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  1. #1
    BANNED
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    Default Why was Cyclops MORE hated than the Scarlet Witch?

    I don't understand how Scarlet Witch (who killed a lot of mutants with her NO MORE MUTANTS phrase) is forgiven while Cyclops (who tried to save his kind) wasn't. She got to become an Avenger again. Havok even forgave her by being on the same team as her and he told young Cyclops that his older self is wrong. It's weird.

    Her excuse was it wasn't her and that's OKAY...but when Cyclops said it wasn't him it's not.

    And to put the cherry on the top in the end for all the sacrifices scott made marvel still made him say he was wrong while Wanda was instantly forgiven god I hope one day she will be brought to Justice for her crimes against mutantkind.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Oh boy. This won't end well.

    Check out the Should Scarlet Witch thread.

    (100% agree with you on this, btw)

  3. #3
    Mighty Member houndsofluv's Avatar
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    lol dont worry the fans are making up for it

  4. #4
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Cause it inadvertently turned out to be a good look for Cyclops that built up to become resentment as editorial wasn’t getting the reaction they wanted. With Cyclops they piled on to try and force the response they wanted, with Scarlet Witch she was a means to end.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 05-23-2020 at 08:22 AM.

  5. #5
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    Cyclops had a long character arc that was building to that.

    Scarlet Witch was just a plot device.

  6. #6
    Mighty Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Why was Cyclops more hated than the Scarlet Witch?
    Curiously, it's not the impression I have…

  7. #7
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Cause it inadvertently turned out to be a good look for Cyclops that built up to become resentment as editorial wasn’t getting the reaction they wanted. With Cyclops they piled on to try and force the response they wanted, with Scarlet Witch she was a means to end.
    There are three other reasons besides this.

    First, Scarlet Witch was never the proxy for the team's most celebrated writer's anger at a bad editorial decision. Claremont being royally pissed at what was mandated is 100% justified, but the direction he directed it towards was not.

    Second, Wanda was never in the way of what is often perceived as the OTP for her franchises most popular character. While this is a result of point 1, it has taken on a life of it's own.

    Lastly, the results of AvX provided justification for all the built up anger from points one and two.
    "Theory: The Phoenix doesn't corrupt the characters, it corrupts the authors." Gambit, King of Thieves

  8. #8
    Mighty Member gambitxremy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Cause it inadvertently turned out to be a good look for Cyclops that built up to become resentment as editorial wasn’t getting the reaction they wanted. With Cyclops they piled on to try and force the response they wanted, with Scarlet Witch she was a means to end.
    Couldn’t agree more. It actually made cyclops more popular

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member Omega Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Cause it inadvertently turned out to be a good look for Cyclops that built up to become resentment as editorial wasn’t getting the reaction they wanted. With Cyclops they piled on to try and force the response they wanted, with Scarlet Witch she was a means to end.
    Yep. And to this day many at Marvel are still clearly bitter about it.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Alpha View Post
    Yep. And to this day many at Marvel are still clearly bitter about it.
    Lol. The “Cyclops Was Right” meme era for Marvel.

    Of course the readers were cheering on Cyclops. Was editorial so disconnected from readers reactions.

  11. #11
    Libre. People Of The Earth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    I don't understand how Scarlet Witch (who killed a lot of mutants with her NO MORE MUTANTS phrase) is forgiven while Cyclops (who tried to save his kind) wasn't.
    Forgiven by whom?

    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    She got to become an Avenger again. Havok even forgave her by being on the same team as her and he told young Cyclops that his older self is wrong. It's weird.
    Forgiven by the Avengers then? She wasn't for a long time, until it turned out she was possessed by the Life Force during Disassembled and HoM, her former teammates realizing her actions weren't her own.
    Cyclops went through the same things, except he, countrary to Wanda, was fully aware of the threat the Phoenix posed beforehand.
    He didn't have the same leniency from the Avengers as a result, or from his own former teammates.

    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    Her excuse was it wasn't her and that's OKAY...
    Exactly. It wasn't her. She had no knowledge of the Life Force beforehand, and no idea how Dangerous it was. If she had, she wouldn't have thrown in with Doom.

    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    but when Cyclops said it wasn't him it's not.
    Cyclops knew the danger of the Phoenix first hand. Furthermore, he knew the Phoenix was destroying inhabited worlds on its path to Earth, Killing billions in the process.

    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    And to put the cherry on the top in the end for all the sacrifices scott made marvel still made him say he was wrong
    He was.

    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    while Wanda was instantly forgiven
    She wasn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by LP22 View Post
    god I hope one day she will be brought to Justice for her crimes against mutantkind.
    Krakoa's justice system is currently a joke, it would be embarassing imo, but we'll see.
    And tbh, if mutantkind wanted to get real on that M-Day front, they would have stormed Latveria to jail Doom a long time ago...
    "The means are as important as the end - we have to do this right or not at all.
    Anything less negates every belief we've ever had, every sacrifice we've ever made."


    "Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

    "No justice, no peace."

  12. #12
    Ultimate Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    And Storm could have offered her opinion. She had no clue what Steve's interpretation of the Phoenix was bc she didnt stay long enough to hear him out. She didnt even know he talked to Logan. She literally learned nothing and bounced before she could collect any intel. Steve would have told her as that was the point of the meeting
    But she didn’t just bounce for no reason. That’s why I said it was apparent that this was a call to war meeting, otherwise she would have no reason to just take off. Everyone (except BP) understood why she left too.

    Quote Originally Posted by People Of The Earth View Post
    He was.
    About what?

  13. #13
    Libre. People Of The Earth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tycon View Post
    About what?
    About gambling the lives of everyone on Earth with the Phoenix.

    "The means are as important as the end - we have to do this right or not at all.
    Anything less negates every belief we've ever had, every sacrifice we've ever made."


    "Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

    "No justice, no peace."

  14. #14
    Mighty Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by People Of The Earth View Post
    About gambling the lives of everyone on Earth with the Phoenix.
    You must admit that it's the kind of decision that super-heroes make a lot: life-death decisions that concern everyone on Earth without consulting everyone on Earth.

    The difference is that the mutants can be accused of being partial and seeing only mutants' interests.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    You must admit that it's the kind of decision that super-heroes make a lot: life-death decisions that concern everyone on Earth without consulting everyone on Earth.

    The difference is that the mutants can be accused of being partial and seeing only mutants' interests.
    Normally the heroes are considered reactive and that's their expected role when it comes to saving the world. They don't bet things on a sacrifice or greater good beyond their personal lives.
    The illuminati was departure from this where they were far more proactive.

    For example, scott also imprisoned illyana for using them like that to fight the elder gods with a bomb strapped to her.

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