Is Strucker a nazi?

[davew128]

I'm going to disagree. Being in the Nazi armed forces makes you very much a Nazi.

Well they were the GERMAN armed forces not the Nazi armed forces.

[davew128]

Are we seriously promoting the myth of the "clean" Wehrmacht now? They were the political military wing of Hitler's (Röhm's really) grand design. There may have been some conscripts, but as a whole they represented the Nazi fighting force. Let's not split hairs over the obvious.

Well its not obvious. The Wehrmacht did its share of nasty things, but they were the nations military. They waged war, that a military does. They weren't by and large responsibility for the atrocities of the Nazi regime. I think you would be hard pressed to find any nation's military not having done nasty things even up to the modern day, including Western nations.

[Mike_Murdock]

That's only so you can sell the movie in Germany.

Ironically, I'm pretty sure the movie did more than anything to promote the association of the Red Skull/WWII and Hydra. I mean, it definitely existed before, but Hydra was much more nebulous supervillainy. It wasn't Hitler's science wing.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Ironically, I'm pretty sure the movie did more than anything to promote the association of the Red Skull/WWII and Hydra. I mean, it definitely existed before, but Hydra was much more nebulous supervillainy. It wasn't Hitler's science wing.

It wasn't Hitler's science wing, but Hydra started out founded by Strucker, a Nazi. It just became nebulous supervillainy after a few decades of non Nazi plots

[anyajenkins]

That's only so you can sell the movie in Germany.

No, that’s because they wanted to sell toys. No parent is going to buy the Lego captain America battle set if the red skull’s car/tank has a swatisika on it.

[Electricmastro]

It wasn't Hitler's science wing, but Hydra started out founded by Strucker, a Nazi. It just became nebulous supervillainy after a few decades of non Nazi plots

An interesting history point to be learned there, as HYDRA is said to have originated in ancient Egypt, and it was thousands of years later that Strucker only seized control of the organization, not having found it (Secret Warriors #1, April 2009).

[The Cool Thatguy]

An interesting history point to be learned there, as HYDRA is said to have originated in ancient Egypt, and it was thousands of years later that Strucker only seized control of the organization, not having found it (Secret Warriors #1, April 2009).

Secret Wars undid that. Or whatever

Founded by a Nazi isn't a stink that goes away with a handwave, IMO

[Michael Watkins]

It’s curious that people can’t handle Hydra not being interchangeable with nazism. In many ways it is worse. If they were a real organization, they would eclipse the Nazi party and ISIS. Wolfgang is an evil dude. he currently has no party affiliation.

[Michael Watkins]

Secret Wars undid that. Or whatever

Founded by a Nazi isn't a stink that goes away with a handwave, IMO

You are ill informed. Secret Empire was the last take on hydra’s founding. I can provide a panel of Madame Hydra explaining that they aren’t nazis, if you need it. They would be above so short sighted a philosophy. The Red Skull’s presence was unwelcome.

[williamtheday]

Now I hear Hydra has found people with a "do-gooder mentality" are most susceptible to indoctrination!

[shooshoomanjoe]

IIRC Strucker was kicked out of the Nazi party by Hitler early on in Sgt. Fury's 1st series so I'd imagine that would make him bitter towards being a Nazi.

[The Cool Thatguy]

You are ill informed. Secret Empire was the last take on hydra’s founding. I can provide a panel of Madame Hydra explaining that they aren’t nazis, if you need it. They would be above so short sighted a philosophy. The Red Skull’s presence was unwelcome.

You can provide it, but then we'd have to ignore all the Nazi symbolism in Secret Empire, Strucker's Nazi past, etc. Don't forget a scan of Strucker's evil 120 year old wife, eh?

Secret Empire frankly, was the writer trying to have it both ways. Saying that Hydra, founded by a Nazi, with Nazi members, totally weren't Nazis, even while they ran concentration camp (Inhumans) and other Nazi symbolism (their Hydra/Hitler youth).

[Alan2099]

Well its not obvious. The Wehrmacht did its share of nasty things, but they were the nations military. They waged war, that a military does. They weren't by and large responsibility for the atrocities of the Nazi regime. I think you would be hard pressed to find any nation's military not having done nasty things even up to the modern day, including Western nations.

They tried the "Just following orders" excuse in the actual Nazi trials after World War II. It didn't work then either.

[Electricmastro]

They tried the "Just following orders" excuse in the actual Nazi trials after World War II. It didn't work then either.

Yep, following orders they genuinely thought were doing the world a service, not helped by the Hitler Youth and other such brainwashing propaganda, which is not to diminish accountability, but is still very much tragic when even teachers were telling schoolchildren that Hitler was “a hero for saving Germany’s status after World War I.”

[davew128]

They tried the "Just following orders" excuse in the actual Nazi trials after World War II. It didn't work then either.

Of course that has nothing to do with what I've been trying to convey here. Don't confuse being tasked with waging war as a military commander with the commission of war crimes against non-combatants and prisoners. If you're going to go there, one could reasonably argue a lot of the Allied bombing campaign in both theaters was a war crime. The difference on that single aspect only goes as to who won the war.