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  1. #121
    Extraordinary Member Caivu's Avatar
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    The new character is confirmed:

    https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/news/...showrunner-cw/

    There are also two audition videos for Ryan Wilder on Vimeo as of now.

    Things to still note: Ryan Wilder has still not been called the lead, whether by the casting call or Caroline Dries, and Kate Kane is not confirmed as being gone for good. I expect they'll do something similar to Bad Blood, where Batman was thought dead for a while.
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  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caivu View Post
    The new character is confirmed:

    https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/news/...showrunner-cw/

    There are also two audition videos for Ryan Wilder on Vimeo as of now.

    Things to still note: Ryan Wilder has still not been called the lead, whether by the casting call or Caroline Dries, and Kate Kane is not confirmed as being gone for good. I expect they'll do something similar to Bad Blood, where Batman was thought dead for a while.
    There’s no denying it now. “Rebooting” the character says it all.

  3. #123
    Extraordinary Member Caivu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Evans View Post
    There’s no denying it now. “Rebooting” the character says it all.
    "Rebooting" is the wrong word for what they mean. They mean "replace".
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  4. #124
    A Wearied Madness Vakanai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The True Detective View Post
    If Gotham can work without Batman then I don't see why Batwoman couldn't work without Batwoman.
    Gotham wasn't called Batman, while Batwoman is literally called Batwoman, so not the same.

  5. #125
    A Wearied Madness Vakanai's Avatar
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    Kind of super disappointed this is the route they have chosen to take, it is stupid and wrong. But I'll still watch it.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caivu View Post
    The new character is confirmed:

    https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/news/...showrunner-cw/

    There are also two audition videos for Ryan Wilder on Vimeo as of now.

    Things to still note: Ryan Wilder has still not been called the lead, whether by the casting call or Caroline Dries, and Kate Kane is not confirmed as being gone for good. I expect they'll do something similar to Bad Blood, where Batman was thought dead for a while.
    So apparently, to respect Ruby Rose's work as Batwoman, they've decided to discard Kate Kane as a character...

    Which I feel is hugely unfair to the character since, in this case, it was a mutual decision by the network and Ruby for her to leave the role, and she's leaving simply because she can't handle the stress and strain of the job. As great as she was, its not like she spent 5 years defining the character such that recasting the role wouldn't make sense and might be a bit disrespectful. She did one year in the role and then decided to quit because she couldn't handle it anymore. A decision one has to respect, but why does that mean the Kate Kane character needs to be shelved?

    Also, as much as the CW has done a good job with original characters (John Diggle, Harrison Wells, Ava Sharpe, Alex Danvers, to name a few) replacing the lead of the show with a brand-new character is a bridge too far. The only other Arrowverse lead who isn't an established DC character is Sara Lance on LoT, and in her case - 1) She's an adaptation of the Black Canary, 2) She was established in the Arrowverse for years before she took the 'lead' on LoT, 3) LoT is an ensemble show comprising of plenty of DC characters with a few originals.

    Once again, would Arrow Season 2 have worked if the first episode suddenly had Oliver Queen mysteriously disappear, and some random new guy (not even Diggle or Roy Harper) becomes the Green Arrow - with all the relationships established over the past year with the Queen family, Diggle, Felicity, Laurel etc. being laid to waste. What about the backstory with Slade Wilson that forms the crux of the season's arc? None of it would have made sense.

  7. #127
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    We don't really know what actually happened on the BATWOMAN set and all the internal politics. We know versions of the story that the producers or Ruby Rose have put out--but there could be legal, moral, personal and commercial reasons why they are not disclosing what happened. And those reasons could inform what they are doing now.

    I think it's obvious that "Ryan Wilder" is not the name of the character. They want to keep that as a surprise, so they have concocted a cover name which is a combo of Ryan Reynolds and Van Wilder.

    Maybe people need to wait until Januay 2021 to see what they've come up with. So then we can judge if it was a good move. But the true story about what happened with Ruby Rose we may never know.

  8. #128
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    I'm wondering if Rose is completly out or if she will appear at least in the first few episodes so pass on the mantle.

  9. #129
    Uncanny Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    So apparently, to respect Ruby Rose's work as Batwoman, they've decided to discard Kate Kane as a character...

    Which I feel is hugely unfair to the character since, in this case, it was a mutual decision by the network and Ruby for her to leave the role, and she's leaving simply because she can't handle the stress and strain of the job. As great as she was, its not like she spent 5 years defining the character such that recasting the role wouldn't make sense and might be a bit disrespectful. She did one year in the role and then decided to quit because she couldn't handle it anymore. A decision one has to respect, but why does that mean the Kate Kane character needs to be shelved?

    Also, as much as the CW has done a good job with original characters (John Diggle, Harrison Wells, Ava Sharpe, Alex Danvers, to name a few) replacing the lead of the show with a brand-new character is a bridge too far. The only other Arrowverse lead who isn't an established DC character is Sara Lance on LoT, and in her case - 1) She's an adaptation of the Black Canary, 2) She was established in the Arrowverse for years before she took the 'lead' on LoT, 3) LoT is an ensemble show comprising of plenty of DC characters with a few originals.

    Once again, would Arrow Season 2 have worked if the first episode suddenly had Oliver Queen mysteriously disappear, and some random new guy (not even Diggle or Roy Harper) becomes the Green Arrow - with all the relationships established over the past year with the Queen family, Diggle, Felicity, Laurel etc. being laid to waste. What about the backstory with Slade Wilson that forms the crux of the season's arc? None of it would have made sense.
    Didn't Arrow end with hints of Diggle becoming Green Lantern? If so, he's not original at all, and is instead a case of Canon Character All Along, like Skye from Agents of SHIELD, who turned out to be Daisy Johnson, aka Quake. He's a renamed John Stewart.

    Harrison Wells isn't technically a new character either. Has the owner of STAR Labs ever appeared in the comics (maybe in Cyborg's backstory)? Because that's what he is. He's also a non-powered counterpart of Johnny Quick, considering Jesse Quick's last name is Wells, instead of Chambers like in the comics.
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  10. #130
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caivu View Post
    The new character is confirmed:

    https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/news/...showrunner-cw/

    There are also two audition videos for Ryan Wilder on Vimeo as of now.

    Things to still note: Ryan Wilder has still not been called the lead, whether by the casting call or Caroline Dries, and Kate Kane is not confirmed as being gone for good. I expect they'll do something similar to Bad Blood, where Batman was thought dead for a while.
    I can't believe Greg Berlanti thought this was a better idea then just recasting.

  11. #131
    Extraordinary Member Caivu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I can't believe Greg Berlanti thought this was a better idea then just recasting.
    I don't get it either, but as much as I don't like it, I have to trust he knows what he's doing. He's a lot closer to and more knowledgeable of this situation in particular and TV production in general than any of us are, and I highly doubt he'd intentionally sabotage one of his own productions. Meaning, I don't think this is a fatal error for the show even though it's an error.
    Last edited by Caivu; 06-07-2020 at 08:24 AM.
    Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
    Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
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  12. #132
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caivu View Post
    I don't get it either, but as much as I don't like it, I have to trust he knows what he's doing. He's a lot closer to and more knowledgeable of this situation in particular TV production in general than any of us are.
    I would ordinarily agree, but I just don't see much sense in it myself and I won't rule out that the EP's could make a mistake on this.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    We don't really know what actually happened on the BATWOMAN set and all the internal politics. We know versions of the story that the producers or Ruby Rose have put out--but there could be legal, moral, personal and commercial reasons why they are not disclosing what happened. And those reasons could inform what they are doing now.

    I think it's obvious that "Ryan Wilder" is not the name of the character. They want to keep that as a surprise, so they have concocted a cover name which is a combo of Ryan Reynolds and Van Wilder.

    Maybe people need to wait until Januay 2021 to see what they've come up with. So then we can judge if it was a good move. But the true story about what happened with Ruby Rose we may never know.
    Good points.

    If Ryan Reynolds Van Wilder becomes a new hero and not Batwoman, then I will be willing to give this season a chance.

  14. #134
    Spectacular Member randomideaguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    Then there's the insistence that the next actress and the character will be from the LGBTQ community. So is Batwoman just a mantle that can be worn by any lesbian? Is her being a lesbian the one defining trait of the mantle, over and above the actual character of Kate Kane, her relationships, and her story so far? That's pretty insulting, if you really think about it..
    LGBT actresses needed the work. Especially when Kate specifically has arcs related to being gay - it would be kinda skeevy to profit off of such a narrative and cast a straight actress to play it.

    Still really unhappy that they are not recasting Kate. This is soooo dumb of the show.

  15. #135
    Mighty Member witchboy's Avatar
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    I've read that the name of Ryan Wilder is a placeholder until they're ready to announce who the character is.
    The description of her as a former drug runner who avoids the police, will steal to feed a stray cat and can kill a man - and add to that the character is said to be gay, the only DC character that comes to mind is Holly Robinson, Selina Kyle's lesbian friend.
    If we accept that the gay character could be bi, then that makes Selina Kyle herself an option.
    I'd prefer a Kate recast, but if we have to get a new character, I'd prefer it to be a character that is exciting and has a fan base. Selina Kyle as Batwoman seems like the best option in a bad situation.
    Which reminds me how much I wanted a Selina Kyle spin off from Gotham, but this will obviously be a different Selina.

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