Original join date: 11/23/2004
Eclectic Connoisseur of all things written, drawn, or imaginatively created.
It is biological female, not biological woman. Gender is a social construct. How do I know that for sure? Because I am a Black woman. And I know that 100 hell even 50 years back I would not be counted as a "real" woman because of the color of my skin. Female, sure, good to be fucked and tossed aside. Good for cleaning, and cooking, or taking care of kids. Sure those part of "Womanhood" I would have access to, but without any of the dignity that being a good housekeeper should earn me. So not a full woman. Not in the same way that White women are considered women.
And I am saying that if people cared about fairness in sports then those issues would come up. Also with bathrooms. They way people talk they seem to think that the male half of the species have uncontrollable sexual urges. So all of these "butch women" entering male bathrooms or even prisons would be at risk right? Especially with how people talk about rape in general in male prisons, you'd think people would be concerned about transgendered men entering male prisons. But they are not.
A transgender person fighting in the Women's division in MMA was brought up as an example. The person, in his/ her first fight, gave the woman he/ she was fighting a concussion, a fractured jaw and so on, just destroyed her, mostly because he/ she was so overwhelmingly stronger and with denser bone structure. The transgender person did not tell the MMA organization that she was a transgender person. That came out later. When she did, the social pressure forced them to allow it. You've also got a transgender person who entered weightlifting in the Women's division and started breaking world records. You've got a lot of women who compete in these things furious. You would have thought Feminist organizations would say this isn't fair to women. But many seem to be defending the transgender person possibly because they don't want to be perceived as anti-TG or because it's part of the package of LTBG. P.S. I fit into the B category.
But the example was that it has gotten to the point that you cannot even state scientific facts without accusations of being a sexist or whatever. If I say that a transgender person is not completely female, even in terms of muscle mass and bone density, I'm an anti-transgender bigot. But it's a fact that they are not completely women. No, facts don't matter, you're a bigot.
Unfortunately, that's the sort of thing I think turns so many people off and where that political correctness thing comes from. For most people, they are not thinking about stuff like using the N word or filthy, derogatory names for women. That's not what they mean by being anti PC. They are talking about stuff like the above or about people who practically are hunting for someone to say one word they can twist into some anti-something remark that they can be offended by.
Mind you, I get that TG people are usually very troubled and need to be accepted. I know what it feels like to be hurt by anti-gay and anti-bi remarks.
THAT is NOT what I am defending. But we have become so polarized that you cannot even state facts like a TG person is not 100% female in numerous ways. I would not go out of my way to say that but, when it comes to a sports discussion about someone competing in a Women's division, you can either state facts or think, "Oh, I better pretend there's no difference when I know there is or I'll be called a bigot".
For most people, I think that's the kind of thing where that "politically correct" thing comes from.
Power with Girl is better.
In fairness, that's because a TG person, woman becoming man, is generally not gaining a physical advantage. It is probably also because, statistically, men are far more likely to be sexual predators. Now THAT may well be where real bigotry comes in. People are assuming that a TG person who becomes a woman still has a stereotypical male mentality and is more likely to be sexually aggressive in very wrong ways. BUT there would be those who, if you say women are not as aggressive, it makes you a sexist.
Oh, I grant you that this kind of "anti'P.C." stuff is trivial and making a mountain out of a mole hill but, in this case, you can't even deal with evidence. As Joe Rogan said, he's been in martial arts for something like thirty years and anybody who says men or trans women don't have an advantage versus women just does not know what they are talking about.
Power with Girl is better.
Power with Girl is better.
Power with Girl is better.
Except that trans women receive estrogen. Contrary to what most people think, it does not reduce bone density in a full grown person. In fact, it preserves what is already there.
Yes, individuals have differences. People with extraordinary reflexes or strength dominate sports on an individual level. And, yes, racism and bigotry have been used to keep people out of sports. Nor are there that many TG people that go into sports. But when those who do were not amounting to squat as male athletes but dominate as female athletes, there is a factual argument for fairness to women. I might add that seems to be the forgotten factor.
Power with Girl is better.
I know I'm on a posting spree but I would accept this because it is supported by scientific evidence that men who transgender to women really are psychologically women and were always meant to be women. But, in terms of some aspects of the physical, no. At that point, someone is just ignoring science in favor of social attitudes.
Like you, I know that TG people undergo horrible cruelness and I'm quite happy to be standing right next to a T person on the LTBG scale. But I have to ignore facts to not be an anti-T bigot? Really?
Power with Girl is better.
There are plenty of people who fought for civil rights and then turned around and engaged in horrific racism towards those same people. So yes, yes you can fight for those rights and still be a bigot.
Plenty of bigots are evidence of this even now.
Last edited by Tendrin; 05-16-2020 at 10:06 AM.
There are plenty of left wing podcasters and Youtubers and such, it's just that they are genuinely grassroots focused and funded small time operations, unlike those on the right who pretend to be this but actually have significant corporate backing, which means that they tend to reach a limited audience and hardly ever make an impression in the general media landscape. And watching MSNBC is hardly something to be proud of, even with their constant attempts to shift their messaging to the right and give platforms to disgraced former Republicans, they are still barely a blip on the radar, because why would anyone choose to watch them to hear half-assed center right talking points, when you could just watch Fox News instead?
Also, since when has the right been "on point" with messaging? Conservatives are nothing if not incoherent and inconsistent at the best of times, but if they shout at the camera loud enough and make lame jokes about PC lib cuck soyboys, there will inevitably be some centrist clown who wants to occupy the sensible middle ground between Richard Spencer and AOC, nevermind that she would be considered a moderate by any reasonable standard and he is a literal Nazi.
Last edited by PwrdOn; 05-16-2020 at 10:11 AM.
To be honest, I think it's part of the rise of the Trump insanity. I think there are people so tired of walking on eggshells that they see this lunatic saying all sorts of things with no regard for the political correctness of it and they love it even when they disagree with a lot of it.
It's a dilemma though because I think the right and the left both see the other side as extreme and having gone insane. But it is a dilemma because gay rights, TG rights and women's rights are all of essential importance and you can't back off. Surprisingly, there are a lot of people on the right that support all of these things but we have become so sensitive about every little thing that I think we've already seen the backlash.
Mind you, I know there are a lot of conservatives that are redneck bigots, racists, homophobes, etc. But I think there are far more who really may not personally approve of certain things (on religious grounds or what have you) but don't think they have any right to stop it and would never say anything cruel.
Power with Girl is better.