supporters to gather at the Capitol on Wednesday ahead of the violence.

Murkowski also appeared to acknowledge that Trump is unlikely to resign, even as House Democrats appear poised to impeach him for a second time and there are growing calls for Vice President Pence and the Cabinet to invoke the 25th Amendment.

“I think he should leave. He said he’s not going to show up. He’s not going to appear at the at the inauguration. He hasn’t been focused on what is going on with COVID. He’s either been golfing or he’s been inside the Oval Office fuming and throwing every single person who has been loyal and faithful to him under the bus, starting with the vice president," Murkowski said.

"He doesn’t want to stay there. He only wants to stay there for the title. He only wants to stay there for his ego. He needs to get out. He needs to do the good thing, but I don’t think he’s capable of doing a good thing,” she added.

Murkowski is the only Senate Republican who has said they believe Trump should resign over the riots, though Sen. Ben Sasse (R-Neb.) signaled that he was open to considering impeachment if articles are passed in the House.

But other GOP senators, while not defending Trump's actions, have suggested they are eager to move on and have dismissed calls for Trump to impeached with less than two weeks left in his presidential term.

Murkowski's comments mark the latest break between congressional Republicans and Trump, who is facing growing backlash after Wednesday's riots.

In addition to broader calls by public officials for him to step down days before President-elect Joe Biden's inauguration, several administration officials including two members of his Cabinet have resigned in protest.

Murkowski, in her interview with the Anchorage Daily News, blamed Trump's claims about the election for inciting the mob that stormed the Capitol and breached both the House and Senate chambers.

Shortly before chaos broke out on Capitol Hill, the president urged his supporters to walk to the Capitol to stop Congress's certification of the 2020 election results.

"He still told his supporters to fight. How are they supposed to take that? It’s an order from the president. And so that’s what they did. They came up and they fought and people were harmed, and injured and died,” Murkowski said.

Murkowski's remarks are a stinging public rebuke to a president of her own party and mark the strongest public pushback from Senate Republicans, who have by and large not pushed back strongly against Trump since he assumed office in 2017.

Murkowski has been one the GOP senators most willing to criticize the president at times, which Trump vowed earlier this year would result in her facing a primary challenger in 2022 when she is up for reelection.

Other Senate Republicans brushed off Trump's rhetoric noting that Murkowski once lost the GOP primary only to win the Alaska Senate race through a write-in campaign.

Murkowski, during Friday's interview, didn't rule out eventually leaving the party, but indicated it depends on where Republicans go moving forward.

"I will tell you, if the Republican Party has become nothing more than the party of Trump, I sincerely question whether this is the party for me,” she said.

If this goes to Impeachment, it actually looks we could get the number of votes to make a conviction and removal.

Anyway, let's not raise too high hopes for Murkowski (who did vote for Barrett unlike Collins) but if it happens, if she goes Independent or joins the Dems, it wouldn't be inconsiderable.

[AnakinFlair]

Twitter just banned Michael Flynn, Sidney Powell, and others in a QAnon account purge.

[worstblogever]

There were at least 13 Republican state legislators participating in the coup at the Capitol building. I've profiled about half these nutjobs.

[BeastieRunner]

Twitter just banned Michael Flynn, Sidney Powell, and others in a QAnon account purge.

Wait, Flynn is a Q!?

[The Cool Thatguy]

Wait, Flynn is a Q!?

Almost has to be at this point.

[Wildling]

I know a lot of people were upset that there weren't mass arrests during and right after the riot... but I honestly think this is even better. These idiots got to go home, have a beer with their friends, laugh about how they got away with it... and then a couple of days later, the FBI will show up and take them out in handcuffs. And in the meantime, while they are laughing about there being no consequences, the internet is doing its' thing and identifying all of them, and suddenly they find themselves unemployed.

Smiled to myself remembering the Simpsons episode where Scully reminds Homer it's a crime to lie to the FBI and then Homer spills his sad guts out, and imagining a Trump supporter there.

[Robotman]

I know a lot of people were upset that there weren't mass arrests during and right after the riot... but I honestly think this is even better. These idiots got to go home, have a beer with their friends, laugh about how they got away with it... and then a couple of days later, the FBI will show up and take them out in handcuffs. And in the meantime, while they are laughing about there being no consequences, the internet is doing its' thing and identifying all of them, and suddenly they find themselves unemployed.

Just unemployed?!? They need to be put in prison! There are people serving ridiculous sentences for drug possession so these terrorists need to get the book thrown at them.

[Amadeus Arkham]

Twitter has permanently suspended Trump’s account.



Better late than never, I guess...