Zack Snyder's JUSTICE LEAGUE on HBOmax in 2021!

[Blind Wedjat]

You know what tears people up? when Bruce says, I promise you, Martha won't die tonight,

[80sbaby]

What made Bruce listen finally was when Lois said, Martha was his mother. that was the development from bruce seeing superman as a cold hearted alien to a guy who cares about people or something and not just anything, a parent. a parent batman lost.

You know what is so funny? batman in those 2 seconds showed remorse and concern for mathra than steve ever did for tony in civil war after realising bucky killed tony's parents.

You know what makes tears people up? when Bruce says, I promise you, Martha won't die tonight, which was again, the PTSDS of Batman loosing his own mother that fateful night , she was shut and not wanting that to happen again to another person's mum, if he could help it.

So what you're saying is that if Superman had said "My mom's in trouble" earlier, Bruce would have listened? You know, which is exactly what Seige Perilous and others have been saying? You just proved their point.

[SiegePerilous02]

What made Bruce listen finally was when Lois said, Martha was his mother. that was the development from bruce seeing superman as a cold hearted alien to a guy who cares about people or something and not just anything, a parent. a parent batman lost.

You know what is so funny? batman in those 2 seconds showed remorse and concern for mathra than steve and bucky ever did for tony loosing his parents.

You know what tears people up? when Bruce says, I promise you, Martha won't die tonight, which was again, the PTSDS of Batman loosing his own mother that fateful night , she was shut and not wanting that to happen again to another person's mum, if he could help it.

Lol, nobody cares about Steve and Tony in this discussion of an unrelated movie.

[Rev9]

Actually by watching the video, we have an instance from 1:29-1:45 where Batman is down and there is a lull in the fighting where Superman is wasting time without saying anything. He just walks over silently.

This isn't really helping your case. Are you watching the scene?



Then that's up to Batman. And by the very script, Clark has no reason to think Bruce is an actual threat to him yet. If we go by internal logic, he has no reason to antagonize someone who is unstable and wants to kill him, his mother's life is on the line and he doesn't have time, but he does it anyway. Because he's an idiot. They both are because the script needs them to be.

If it affected the story of the film, I think Superman's part in it would have been better. It's not a very good film.

Also, the film tells us that if Batman hears that Clark's name is Martha he'll help lol, so if Superman said his mother's name early on there would be no fight. He has no reason really to believe him at the end of the fight anyway.

There's in fact a difference in the first instance if he said it early he is hovering above Batman , Batman would call BS because dude who can annihilate armies can do the saving himself.What makes you think Batman would suddenly feel like oh yeah I need to help this guy ,he can fly but I think we'll get there in my batwing...

It's just ridiculous that a superbeing at full strength is asking you to help save his mummy

Quite a different matter when he is bruised ,weak and begging you to save her coz he's about to meet his maker

[Castle]

[QUOTE][QUOTE=[B]Blind Wedjat;5038017][/B]Bringing up Civil War is the classic deflection tactic[QUOTE]

its not a classic deflection its hypocrisy. why are you quick so say what Snyder did was wrong and defend something worse?

Snyder's fans use to make excuses for their beloved film and director's failings and accuse you of having a bias, instead of actually engaging in a discussion like a reasonable person.[

We are not making excuses. we are defending what snyder and being sound about it.part of being sound is to use other films to show what Snyder did was good and it seems to be working.

[Blind Wedjat]

There's in fact a difference in the first instance if he said it early he is hovering above Batman , Batman would call BS because dude who can annihilate armies can do the saving himself.What makes you think Batman would suddenly feel like oh yeah I need to help this guy ,he can fly but I think we'll get there in my batwing...

It's just ridiculous that a superbeing at full strength is asking you to help save his mummy

Quite a different matter when he is bruised ,weak and begging you to save her coz he's about to meet his maker

So what you're saying is Superman had to be close enough to being as good as dead (and also lucky Lois got there in the right moment) in order to save his own mother? Do you seriously not see how ridiculous that is?

"This man has kidnapped my mother, and there's a countdown to end her life. He's forcing me to go kill this other guy that hates me and wants to kill me. But the only way I can convince this other guy to help me is if I'm almost dead. I have to be almost dead or close to being killed because otherwise he wouldn't believe me. And well I can't die because then my mother dies."

Really?

[Castle]

Lol, nobody cares about Steve and Tony in this discussion of an unrelated movie.

I think people care. because this same people who are criticising batman and superman but giving steve and tony a pass when they acted worse?it means their stance of batman and superman is not based on any credibility.

if you think the fight in dawn of justice was bs, then it also means many civil war fight was bs. based on your own logic you are using with dawn of justice.

[Blind Wedjat]

[QUOTE=Castle;5038039][QUOTE][QUOTE=[B]Blind Wedjat;5038017][/B]Bringing up Civil War is the classic deflection tactic

its not a classic deflection its hypocrisy. why are you quick so say what Snyder did was wrong and defend something worse?


We are not making excuses. we are defending what snyder and being sound about it.part of being sound is to use other films to show what Snyder did was good and it seems to be working.

This thread is about Zack Snyder and his movies, no? Why are you the one to bring up Civil War instead? Why are you assuming that everyone who had an issue with the Martha scene didn't also have an issue with the final fight scene in Civil War?

You want to know why? Because the only way you can truly defend and excuse the director you like is by accusing other people of having a bias, instead of engaging with what they're saying. Because by believing in your head that everyone but you has a bias, they're all wrong and you're right.

That is deflection, and it's what people do when they don't have a proper counter argument.

[Castle]

[QUOTE=Blind Wedjat;5038048][QUOTE=Castle;5038039][QUOTE]

Blind Wedjat;5038017][/B]Bringing up Civil War is the classic deflection tactic

This thread is about Zack Snyder and his movies, no? Why are you the one to bring up Civil War instead? Why are you assuming that everyone who had an issue with the Martha scene didn't also have an issue with the final fight scene in Civil War?

You want to know why? Because the only way you can truly defend and excuse the director you like is by accusing other people of having a bias, instead of engaging with what they're saying. Because by believing in your head that everyone but you has a bias, they're all wrong and you're right.

That is deflection, and it's what people do when they don't have a proper counter argument.

a thread about snyder and his movies with many kevin feige civil war/avengers supporters, a Snyder film that feige saw as a rivalry. You can see the conflict of interest that cannot be ignored? civil war would always be relevant as long as you keep discussing Snyder movies from that angle.

its not a deflection. its hypocrisy.

So what you're saying is Superman had to be close enough to being as good as dead (and also lucky Lois got there in the right moment) in order to save his own mother? Do you seriously not see how ridiculous that is?

"This man has kidnapped my mother, and there's a countdown to end her life. He's forcing me to go kill this other guy that hates me and wants to kill me. But the only way I can convince this other guy to help me is if I'm almost dead. I have to be almost dead or close to being killed because otherwise he wouldn't believe me. And well I can't die because then my mother dies."

Really?

I don't think batman would have listened or it would have worked. it was better that batman had in his head gotten what he wanted. fight, superman and win, comes close to killing him before Superman drops the bomb on him that he needs to save his mum.

[Rev9]

So what you're saying is Superman had to be close enough to being as good as dead (and also lucky Lois got there in the right moment) in order to save his own mother? Do you seriously not see how ridiculous that is?

"This man has kidnapped my mother, and there's a countdown to end her life. He's forcing me to go kill this other guy that hates me and wants to kill me. But the only way I can convince this other guy to help me is if I'm almost dead. I have to be almost dead or close to being killed because otherwise he wouldn't believe me. And well I can't die because then my mother dies."

Really?

Unfortunately that is the predicament he was in, but you're concluding that as an outsider,in film I'm sure he didn't feel threatened because he didn't know about the Kryptonite, so in film it was more suicide for Batman on the face of it,when in reality the cards were in Batman's favour precisely because of Superman's initial leniency.I don't have a problem with dire stakes, makes the film better in my opinion

[Castle]

Unfortunately that is the predicament he was in, but you're concluding that as an outsider,in film I'm sure he didn't feel threatened because he didn't know about the Kryptonite, so in film it was more suicide for Batman on the face of it,when in reality the cards were in Batman's favour precisely because of Superman's initial leniency.I don't have a problem with dire stakes, makes the film better in my opinion

it also the stakes that makes me like Snyder. please compare the stakes of Snyder to the airport fight scene in civil war or most comic films now,there are hardly any real stakes, its all usually comedy and quips.

You could see the blind hatred of batman, you could feel it during the fight. Those are stakes.

I change my mind now, no offence to Deadpool but Snyder's Dawn of justice was the best comic film that year.

As a human, I am more scared of Zod than Loki. Zod had stakes in man of steel. Loki was more of a joke .people were against snyder and called his movie too dark because he did not turn his villains to jokes to decrease the stakes.

[SiegePerilous02]

I think people care. because this same people who are criticising batman and superman but giving steve and tony a pass when they acted worse?it means their stance of batman and superman is not based on any credibility.

if you think the fight in dawn of justice was bs, then it also means many civil war fight was bs. based on your own logic you are using with dawn of justice.

I'm not overly fond of the MCU and haven't seen Civil War since it was in theaters. So no, not everyone is criticizing BvS and comparing it unfavorably to Civil War.

Batman and Superman are two of my favorite characters, and BvS is an important event for them (for better or worse). That's why I discuss it. I could not give less of a **** about Tony Stark.

[Rev9]

it also the stakes that makes me like Snyder. please compare the stakes of Snyder to the airport fight scene in civil war or most comic films now,there are hardly any real stakes, its all usually comedy and quips.

You could see the blind hatred of batman, you could feel it during the fight. Those are stakes.

I change my mind now, no offence to Deadpool but Snyder's Dawn of justice was the best comic film that year.

As a human, I am more scared of Zod than Loki. Zod had stakes in man of steel. Loki was more of a joke .people were against snyder and called his movie too dark because he did not turn his villains to jokes to decrease the stakes.

No contest BvS was the movie of the year.

Marvel movies are absurdly inconsistent a venture capitalist like Stark is suddenly for the UN accords and regulation ,when in fact Captain America is the one most likely to side with the government.Plus the idea of the accords can only be enforced by the Government on Tony they can confiscate his suits and he is just a man without them.To say the government could control indipendent agents like Thor who is alien and Bruce who needs to be dozed with tranquilizers in some safe house to make it work ,means the Avengers have no reason to side with the government apart from Tony Stark it should be Tony against the avengers Not against Captain America, the title is misleading

[lowfyr]

tony is worse because civil war has a worse script to snyder's dawn of justice, you cant be pro civil war and anti dawn of justice.it hurts your credibility to me.

And you writing stuff like this puts your credibility to me in the negatives. But always good for a laugh.

I mean I could take you a bit more seriously if you did not try to make a point out of everything that the MCU sucks. "tony is worse because civil war has a worse script to snyder's dawn of justice, you cant be pro civil war and anti dawn of justice" is just the last one in a long line of this. And yes someone sure can be pro civil war and anti dawn of justice. But that is against your bias so I do not expect you to understand that.

[Castle]

No contest BvS was the movie of the year.

Marvel movies are absurdly inconsistent a venture capitalist like Stark is suddenly for the UN accords and regulation ,when in fact Captain America is the one most likely to side with the government.Plus the idea of the accords can only be enforced by the Government on Tony they can confiscate his suits and he is just a man without them.To say the government could control indipendent agents like Thor who is alien and Bruce who needs to be dozed with tranquilized in some safe house to make it work ,means the Avengers have no reason to side with the government apart from Tony Stark it should be Tony against the avengers Not against Captain America, the title is misleading

Definitely, BvS was the movie of the year, the media destroyed it for that reason because they knew nothing else would compete well.

they tried to pull the same thing with Joker last year.

And its not just the plot that Snyder did well giving the time frame. Can we talk about the cinematography, visual effects, score (wonder woman's introduction) and sound mixing of the movie?

I am just happy HBO has the same high production quality.