All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[AnakinFlair]

The EPA just banned a copper mine from opening in the middle of the world's number one source of sock eye salmon...and one would think that would be a win for everyone. Unfortunately the Republican Governor of Alaska sees things differently:


Why would you want development at the cost of fish bearing streams? Especially when a not insignificant number of your population(bit native American and non-native) survive or are otherwise employed by the fishing industry?

I mean yeah, money, I get it his campaign was likely financed by mining corporations and land development companies...but at some point doesn't the welfare of the people trump that?

No. For a Republican, it's all about how much money they can make for themselves, and to hell with the suckers that put them in office.

[Mister Mets]

In this situation, voting against fascists and bigots and keeping them out of office would be a decent start.

It's not complicated at all -- it's just that many Republcans actively elect these authoritarian bigots to office because they share their values.

There are 644 days until the next election. What should ordinary Americans do until then?

What should they do in the context of the Republican primary, which was where wishful thinking came up in the conversation?

[Jack Dracula]

Seek out and organize with like minded conservatives that are sick of where the GoP is taking conservatism. Then seek out donors to aid you in reaching out to those other like-minded voters out there until you can show that the current trend of conservatism has a visible consequence for continuing as the status quo. Actual conservative voices will have a much better chance of convincing other conservatives to abandon the hate and bigotry that the GoP has enshrined than any liberal could after all, and grassroots fundraising has worked before so you don't have to seek out Big Name donors even if they would help amplify the message. All it takes is the effort to do it, and the reward is a Republican Party you can be proud of again.

Que up the “But how?” responses, because it’s not about fixing their party and has never been.
The average “sane, moderate” conservative is actually fine with their party as long as they’re getting the one or two grievances they care about addressed. After all, it won’t be them with a boot on their neck after the autocrats take over.

Edit: There it is.

There are 644 days until the next election. What should ordinary Americans do until then?

What should they do in the context of the Republican primary, which was where wishful thinking came up in the conversation?

Here's a suggestion Mets. Ask yourself how the Tea Party gained so much influence in the GOP in such a short time. People from several different states with a common purpose made contact on social media, organized, got the backing of wealthy, influential people and made their voices heard.

[aja_christopher]

There are 644 days until the next election. What should ordinary Americans do until then?

What should they do in the context of the Republican primary, which was where wishful thinking came up in the conversation?

I've made it clear repeatedly what I feel people should do at this point -- if you don't know what that is then it only shows that you haven't been listening.

Realistically speaking however, that is a question you should be asking yourself as the answer doesn't involve inciting rhetorical arguments on message boards while ignoring the Republican bigots and fascists in question.

As you have repeatedly exemplified, many of these "ordinary Americans" are Republicans who support and/or enable the bigots and fascists regardless, so your question doesn't even make sense in that respect.

What should they do?

Stop supporting bigots and fascists.

Honestly, I find it somewhat insane that we even have to still have this conversation after we just watched the Republican president try to overthrow the government while the House Republicans voted to reject Biden's fair democratic election -- but like I also said long ago, some people don't seem to learn their lesson until they are finally the victims of the despots they have enabled.

Here's a suggestion Mets. Ask yourself how the Tea Party gained so much influence in the GOP in such a short time. People from several different states with a common purpose made contact on social media, organized, got the backing of wealthy, influential people and made their voices heard.

I was going to suggest waiting until being bitten by a radioactive spider, then swinging into action to punch out Hitler or something similar, but that sounds a bit more rational.

One thing I've always respected about most superheroes is that it's not their power that makes them heroes -- it's their ability to make the right and moral choice even in the face of the most insurmoutable odds.

Even when they make mistakes, or temporarily lose their moral compass and/or their powers, it's still those choices that make them heroes.

[Mister Mets]

I've made it clear repeatedly what I feel people should do at this point -- if you don't know what that is then it only shows that you haven't been listening.

Realistically speaking however, that is a question you should be asking yourself as the answer doesn't involve inciting rhetorical arguments on message boards while ignoring the Republican bigots and fascists in question.

As you have repeatedly exemplified, many of these "ordinary Americans" are Republicans who support and/or enable the bigots and fascists regardless, so your question doesn't even make sense in that respect.

What should they do?

Stop supporting bigots and fascists.

Honestly, I find it somewhat insane that we even have to still have this conversation after we just watched the Republican president try to overthrow the government while the House Republicans voted to reject Biden's fair democratic election -- but like I also said long ago, some people don't seem to learn their lesson until they are finally the victims of the despots they have enabled.

I get the impression that you think most people should essentially be Democratic activists, but in this discussion, we usually focus more on what elected officials and the media should do, rather than the general public.

The question isn't about what people shouldn't do, but about what they affirmatively should do.

Que up the “But how?” responses, because it’s not about fixing their party and has never been.
The average “sane, moderate” conservative is actually fine with their party as long as they’re getting the one or two grievances they care about addressed. After all, it won’t be them with a boot on their neck after the autocrats take over.

Edit: There it is.


Here's a suggestion Mets. Ask yourself how the Tea Party gained so much influence in the GOP in such a short time. People from several different states with a common purpose made contact on social media, organized, got the backing of wealthy, influential people and made their voices heard.

I don't think the tea party could be replicated.

Part of it is that there was a window when Republicans were looking for a new direction, and Democrats were politically vulnerable.

It served as a rebranding even if it was partially BS (the tea party was ostensibly supposed to be about newcomers upset about high spending from Democrats and the Bush administration; it was largely coopted by generic Republicans who would have been doing the same thing regardless of whether there was a tea party.)

There was a bit of an instinct that the old way of doing things didn't work, so there was a mood for change, but it could go in different directions, with the libertarian Ron Paul getting much of their support in 2012 and Donald Trump being the candidate in 2016.

It was easier for the GOP to paper over the differences because they were united against Democrats, and in general agreement that the previous Republican president had screwed up. Trump's trying again, so there's a split between his supporters and his detractors which makes forming a movement difficult.

With the tea party, there was also plenty of grifting, and political outsiders who had no idea what they were doing, which isn't a good idea to emulate.

[Gray Lensman]

I get the impression that you think most people should essentially be Democratic activists, but in this discussion, we usually focus more on what elected officials and the media should do, rather than the general public.

The GoP needs to stop with the grievance politics, stop doing the things that cost them elections, and maybe even try to do what they campaigned on rather than chase social media clicks.

The ran on inflation, crime, immigration. The first order of business for the House? Investigate the 1/6 committee, Hunter Biden's laptop, and "weaponization of the federal government" - which seems to mean any investigation of any Republican for any reason. Gym Jordan is basically saying only Democrats can commit crimes and only Republicans can be trusted to investigate them.

The only other idea I have heard from them is to steal my retirement to hand more money over to rich people.

[aja_christopher]

I get the impression that you think most people should essentially be Democratic activists.

Don't "get the impression" about me -- read what I am writing and take it at face value, rather than trying to insert your own agenda.

There is no "sliippery slope" here -- I am saying quite simply that Republicans, and Americans in general, should stop supporting bigots and fascists in politics.

It's not at all complex, nor difficult really, so let's not make it so.



That said, I'm under the distinct impression that Republicans would like to keep playing with fire until we all get burned, so I guess we'll see how it plays out.

------

The only other idea I have heard from them is to steal my retirement to hand more money over to rich people.

This entire conversation is bad deja vu -- dealing with more concern about potential and imagined "Democratic activism" than real and overt Republican incompetence, malice and corruption.

I also remember said questioner claiming he didn't like loaded questions, yet he certainly has no problem asking them and rejecting any answer that doesn't fit into his chosen paradigm.

Mets, if you're wondering why people often assume that you aren't aruguing in good faith, it's because you seldom give any evidence to the contrary as many of these "techniques" are almost Shapiro level transparent.

That's just an observation so don't take it personally -- instead either learn from it or accept that it's hard to take someone seriously when all they do is point the finger at everything but the real problem.

[Jack Dracula]

I get the impression that you think most people should essentially be Democratic activists, but in this discussion, we usually focus more on what elected officials and the media should do, rather than the general public.

The question isn't about what people shouldn't do, but about what they affirmatively should do.



I don't think the tea party could be replicated.

Part of it is that there was a window when Republicans were looking for a new direction, and Democrats were politically vulnerable.

It served as a rebranding even if it was partially BS (the tea party was ostensibly supposed to be about newcomers upset about high spending from Democrats and the Bush administration; it was largely coopted by generic Republicans who would have been doing the same thing regardless of whether there was a tea party.)

There was a bit of an instinct that the old way of doing things didn't work, so there was a mood for change, but it could go in different directions, with the libertarian Ron Paul getting much of their support in 2012 and Donald Trump being the candidate in 2016.

It was easier for the GOP to paper over the differences because they were united against Democrats, and in general agreement that the previous Republican president had screwed up. Trump's trying again, so there's a split between his supporters and his detractors which makes forming a movement difficult.

With the tea party, there was also plenty of grifting, and political outsiders who had no idea what they were doing, which isn't a good idea to emulate.

Did I say the Tea Party should be replicated? I used it as an example of a successful movement within your party. You can look at the movement's beginnings and study its strategies and methods. Obviously, this is a different set of circumstances. You have to start somewhere and doing so with a movement that was successful within your party is a good choice.

This is the point where you'll continue to poke holes and make excuses.

[aja_christopher]

[worstblogever]

I get the impression that you think most people should essentially be Democratic activists.

You get the wrong impression.

What people seem to be saying repeatedly, that gets ignore again and again... is it would be nice to see people to hear the call to basic decency, and to have a low bar of just having enough courage to stand up to bigots when that call is made.

You, and so many modern Republicans fail to meet that low bar, again and again. I

It's cowardly. It's pathetic. It's a failure to just do the right thing as a human. And it's damaging to this country.

That, at least, is what I think. I won't speak for what christopher_aja thinks.


If that's somehow "Democratic activism", I think that's a great brand for the party.

[Dalak]

Que up the “But how?” responses, because it’s not about fixing their party and has never been.
The average “sane, moderate” conservative is actually fine with their party as long as they’re getting the one or two grievances they care about addressed. After all, it won’t be them with a boot on their neck after the autocrats take over.

Edit: There it is.

Here's a suggestion Mets. Ask yourself how the Tea Party gained so much influence in the GOP in such a short time. People from several different states with a common purpose made contact on social media, organized, got the backing of wealthy, influential people and made their voices heard.

Did I say the Tea Party should be replicated? I used it as an example of a successful movement within your party. You can look at the movement's beginnings and study its strategies and methods. Obviously, this is a different set of circumstances. You have to start somewhere and doing so with a movement that was successful within your party is a good choice.

This is the point where you'll continue to poke holes and make excuses.

Another suggestion:Currently there's alot of talk among NY republicans about a certain Rep Santos who's refusal to resign is tied to another huge problem with the modern GoP: Lies and Crimes are fine if you're Republican. I'm sure it wouldn't take much effort to talk to any of local republican organizations which can be found by talking with local officials, and then Mets can seek out like-minded conservatives under the pretext of discussing Santos. Truth is very important to him as he says.

You get the wrong impression.

What people seem to be saying repeatedly, that gets ignore again and again... is it would be nice to see people to hear the call to basic decency, and to have a low bar of just having enough courage to stand up to bigots when that call is made.

You, and so many modern Republicans fail to meet that low bar, again and again. I

It's cowardly. It's pathetic. It's a failure to just do the right thing as a human. And it's damaging to this country.

That, at least, is what I think. I won't speak for what christopher_aja thinks.


If that's somehow "Democratic activism", I think that's a great brand for the party.

I specifically have been posting about conservative general voters fed up with the GoP as it is, and an outline of how they each can actually do something that could impact the situation (As more detail would require Omniscience in regards to individuals and local conditions). A Republican Party that can be respected once more and doesn't endlessly require defenses against it's many moral failings should be enough of an incentive to anyone who actually cares about such things.

[Kevinroc]

Trump proposes genocidal national ban on transgender existence if he wins 2024

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/202...9:21.000-08:00

On Tuesday morning, Donald Trump released an anti-transgender tirade of a speech on his social media website Truth Social, outlining a genocidal plan against all transgender existence in the United States. Everyone on the right from mainstream Republicans to hardcore neo-Nazis are celebrating the video while Democrats and legacy news media outlets have so far largely ignored it. “So this is what we are up against,” tweeted legislative researcher and pro-transgender activist Erin Reed. She continues, “a national transgender ban in 2024. This is what they are planning. DeSantis is practicing this through executive actions in Florida. Trump is openly saying he will do the same.” This is unambiguously genocidal territory.

It's important to remember this isn't just Trump's position. This is the mainstream GOP position.

[Tendrin]

Gee.

Haven't I been warning about this kind of thing for a while?

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Marjorie Taylor Greene Compares Tyre Nichols To Capitol Rioter Ashli Babbitt

Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) is already using her new perch on the House Oversight Committee to host a pity party for the mob rioters who ransacked the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021.

During a committee meeting on Tuesday, Greene compared the police killing of Tyre Nichols during a traffic stop in Memphis, Tennessee, to the police shooting of Capitol rioter Ashli Babbitt as she tried to break into an inner room of the Capitol.

Even for MTG, this is a new low. At least until next week.

[Spike-X]

Trump proposes genocidal national ban on transgender existence if he wins 2024

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/202...9:21.000-08:00



It's important to remember this isn't just Trump's position. This is the mainstream GOP position.

This. Is. LITERALLY. Nazi. Ideology.

That's not hyperbole, nor hysteria. It's just plain fact.