All purpose news and politics thread part VI: This Is Not The Time For Posing

[Mister Mets]

Well it's more complicated, more pathetic than that. The Labour party has been thoroughly bought by Neoliberal so much that when the party soldiers put forth a nominee who, for all his faults, was proposing solid decent ideas for what needs to be done, they mounted a self-sabotaging party insurgency of the likes you can't believe. Like during the snap elections Theresa May called out, they sabotaged and disobeyed campaign directives despite being in a hair's breadth away from winning Parliament, and these a--holes actually felt down when Labour extended its reach in that election. The truth is that party moderates demand radicals and others to back the platform for the sake of party unity but never extend the same courtesy in return when the radicals get a chance to steer the ship, which happened with Corbyn. I have no doubt that if Sanders won the nomination in 2020, the Dem moderates wouldn't extend the same courtesy of party unity to him that they in turn demanded, and got with full heart, from Sanders and the rest.

The labour party seems much weaker in England than the Democrats in the United States.

Assuming Conservatives don't call a new election until they need to, it seems we're going to have a fifty year period in which Tony Blair is the only leader in the labour party to have lead it to victory in fifty years.

[A Small Talent For War]

Well it's more complicated, more pathetic than that. The Labour party has been thoroughly bought by Neoliberal so much that when the party soldiers put forth a nominee who, for all his faults, was proposing solid decent ideas for what needs to be done, they mounted a self-sabotaging party insurgency of the likes you can't believe. Like during the snap elections Theresa May called out, they sabotaged and disobeyed campaign directives despite being in a hair's breadth away from winning Parliament, and these a--holes actually felt down when Labour extended its reach in that election. The truth is that party moderates demand radicals and others to back the platform for the sake of party unity but never extend the same courtesy in return when the radicals get a chance to steer the ship, which happened with Corbyn. I have no doubt that if Sanders won the nomination in 2020, the Dem moderates wouldn't extend the same courtesy of party unity to him that they in turn demanded, and got with full heart, from Sanders and the rest.

There is a comparison with the United States, but much contrast as well. I believe that in the parliamentary system, the party in power forms the actual government while in the republican, parties must share power. I think the parliamentary system seems more effective or at least can avoid deadlock -- though at the same time, I can't imagine anything like the Brexit resolution getting off the ground in the United States system. However, even if any progressive Presidents won office, they would face opposition from conservative party members who actually still had power in the government. On top of that, many State governments can influence politics across the nation as well and those will always have a large number in the opposition party no matter who is in charge.

In the end, though, whether it is moderates opposing progressive policies or progressives torpedoing moderate candidates, the democrats' internal conflicts appear to be as severe and damaging as their fights with the conservatives who don't seem to be as willing to get into internal squabbles when it could cost them political power.

[InformationGeek]

Chris Cristie admitted on Twitter he has COVID. He was Trump's debate coach...

Also, Trump had been getting treatment since Thursday morning, so everyone knew he was infected before he went to that fundraiser.

[Tendrin]

Dang it, Geek! You beat me to it.

[Tami]

Chris Cristie admitted on Twitter he has COVID. He was Trump's debate coach...

Also, Trump had been getting treatment since Thursday morning, so everyone knew he was infected before he went to that fundraiser.

IF Chris Christie caught COVID from Trump, that means that Trump had COVID during the debate, even if he was asymptomatic at the time. Which means that Trump violated the rules about being tested ahead of time, Like Chris Wallace mentioned.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

The labour party seems much weaker in England than the Democrats in the United States.

I think the paradoxical reason for that is that in England someone like Clement Atlee came to power and instituted the NHS at the high level, whereas in USA, no one with a platform that social democratic has ever come to power. In England they have experience of left parties in power in various district and city levels, whereas in America it's been rare. Bernie Sanders an independent from Vermont governs a pretty small constituency in numerical terms but he's leveraged his conviction and consistency to becoming a national figure, propelling in turn Alexandria Ocasio Cortez in turn to the spotlight.

What I mean is, Bernie Sanders or someone like him never actually coming to power means paradoxically that he doesn't have a legacy and record of shame, failure, setback and broken promises that social democratic parties in Europe, South America, and Asia have undergone. In America, the moderate centrists are vulnerable because all their attempts at bipartisan have given them is conservatives spitting on their mercy. Centrist Bill Clinton who adopted Reagan's "make American great again" as a campaign slogan got Gingrich for his trouble, overtures of bipartisanship cost them the Supreme Court (people forget that Clarence Thomas won the nomination because 11 dems voted for him in the early 90s, had they held still, Thomas would have lost that nomination), who in turn repaid them with Bush v. Gore. Obama's "President of all Americans" got him the Tea Party and later McConnell denying his court appointments so he could hoard them for later.

That's why you are seeing a rise in militancy among the Democrats today or a greater consensus for that then there used to be. Because ultimately the centrist approach has simply enabled even more partisanship.

Assuming Conservatives don't call a new election until they need to, it seems we're going to have a fifty year period in which Tony Blair is the only leader in the labour party to have lead it to victory in fifty years.

Well Blair was Thatcher-lite for the most part, and he took Labour in such a rightward direction that at one point during the Iraq War, they proposed measures that made the Conservatives on the left-wing.

In the end, though, whether it is moderates opposing progressive policies or progressives torpedoing moderate candidates, the democrats' internal conflicts appear to be as severe and damaging as their fights with the conservatives who don't seem to be as willing to get into internal squabbles when it could cost them political power.

I think that's exaggerating things greatly. The internal divisions inside the Democrat party are not as damaging as the Labour Party's has been and still is. Bernie Sanders and his supporters campaigned with greater conviction for Hillary Clinton in 2016 than Hillary and hers did for Obama in 2007. AOC and others have been magnificent in uniting with Schumer to form a block after Ginsburg passed away.

In-fighting with the left is a story that the media likes to spin and exaggerate into, but while obviously it's a stereotype with a degree of truth in it, and can be a problem (and is a legit one in UK), it's not really been a feature in American politics to the extent people think.

[Joker]

Some really nasty comments here. I hope Trump pulls through and goes on to kick liberal backsides. They've long since lost the moral high ground.

LOL your country is about to fall of a cliff. Maybe get your own house in orderrrrr... Oh wait, you voted for Brexit. Neat.

[Tami]

.@senatemajldr
pushing back floor schedule for two weeks, as more GOP senators test positive for COVID-19.

Senate floor activity will resume week of October 19th, while Senate Judiciary Committee still plans to move forward with ACB SCOTUS confirmation hearings on Oct. 12.

Twitter Link

[Tami]

CNN just reported Trump’s vital signs have been bad and he’s not on a road to a fully recovery

[babyblob]

A direct quote from a member of my aunt's pro Trump message board.

"It is a sad day when people care more about Cam getting Covid then our president. Those people do not take care of themselves and get it all the time. It is not news." This post has 157 likes in 12 minutes.

Thats the GOP and Trumpers ladies and gentlemen.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

LOL your country is about to fall of a cliff. Maybe get your own house in orderrrrr... Oh wait, you voted for Brexit. Neat.

Say what you want, at the end of the day, Trump lost the popular vote in 2016. The majority of Americans reject Trump and continue to reject him. Whereas Brexit really did win the referendum fair and square. They also doubled and tripled down on that in the last election...in the UK Boris Johnson is popular, moreso than any other politician.

Ultimately the Trump and Republican agenda can be curtailed severely in the next 4 by POTUS Biden. Provided Dems keep power for another 8, they can reverse it fully, at least in theory.

Whereas Brexit is a scar for generations to come. It's totally lowered and reduced the advantages England once held on the world stage. England lost its empire but it acted on the world stage like it still had one and that illusion was maintained because of good deals with the EU, the special relationship with USA that allowed them to be the EU's voice in Washington's ears, and that also maximized their other holds in former colonies in the Commonwealth organizations. Without Brexit, you now have a reality where the USA and Biden tell UK that there's not going to be a trade deal if they mess with the Good Friday agreement, they're facing legal suits for breaking international law by the EU, and eventually to keep Scotland in the British Union they would have to go back hat in hand to the EU somewhere down the line again, and negotiate a deal with less leverage than they used to have.

[Joker]

Oh I am well aware of how the UK doubled down on Brexit. It is astonishingly stupid.

[Jack Dracula]

Some really nasty comments here. I hope Trump pulls through and goes on to kick liberal backsides. They've long since lost the moral high ground.

The Trumps have long since squandered any opportunity for sympathy. Anyone believing otherwise hasn't been paying attention.

[Joker]

They haven’t cared about any of our lives for the last 6 months and we’re supposed to care about theirs now? Nahhhhhhh

[shooshoomanjoe]

The argument is that Democratic operatives have been infecting Republicans via tainted microphones, door handles and cotton swabs.




https://twitter.com/CindyKendrick11/...188271104?s=20

So the problem are democrats using COVID as a biological weapon to take down republicans and not the super spreader events republicans have?