All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[PaulBullion]

When you have to go back 40 to 50 years to find things the democrats have done for minorities you basically make my point. What happened 50 years ago isn't relevant to current politics today anymore than the stupid republican talking point about the democrats being the founders of the KKK is relevant. Things change over the decades and directions of parties change.

Lets consider the crime bills of the 90's pushed by Joe Biden and signed by Bill Clinton who are wait for it . . . . democrats. Those are blamed for the mass incarceration of blacks that continues today. Biden was taken to task during the primaries as was Hilary Clinton in 2016. Then when they got the nomination all the liberals were "oh wait, just kidding we like you again now."

Democrats are also indirectly causing the increasing murder and death of black people Democrats also push false narratives about police that the police are out to kill black people and are racist against them for disproportionately arresting them and then show out of context stats to prove this by saying that X% of blacks are in the prison system despite only being 13% of the population. What they don't say and scream racism at anyone who does is that the prison population is both a result of their own policies (the crime bill of the democrats in the 90's) and the disproportionate amount of crime committed by black males in this country. Black males make up 6.5% of the population yet year after year commit between 50 and 60% of the murders and robberies. So of course they are going to prison at a higher rate because they are committing the offenses most likely to land you in prison at a much higher rate. Here are the 2018 crime states by the FBI. Well over 90% of murders are by males so I'm using males here by default. Black males committed 53% of the murders and 54% of the robberies. They also committed disproportionately higher rates of other major crimes as well. "Oh but thats only because the police are racist and only arrest black people" is a common refute. Except that its statistically proven year after year year most crimes and especially murder are done within the same race, blacks kill blacks and whites kill whites etc. The race % of victims of murders closely matches the % of race of the murderers themselves and you can't fake the race of the victims. What this has caused is all the blowback we are seeing this year over police incidents which has the effect of causing police to back off and then you see skyrocketing murder rates in the black communities. Shootings and murders of black people by other black people have as much as doubled in places like Chicago, St Louis, Baltimore, New York, etc since George Floyd and the protests began. And this is 100% IMO caused by the false narrative that democrats push that the police are out there murdering black men every day just because they are black. Here is the FBI crime chart for 2018 since many refuse to believe stats on race and crime unless they see it: https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s...ables/table-43

Democrats have also enabled a culture of poverty which permeates the black community. This has led to the hopelessness and generational poverty that continues with no hopes of getting out. Which in turn is what drives some black male teens into gangs which is where most of the black on black crime comes from. Do republicans have great solutions? No not really. But its sure as hell obvious that the democrats are making it worse.

40 years?

Do you even know what ACA stands for, and how recently it was passed?

[Kirby101]

The ACA was not 50 years ago and it halved the Black uninsured. And while the Voting Rights Act was 50 years ago, the Democrats have been fighting to help Black people keep the right to vote while the GOP has spent 50 years trying to stop them from voting.
As for prison, if you don't talk about the inherent racism in sentencing which is rampant and the GOP for profit prison industry, I wouldn't mention prison population if I were you.
And let's talk about shootings while one Party refuses to do even the smallest thing in the way of gun regulation.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Sorry, I quoted the wrong post, I meant to quote the one you quoted. Hold on, I will try to fix that.

Ah, no prob. Happens

[GindyPosts]

The ACA was not 50 years ago and it halved the Black uninsured. And while the Voting Rights Act was 50 years ago, the Democrats have been fighting to help Black people keep the right to vote while the GOP has spent 50 years trying to stop them from voting.
As for prison, if you don't talk about the inherent racism in sentencing which is rampant and the GOP for profit prison industry, I wouldn't mention prison population if I were you.
And let's talk about shootings while one Party refuses to do even the smallest thing in the way of gun regulation.

In the state of Indiana, the GOP privatized the whole prison system due to the fact that they didn't want to spend money on treating inmates like human beings.

Ironically, the Democratic nominee for governor that's running was in charge of one of the companies, Corizon Health, overseeing the system's health care, and did a pretty sloppy job (which was par for the course for Corizon's CEOs), according to many sources. Proving once again the Indiana Democratic Party can't resist picking Great Value Republicans.

Here's some context, by the way about Corizon Health, that while the Indianapolis Star has put on a subscription paywall, it's been documented by other groups:

https://www.prisonlegalnews.org/news...d-health-care/

https://www.opb.org/news/article/jai...-death-oregon/

https://www.eeoc.gov/newsroom/corizo...discrimination

[Kirby101]

Nikki Haley says it isn't a racist country. But she appointed Tim Scott to the Senate, and the only Black GOP Senator has been stopped by the Police for driving and walking while black 7 times. Including the Capitol Police.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Is that a fact?

Navarro: 'Melania Trump is the Jackie Kennedy of her time'

Golly gee whillickers! I didn’t know Jackie was a college dropout and posed for nudie magazines. I learned something new today.

[Mister Mets]

He was likely blackmailed to endorse Trump in 2016, pictured here:



He consolidated Evangelicals behind a hatemongering twit who is the antithesis of the Gospel he's supposed to love.

You can eye roll all you want, but no one can see it when you bury your head in places this deep.

It probably wasn't blackmail as much as shamelessness.

There's overlap between Falwell supporters and the Trump fans who think the world is changing too much, and culture wars are being lost.

Joel Osteen didn't inherit a national spotlight like someone named Falwell was assured of doing, for starters. For a country founded on rejecting the notion of kings, we have a disturbing tendency to think political influence should be inherited along with the house and bank account.

Osteen is probably a bigger deal than Falwell Jr (even before the pool boy stuff.)

Falwell Jr was President of a conservative university with about 80,000 students. I don't think he ever wrote a book, or had anything serious released written under his name.

Osteen's sermons are seen by millions of people around the world. He's written best-selling books.

[TriggerWarning]

This post just justifies the "defund the police" argument.

Black communities have been deliberately kept poor largely due to racist policies and the continuous economic redlining to the extent that even under-counting African-Americans during the census to reduce possible benefits has become a thing. Crime rates are simply higher among poorer people everywhere in the world, it's not an unusual situation at all particularly in a country that has done everything humanly possible to keep a group of people poor.

Trump right now is literally talking about enforcing redlining which doesn't in anyway shape or form help this situation. In fact, it's **** like this that's making minorities continuously vote Democrat. Ultimately, instead of training and using the Police like attack dogs, more money should taken from the Police and diverted to improve education and other facilities in less privileged communities. The way to handle crime is to address the underlying cause and not reinforce it which is what has happened in the US for far too long.

Republicans have done everything humanly possible to maintain old structures that hamper African-American progress to the extent that they are working to prevent them from voting. I mean, Colin Kapernick was demonized by the right for carrying out a peaceful, respectful protest at the advice of an ex-Navy SEAL, they are trying to cancel Cardi B (LOLOL) and are bringing QAnon and open bigots into their fold. So no, the Democracts aren't making anything worse, the GOP is deliberately targeting white voters at the expense of other races and everyone can see this.

I agree with you 100% on the part I bolded. Poverty is the largest driver of crime and you can look at the crime map of any city and then look at the poverty map and you'll see tremendous overlap. And obviously minorities suffer in greater poverty largely due to systemic racism going back centuries. However, defunding the police doesn't solve this. All defunding the police will do is cause what we are seeing in the bigger cities right now to grow even more - vastly increased shootings, vastly increased crime, etc.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I agree with you 100% on the part I bolded. Poverty is the largest driver of crime and you can look at the crime map of any city and then look at the poverty map and you'll see tremendous overlap. And obviously minorities suffer in greater poverty largely due to systemic racism going back centuries. However, defunding the police doesn't solve this. All defunding the police will do is cause what we are seeing in the bigger cities right now to grow even more - vastly increased shootings, vastly increased crime, etc.

Or, just a thought, the money you take from the police goes to social services and schools to actually help resolve the problem.

[Gray Lensman]

Or, just a thought, the money you take from the police goes to social services and schools to actually help resolve the problem.

Basically, slide the money from punishing/solving crimes towards preventing them.

[TriggerWarning]

The ACA was not 50 years ago and it halved the Black uninsured. And while the Voting Rights Act was 50 years ago, the Democrats have been fighting to help Black people keep the right to vote while the GOP has spent 50 years trying to stop them from voting.
As for prison, if you don't talk about the inherent racism in sentencing which is rampant and the GOP for profit prison industry, I wouldn't mention prison population if I were you.
And let's talk about shootings while one Party refuses to do even the smallest thing in the way of gun regulation.

No lets absolutely talk about prison. Absolutely I agree with you that the whole crack vs regular cocaine disparity of the early 90's pushed by Bush was crap. Mandatory minimums of the 90's though were part of the crime bill signed by Clinton and pushed hard by Biden in the senate. Yet they are the savior now? As I pointed out blacks are committing over 50% of the murders despite being 13% of the population - its even worse when you consider that most are by males meaning its 6.5% of the population. They commit vastly higher rates of crime across the board. As I said my last post in agreeing with someone else its poverty that drives the crime rate and that poverty has its roots in systemic racism. But what are we supposed to do in the meantime, not send those committing seriously violent crime to prison?

As to disparate sentencing, yep it happens. Its going to happen when you give judges discretion and every judge is going to sentence differently. The opposite of that is to set standards for sentencing like mandatory minimums . . . except how well did that work out? However I would also argue that its not nearly as racist as some like to claim because people like to look at things without context, much like the left doesn't look at actual crime stats and who is committing them before proclaiming racism. There was a meme circulating a few months ago about two armed robbers in Florida in front of the same judge where one, the white one, got a year in prison and the black one got 20 years. Sounds bad on the surface but they were different robberies. It was #1 for the white guy and he had no priors and he actually was in the car the whole time (getaway driver) and he flipped and testified on the other two robbers in agreement for a lighter sentence. It was robbery #3 for the black guy who was unrepentant and had a long list of other crimes - he got sentenced like a career criminal would be sentenced based on his life of crime. Suddenly its easily explainable. Or people cherry pick two completely unrelated things to try and make a stupid point. You see Dylan Roof not being shot by police being brought up all the time - well thats what happens when you meekly surrender. Then Dylan Roof getting Burger King - were the cops supposed to not feed him during the day / night long interrogation? Were they supposed to starve him which would then give his lawyers the argument in court that his confession was coerced by starvation?

As to guns. First off 2nd amendment, its a battle you can't win. Secondly there are more gun than people in this country so what is your realistic plan to make these guns go away and get them out of the hands of the majority of owners who aren't criminals? Especially when the majority of the police you want to do it are gun owners themselves who aren't going to want to comply either. How much violence and police shootings are you willing to accept as the police try to round up guns from millions of people who have committed no crime but suddenly have an illegal gun in their possession. And now lets say you've done the impossible and somehow actually gotten all the guns from the people, how do you stop them from flowing in across our borders? People, guns, and drugs are already smuggled in huge quantities across the Mexican border. We aren't an island like England where its much easier to control the flow into the country. Gun control is a fantasy that has zero shot of actually be implementable. Even if you found some middle ground of registration and mandatory training well that doesn't do anything because the vast majority of murders in this country by the people doing it aren't following the law anyway. Do you think you gangbangers on the street are carrying guns they purchased legally? Do you think the drive by shootings done every day in cities across America are done with legally bought guns? No they are stolen. They are traded for drugs. They are acquired by other illegal means.

[TriggerWarning]

Basically, slide the money from punishing/solving crimes towards preventing them.

Wait you mean like the street crime unit in New York city whose job it was to go out and prevent street crime before it happened. By getting guns off the street and arresting gangbangers on low level offenses to get them off the street? The street crime unit who was disbanded after George Floyd and the defund the police push. And now the shooting and murder rate in New York is skyrocketing. This date is a couple of weeks old (August 9th) but it in 2020 New York has had 883 shootings with 1017 victims. In 2019 at the same time they had 446 shootings with 551 victims. Shootings and murders skyrocketed after the street crime unit was disbanded.

https://abc7ny.com/nyc-has-1000th-sh...surge/6363550/

[numberthirty]

Wait you mean like the street crime unit in New York city whose job it was to go out and prevent street crime before it happened. By getting guns off the street and arresting gangbangers on low level offenses to get them off the street? The street crime unit who was disbanded after George Floyd and the defund the police push. And now the shooting and murder rate in New York is skyrocketing. This date is a couple of weeks old (August 9th) but it in 2020 New York has had 883 shootings with 1017 victims. In 2019 at the same time they had 446 shootings with 551 victims. Shootings and murders skyrocketed after the street crime unit was disbanded.

https://abc7ny.com/nyc-has-1000th-sh...surge/6363550/

Politely, I'm fairly sure that is not what he means.

By the time you are doing what is in blue in your post, you are already assembling an Acme Kit.

I believe the idea will wind up being "Get Way Out In Front Of It, And Create A Situation Where A Number Of Your Eventual Criminals Never Actually Wind Up Being Criminals..."

[numberthirty]

I agree with you 100% on the part I bolded. Poverty is the largest driver of crime and you can look at the crime map of any city and then look at the poverty map and you'll see tremendous overlap. And obviously minorities suffer in greater poverty largely due to systemic racism going back centuries. However, defunding the police doesn't solve this. All defunding the police will do is cause what we are seeing in the bigger cities right now to grow even more - vastly increased shootings, vastly increased crime, etc.

Just to get your take on this...

Do you honestly believe that funding the police has solved it? Made any real progress towards solving it?

[The Cool Thatguy]

No lets absolutely talk about prison. Absolutely I agree with you that the whole crack vs regular cocaine disparity of the early 90's pushed by Bush was crap. Mandatory minimums of the 90's though were part of the crime bill signed by Clinton and pushed hard by Biden in the senate. Yet they are the savior now?

This just in, republicans still baffled that people can change their opinions over a period of years and decades.