There's in fact a difference in the first instance if he said it early he is hovering above Batman , Batman would call BS because dude who can annihilate armies can do the saving himself.What makes you think Batman would suddenly feel like oh yeah I need to help this guy ,he can fly but I think we'll get there in my batwing...
It's just ridiculous that a superbeing at full strength is asking you to help save his mummy
Quite a different matter when he is bruised ,weak and begging you to save her coz he's about to meet his maker
[QUOTE][QUOTE=[B]Blind Wedjat;5038017][/B]Bringing up Civil War is the classic deflection tactic[QUOTE]
its not a classic deflection its hypocrisy. why are you quick so say what Snyder did was wrong and defend something worse?
We are not making excuses. we are defending what snyder and being sound about it.part of being sound is to use other films to show what Snyder did was good and it seems to be working.Snyder's fans use to make excuses for their beloved film and director's failings and accuse you of having a bias, instead of actually engaging in a discussion like a reasonable person.[
So what you're saying is Superman had to be close enough to being as good as dead (and also lucky Lois got there in the right moment) in order to save his own mother? Do you seriously not see how ridiculous that is?
"This man has kidnapped my mother, and there's a countdown to end her life. He's forcing me to go kill this other guy that hates me and wants to kill me. But the only way I can convince this other guy to help me is if I'm almost dead. I have to be almost dead or close to being killed because otherwise he wouldn't believe me. And well I can't die because then my mother dies."
Really?
I think people care. because this same people who are criticising batman and superman but giving steve and tony a pass when they acted worse?it means their stance of batman and superman is not based on any credibility.
if you think the fight in dawn of justice was bs, then it also means many civil war fight was bs. based on your own logic you are using with dawn of justice.
[QUOTE=Castle;5038039][QUOTE][QUOTE=[B]Blind Wedjat;5038017][/B]Bringing up Civil War is the classic deflection tacticThis thread is about Zack Snyder and his movies, no? Why are you the one to bring up Civil War instead? Why are you assuming that everyone who had an issue with the Martha scene didn't also have an issue with the final fight scene in Civil War?
its not a classic deflection its hypocrisy. why are you quick so say what Snyder did was wrong and defend something worse?
We are not making excuses. we are defending what snyder and being sound about it.part of being sound is to use other films to show what Snyder did was good and it seems to be working.
You want to know why? Because the only way you can truly defend and excuse the director you like is by accusing other people of having a bias, instead of engaging with what they're saying. Because by believing in your head that everyone but you has a bias, they're all wrong and you're right.
That is deflection, and it's what people do when they don't have a proper counter argument.
[QUOTE=Blind Wedjat;5038048][QUOTE=Castle;5038039][QUOTE]a thread about snyder and his movies with many kevin feige civil war/avengers supporters, a Snyder film that feige saw as a rivalry. You can see the conflict of interest that cannot be ignored? civil war would always be relevant as long as you keep discussing Snyder movies from that angle.Originally Posted by [B
its not a deflection. its hypocrisy.
I don't think batman would have listened or it would have worked. it was better that batman had in his head gotten what he wanted. fight, superman and win, comes close to killing him before Superman drops the bomb on him that he needs to save his mum.
Last edited by Castle; 07-07-2020 at 09:13 AM.
Unfortunately that is the predicament he was in, but you're concluding that as an outsider,in film I'm sure he didn't feel threatened because he didn't know about the Kryptonite, so in film it was more suicide for Batman on the face of it,when in reality the cards were in Batman's favour precisely because of Superman's initial leniency.I don't have a problem with dire stakes, makes the film better in my opinion
it also the stakes that makes me like Snyder. please compare the stakes of Snyder to the airport fight scene in civil war or most comic films now,there are hardly any real stakes, its all usually comedy and quips.
You could see the blind hatred of batman, you could feel it during the fight. Those are stakes.
I change my mind now, no offence to Deadpool but Snyder's Dawn of justice was the best comic film that year.
As a human, I am more scared of Zod than Loki. Zod had stakes in man of steel. Loki was more of a joke .people were against snyder and called his movie too dark because he did not turn his villains to jokes to decrease the stakes.
Last edited by Castle; 07-07-2020 at 08:39 AM.
I'm not overly fond of the MCU and haven't seen Civil War since it was in theaters. So no, not everyone is criticizing BvS and comparing it unfavorably to Civil War.
Batman and Superman are two of my favorite characters, and BvS is an important event for them (for better or worse). That's why I discuss it. I could not give less of a shit about Tony Stark.
No contest BvS was the movie of the year.
Marvel movies are absurdly inconsistent a venture capitalist like Stark is suddenly for the UN accords and regulation ,when in fact Captain America is the one most likely to side with the government.Plus the idea of the accords can only be enforced by the Government on Tony they can confiscate his suits and he is just a man without them.To say the government could control indipendent agents like Thor who is alien and Bruce who needs to be dozed with tranquilizers in some safe house to make it work ,means the Avengers have no reason to side with the government apart from Tony Stark it should be Tony against the avengers Not against Captain America, the title is misleading
Last edited by Rev9; 07-07-2020 at 08:52 AM.
And you writing stuff like this puts your credibility to me in the negatives. But always good for a laugh.
I mean I could take you a bit more seriously if you did not try to make a point out of everything that the MCU sucks. "tony is worse because civil war has a worse script to snyder's dawn of justice, you cant be pro civil war and anti dawn of justice" is just the last one in a long line of this. And yes someone sure can be pro civil war and anti dawn of justice. But that is against your bias so I do not expect you to understand that.
Definitely, BvS was the movie of the year, the media destroyed it for that reason because they knew nothing else would compete well.
they tried to pull the same thing with Joker last year.
And its not just the plot that Snyder did well giving the time frame. Can we talk about the cinematography, visual effects, score (wonder woman's introduction) and sound mixing of the movie?
I am just happy HBO has the same high production quality.