All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[CaptainEurope]

What an embarrassing post.

Don't make fun when somebody is having a stroke, call 911!

[CaptainEurope]

So first we had Graham calling for assassination of Putin, and Hannity suggesting bombing Russian convoys and pretending it wasn't us.

The defeated former President seems to still be taking cues from Hannity. He just adds details to make it even dumber:

Trump mused to donors that we should take our F-22 planes, "put the Chinese flag on them and bomb the shit out" out of Russia. "And then we say, China did it, we didn't do, China did it, and then they start fighting with each other and we sit back and watch."

1. Only the US has F22.
2. It's not a bomber, but a fighter jet
3. Trump previously and repeatedly said it was an invisible jet.

Gee, I wonder.... I wonder...

[jetengine]

On the other hand, have you ever considered that one of the reasons for America’s success in the world is an emphasis on wealth creation, and a system that uses greed as an incentive to maximise that wealth?

That maybe there is ultimately some advantages to having a right wing as well as a left wing to balance it?

Put it this way…although there are always a great deal of posts about various injustices in the US here, there’s no real appetite for the regular posters here to emigrate to other countries!

That would require Balance. The Republicans dont want that, orr to be fair the beast the Party morphed into. Obama trying to reach out in friendship was the PERFECT time to reinvent the party. Instead they spat on him, time and again.

[CSTowle]

I follow news on crimes against children including trafficking, sex crimes, and porn possession. Especially by politicians. I didn't highlight the fact that he's a democrat because I don't care.

Of course not, you're just "concerned". Of course, nobody mentioned the fact that he was a Democrat because it wasn't relevant to the offense. But thanks for caring enough to highlight it.

But are you really not aware that “American privilege” exists similar to “White Privilege”?

That is: anyone born American is lucky and has through that luck has on average a better life than might be expected if he or she was born Chinese, Russian, Indian, Pakistani, Nigerian, etc, etc

And that one of the reasons for that better overall expectation is that the overall system you have works to your advantage?

Is it a fact that we are in a position of privilege for being born into a system which was built on genocide and land theft of the natives, enslavement of a foreign populace, exploitation/theft of resources/forcing smaller countries into debt/interfering with the governments and rival factions of other countries and selling weapons to both sides/etc.? Sure we are. We also learned from the best, so you know what it's like. But that doesn't mean we should continue that system or keep ourselves from criticizing it, even if that ultimately means a lower standard of living for us or having to pay in some ways for the crimes that built the system we continue to benefit from.

I have no doubt that there are some folk in the Democratic Party who are glad for the system we've had and continue to have, and put up a token protest but want to keep all the goodies. Especially throughout history. It's good PR, "we're not all bad". But some of us stumble onto this stuff after we get out of school and discover the world is not what we learn about in history books or on the news and legitimately are disgusted by it. Others try to justify it by claiming we've done more good than bad, or anyway do more good than bad now and the past is the past so no use crying about it (even if it does continue to impact countries and people around the world, and again we continue to benefit from it). And some just reflexively ignore it and call bulls##t because the USA is their tribe and can do no wrong, other than tolerating the wrongheaded thinking of "commies" and "traitors" who complain about what we've done and continue to do.

[JackDaw]

That would require Balance. The Republicans dont want that, orr to be fair the beast the Party morphed into. Obama trying to reach out in friendship was the PERFECT time to reinvent the party. Instead they spat on him, time and again.

But realistically there is a balance…unless you are taking the line that the Democratic Party is totally, utterly ineffective.

And again realistically life in US is substantially better than large majority of countries . Compare the US to paradise, and, of course, its sadly lacking.

Compare it to life in countries where most people live, and it then looks pretty good.

[JackDaw]

Of course not, you're just "concerned". Of course, nobody mentioned the fact that he was a Democrat because it wasn't relevant to the offense. But thanks for caring enough to highlight it.



Is it a fact that we are in a position of privilege for being born into a system which was built on genocide and land theft of the natives, enslavement of a foreign populace, exploitation/theft of resources/forcing smaller countries into debt/interfering with the governments and rival factions of other countries and selling weapons to both sides/etc.? Sure we are. We also learned from the best, so you know what it's like. But that doesn't mean we should continue that system or keep ourselves from criticizing it, even if that ultimately means a lower standard of living for us or having to pay in some ways for the crimes that built the system we continue to benefit from.

I have no doubt that there are some folk in the Democratic Party who are glad for the system we've had and continue to have, and put up a token protest but want to keep all the goodies. Especially throughout history. It's good PR, "we're not all bad". But some of us stumble onto this stuff after we get out of school and discover the world is not what we learn about in history books or on the news and legitimately are disgusted by it. Others try to justify it by claiming we've done more good than bad, or anyway do more good than bad now and the past is the past so no use crying about it (even if it does continue to impact countries and people around the world, and again we continue to benefit from it). And some just reflexively ignore it and call bulls##t because the USA is their tribe and can do no wrong, other than tolerating the wrongheaded thinking of "commies" and "traitors" who complain about what we've done and continue to do.

Yes..I agree that UK mindset and overall systems (if that is right word) is very similar to US and that both are imperfect, and it’s worthwhile to improve them further.

On the other hand I’m probably more cynical than you because where you put “I have no doubt there are folk in the Democratic Party who are glad…but want to keep all the goodies” I suspect it’s most of the people in the Democratic Party. I suspect few people are really internationalists to extent they would accept a lower of living to improve things in another country.

(Again I don’t see any difference in UK. Our Labour Party is keener to take more tax from big multinational business companies to improve British living, for example than to insist those companies pay better wages to overseas staff.)

But..I do think for a big superpower US has comparatively good overall balance in its system. In many ways think the Donald has a fairly similar psyche to Putin, but was unable to cause comparable damage because the US has better balance. But yes, I know that’s a very subjective judgment!

[JCAll]

Just my opinion, but conservatives are blaming Biden because they believe Putin wouldn't have attacked Ukraine if trump was still in office.

Eh, I don't think I believe them on that one. We've spent years hearing Republicans say that they prefer Putin to Democrats, they only changed that tune days into the invasion when they realized public opinion wasn't following them this time.

[Ragged Maw]

Is it a fact that we are in a position of privilege for being born into a system which was built on genocide and land theft of the natives, enslavement of a foreign populace, exploitation/theft of resources/forcing smaller countries into debt/interfering with the governments and rival factions of other countries and selling weapons to both sides/etc.? Sure we are. We also learned from the best, so you know what it's like. But that doesn't mean we should continue that system or keep ourselves from criticizing it, even if that ultimately means a lower standard of living for us or having to pay in some ways for the crimes that built the system we continue to benefit from.

That.....kind of implies it's a zero-sum game, something many others advocating similarly for social reform insists it isn't.

[thwhtGuardian]

But are you really not aware that “American privilege” exists similar to “White Privilege”?

That is: anyone born American is lucky and has through that luck has on average a better life than might be expected if he or she was born Chinese, Russian, Indian, Pakistani, Nigerian, etc, etc

And that one of the reasons for that better overall expectation is that the overall system you have works to your advantage?

Being an American definitely has its privileges, but that said some are more privileged than others and it doesn't need to be that way so no, I'm not going to go easy on the crazy part of the right wing.

[JackDaw]

That.....kind of implies it's a zero-sum game, something many others advocating similarly for social reform insists it isn't.

It didn’t really necessarily imply it’s a zero sum game.

Imagine a more rational worldwide system increased overall global wealth by 10 percent…if you really really wanted worldwide equality there would still need to be a substantial net flow of wealth from the present super rich countries to the less fortunate ones. The rich countries would still need to make sacrifices.

In general terms suspect with dwindling natural resources, global warming, etc IF all the problems caused by that are going to solved, it’s going to require less wasteful lifestyles in the richer countries…that the line that it can all be solved by technology advance is just head in the sand stuff.

Hope I’m wrong.

[Ragged Maw]

In general terms suspect with dwindling natural resources, global warming, etc IF all the problems caused by that are going to solved, it’s going to require less wasteful lifestyles in the richer countries…that the line that it can all be solved by technology advance is just head in the sand stuff.

Hope I’m wrong.

I'm pretty sure a strong majority of people in these richer countries aren't all that wasteful.

[JackDaw]

I'm pretty sure a strong majority of people in these richer countries aren't all that wasteful.

It would be interesting to crunch the numbers to establish that one way or the other.

I certainly think a lot of Brits use a fair amount of petrol in their several family cars, fly abroad fairly frequently, eat and drink to excess, and generally consume a lot more scarce resources than their Indian counterparts. Doubt if it’s that different in America…it’s not all down to the super rich.

But no idea how you’d do that (crunch the numbers) and how (if it turned out you could get adequate results by changing comparatively few peoples lifestyles) you could enforce change.

It’s easy to see overall global system is very unfair, but incredibly difficult to bring change about. A mate who started a PhD on the subject of how a truly equitable economic system would operate gave up because it was too complex. (Mind you, he made it more difficult for himself by trying to base it all on Christian ideals.)

[Kirby101]

But are you really not aware that “American privilege” exists similar to “White Privilege”?

That is: anyone born American is lucky and has through that luck has on average a better life than might be expected if he or she was born Chinese, Russian, Indian, Pakistani, Nigerian, etc, etc

And that one of the reasons for that better overall expectation is that the overall system you have works to your advantage?

Absolutely true. But the system I was born into had a big emphasis on the middle class and a high tax rate for the wealthy. We had unions to keep wages and benefits up and spending on things to help working people and the country in general. Since Reagan the emphasis has been to tax the Rich less and less and to put more onto working people, while keeping wages stagnant. Taxes have been cut for the investor and inheritance class while constant pressure has been put on working people. The GOP has managed to return us to the time of Robber Barons of the Gilded Age.

[Mister Mets]

Name calling is all the Right has. They have no workable agenda that will do any good for anyone but the Rich.

Name calling does not appear to be exclusive to the right.

And then Qpublicans will blame Biden for releasing those reserves. He can’t win, and I’m sure he knows that.

He shouldn't care what the Qpublicans think, so long as the rest of the country is on his side.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Alabama Gov. Kay Ivey will not meet with Vice President Kamala Harris on Selma trip

Gov. Kay Ivey will not meet with Vice President Kamala Harris on her trip to Selma this weekend for events commemorating Bloody Sunday.

Gina Maiola, the governor’s communications director, said Friday that Gov. Ivey “has other engagements.”

"Other engagements", eh? How utterly convenient. Anything to avoid meeting with the country's first black woman as Vice-President.