Superman in Apokolips War thread

[manwhohaseverything]

I have a lot of thoughts on the movie, but I'll try to limit them to Superman. It's not what I'd call a great movie because I think it has a lot of flaws, but I think there are some really great parts, especially toward the end.

spoilers:

As pointed out in the Sneak Peeks, the story starts when angry Superman makes a bit of a rash decision, albeit one backed by the senior JL members, to take on Darkseid head on. The JL/JLU has a few plots about Superman's recklessness, so there's nothing really new here, but there was a lot more heart in the older cartoons. Maybe it's a direct consequence of being able to use longer-form storytelling, I don't know. Yet, when you compare something like the episode "Twilight" where Superman is really pissed at Darkseid, says a lot of things out of anger, etc., you get to see a whole range of emotions and consequences that just can't play out in a movie like this. Perhaps more importantly, we got to see big plot elements from the prior show pay off with style. In regard to the movie, I get it, Superman has a lot of personal animosity toward Darkseid, so maybe he's not thinking straight when he tells the consolidated Justice League they're going to attack Apokolips, but it's more of a quick setup for the action to begin and all the pieces to fall into place than a genuine character study I felt the cartoon got right. I think Superman isn't particularly interesting throughout most of this movie, other than his never-say-die attitude which is pretty good. All of that seemed to change by the end, though. I normally don't care for mind-controlled Superman moments, but something about Super-Trigon is just fan-freakin'-tastic. And regular Superman's throwdown with Darkseid was also pretty cool. So while this isn't my favorite Superman movie, it gave me some pretty memorable stuff, too.

end of spoilers

Fans will find this movie controversial, though I think it'll be the good kind of controversial. An example of the bad kind would be The Killing Joke or Batman and Harley Quinn when the critiques of the movie questioned the moral integrity of creators.

I also think his death had also something to do with superman's decision to go to war. But like you said, alas it isn't fleshed out like in dcau.

[dietrich]

I think Bats, Supes and Constantine were served well by this New 52verse, because they had the most exposure. The Titans, Leaguers (Flash, GL, Hawkman, Green Arrow and others) mainly missed the boat. I haven't seen WW Bloodlines, but I heard it didn't sell well. It's still another movie to showcase Diana though. Aquaman's Throne of Atlantis movie was done better by his DCEU appearance. Plus, I felt the book arc was better executed.


Hitting the reset button always runs the risk of alienating the audience. There are more stories to tell with characters not Batman or Superman. It's a bummer they choose to end it like this. C'mon. A third Titans movie would be hot!

According to James Tucker on twitter last night they did have a 3rd Titans movie pitched that wasn't approved

[Dralokonda]

I feel the dcamu needed way more content to help flesh out its characters and story, cause as you go on watching, you find out things happening off screen that ultimately makes you scratch your head. Like clark and diana breaking up and clark getting together with lois. the new addisions to the teen titans. Barry suddenly getting visions about flashpoint etc. Plus, this series focused on far too few elements and didn't branch out enough on its own universe. Atfirst, too much focus on the batman area, too little focus on darkseid and superman, no focus on the green lanterns, flash and where the additional members of the league came from over time.

I know they comic book spin offs of the death of superman and suicide squad hell to pay but honestly, it really wasn't enough.

[magha_regulus]

This movie feels similar in spirit to what Snyder was attempting to do with the Justice League. I really liked it and it definitely feels like it brought things full circle. It now makes sense why the next movie, Superman: The Man of Tomorrow, is starting off from the beginning of his career.

[Doctor Know]

According to James Tucker on twitter last night they did have a 3rd Titans movie pitched that wasn't approved

And that is a criminal shame. This Titans cast was awesome. They just got Donna Troy and Connor Kent to fill their ranks and they're iced out of existence before they can really make move. I've read the third Titans movie was supposed to be about the Black Fire invasion of Earth.
What a friggin' waste!


Just finished Apokolips War. I have to agree with so many others, that this feels like a premature ending to this movie universe. With this being the last one, they didn't hold back on anything. The ultra-violence was a tad excessive, but go big or go home for your finale. The members of the two Leagues, Titans and Suicide Squad all got a good showing of their respective talents.


I'm really bummed this is over. Like most, I wanted to see another Titans movie, Green Lantern, Flash, and or Hawkman movie. Hell, a JSA period piece in this universe would've been cool to see.

It begun with Flashpoint and is undone by Flashpoint. Too bad Barry pretty much fell off the map after his one movie.

MVPs of the movie: Calamity Constantine, Spectacular Superman, Renegade Raven and the Terror Titan Trigon!!!

[dietrich]

And that is a criminal shame. This Titans cast was awesome. They just got Donna Troy and Connor Kent to fill their ranks and they're iced out of existence before they can really make move. I've read the third Titans movie was supposed to be about the Black Fire invasion of Earth.
What a friggin' waste!


Just finished Apokolips War. I have to agree with so many others, that this feels like a premature ending to this movie universe. With this being the last one, they didn't hold back on anything. The ultra-violence was a tad excessive, but go big or go home for your finale. The members of the two Leagues, Titans and Suicide Squad all got a good showing of their respective talents.


I'm really bummed this is over. Like most, I wanted to see another Titans movie, Green Lantern, Flash, and or Hawkman movie. Hell, a JSA period piece in this universe would've been cool to see.

It begun with Flashpoint and is undone by Flashpoint. Too bad Barry pretty much fell off the map after his one movie.

MVPs of the movie: Calamity Constantine, Spectacular Superman, Renegade Raven and the Terror Titan Trigon!!!

Yep real shame about that 3rd Titans movie. I would have liked to have seen more about Dick's Tt team in the shared Universe.

I hope we get a new shared animated universe . This one wasn't perfect but it was nice seeing the characters stories progress, relationships and dynamics develop.

[Masterff]

Yep real shame about that 3rd Titans movie. I would have liked to have seen more about Dick's Tt team in the shared Universe.

I hope we get a new shared animated universe . This one wasn't perfect but it was nice seeing the characters stories progress, relationships and dynamics develop.

Yes its especially a problem with Conner...
He was only in one movie and had 2 short appearances in Death of Superman and now here..

The other ones Beast Boy, Donna, Nightwing etc. etc. will return, BUT Conner is the one who I fear will get replaced by Jon.

Which is a shame, because he was the one who really refreshed the films while most of the other characters JL etc. were to serious etc. in all the films.

[DochaDocha]

Two things I believe the New 52 comics and movies had in common were that whatever ideas they had in place didn't get fully implemented, and the creators on both the movies and comics sides probably had to deal with editorial interference from DC. On the movie side, maybe it was less "You can't do that." I'm sure they were given some freedom to tell certain stories and tell them the way they wanted, but I get the feeling that if it were completely up to Tucker and his team we don't get New 52-inspired movies at all. And now that New 52 has been laid to rest for 4+ years, it was time to bury this continuity.

But whereas I feel that the DCAU from 1992-2006 was nearly as good as it could've been, given the evolving circumstances of the time, the Flashpoint Paradox-era movies will always leave me with that feeling of what could've been.

[stargazer01]

I'm hearing mostly good things about this movie, and specially Superman's role.

Need to wait for physical media.

[stargazer01]

So, yeah, Superman looks awesome in this suit. And it reminds me to the Cavill suit in MOS somehow.

[sunofdarkchild]

spoilers:

I figured out pretty soon after the timeskip they were going to pull an Avengers Endgame and undo everything with time travel. The way they could do that became obvious when Constantine sensed that Barry caused the Flashpoint. So I was pretty disappointed when they brought Damian and Constantine back right after killing them. I knew there was no way all the other deaths would stick, so I didn't see the point in undoing those 2 deaths right when they happen. Constantine especially had no real reason given for his return. Zatanna just ... said something about destiny and he's back.

end of spoilers

I'm a bit sorrier to see this universe go than I was to see the Nu52 go in comics, since I thought this movie-verse was better overall than the comics universe they created in 2011. Still, it took a while to really start to find its footing. And it's a shame that runs can't just end. They always have to be wiped out for the next relaunch. That's become a big problem with DC comics. How can the audience care when they know the next time sales dip too low the characters they've been following will be erased from having ever existed instead of just being canceled and replaced? None of it ever matters because it will always just be erased.

[Lokimaru]

I have a lot of thoughts on the movie, but I'll try to limit them to Superman. It's not what I'd call a great movie because I think it has a lot of flaws, but I think there are some really great parts, especially toward the end.

spoilers:

As pointed out in the Sneak Peeks, the story starts when angry Superman makes a bit of a rash decision, albeit one backed by the senior JL members, to take on Darkseid head on. The JL/JLU has a few plots about Superman's recklessness, so there's nothing really new here, but there was a lot more heart in the older cartoons. Maybe it's a direct consequence of being able to use longer-form storytelling, I don't know. Yet, when you compare something like the episode "Twilight" where Superman is really pissed at Darkseid, says a lot of things out of anger, etc., you get to see a whole range of emotions and consequences that just can't play out in a movie like this. Perhaps more importantly, we got to see big plot elements from the prior show pay off with style. In regard to the movie, I get it, Superman has a lot of personal animosity toward Darkseid, so maybe he's not thinking straight when he tells the consolidated Justice League they're going to attack Apokolips, but it's more of a quick setup for the action to begin and all the pieces to fall into place than a genuine character study I felt the cartoon got right. I think Superman isn't particularly interesting throughout most of this movie, other than his never-say-die attitude which is pretty good. All of that seemed to change by the end, though. I normally don't care for mind-controlled Superman moments, but something about Super-Trigon is just fan-freakin'-tastic. And regular Superman's throwdown with Darkseid was also pretty cool. So while this isn't my favorite Superman movie, it gave me some pretty memorable stuff, too.

end of spoilers

Fans will find this movie controversial, though I think it'll be the good kind of controversial. An example of the bad kind would be The Killing Joke or Batman and Harley Quinn when the critiques of the movie questioned the moral integrity of creators.

Wouldn't Superman being reckless make more sense if they hadn't already watered him down In the death of Superman movies. They could have kept everything the same as before those movies and we still would have ended up here. They could have replaced the Death movies and some of the Wonder Woman movie with movies involving Ckark and Diana's relationship and it would have changed nothing. Such a goddamned waste, AGAIN!

[OpaqueGiraffe17]

Wouldn't Superman being reckless make more sense if they hadn't already watered him down In the death of Superman movies. They could have kept everything the same as before those movies and we still would have ended up here. They could have replaced the Death movies and some of the Wonder Woman movie with movies involving Ckark and Diana's relationship and it would have changed nothing. Such a goddamned waste, AGAIN!

As soon as the dc animated movie universe versions of Superman and Wonder Woman were spun off into stars of their own solo movies, the pairing needed to go. When they were just parts of ensemble JL movies, sure whatever. But once they got their own movies about their own corners of dc, then it becomes nothing but a burden that would completely limit what they could do with Lois and Steve, who should and do have priority in solo SM and WW movies.
Anyway a preemptive strike is not inherently a reckless decision. In hindsight, yeah Clark made the wrong tactical decision. But after 2 attempted invasions of earth by Darkseid, it’s clear war is inevitable. Is it really hard to see a hero like Superman wanting to fight that war on Darkseid’s turf and away from his adoptive home he swore to protect??

[manwhohaseverything]

Wouldn't Superman being reckless make more sense if they hadn't already watered him down In the death of Superman movies. They could have kept everything the same as before those movies and we still would have ended up here. They could have replaced the Death movies and some of the Wonder Woman movie with movies involving Ckark and Diana's relationship and it would have changed nothing. Such a goddamned waste, AGAIN!

No, clark will always be reckless deepdown. The reason he is pissed off is because he got killed by a monster made by darkseid and his legacy was tarnished by cyborg made by the same. So, he decided to take matters into his own hands before they attacked Again. Darkseid would have attacked regardless.

[raidensix]

How did the "liquid" kryptonite not kill Clark after 2 years?