The one subtle element that's needed to make a shared universe work...

[Powerboy]

It (the characters acting as if its real world) is an important element for sure...but not the only important thing.

I think it’s an element that’s been missing for decades...as have other important elements.

One thing that does my nut in in on big cross-over events is that both D.C. and Marvel have not taken their characters claimed power sets seriously for decades.

The idea of Batman, Green Arrow, Hawkeye surviving against a competent gun man (let alone “master assassin”) is laughable..yet in team events, big cross-overs they regularly go up against powerhouses, alien tech, etc and not only survive..but prosper.

It all sort of worked decades ago when villains just sought to rob banks and outwit the heroes...and extreme violence (certainly maiming or killing) was off the table...but it really doesn’t work in the modern tales which feature lashings of violence.

Sure some one will trot out “It’s comics”. But no...it’s just the way DC and Marvel decide to write their super hero comics, and if you were setting up universes from scratch you’d almost certainly want to make them more coherent.

I would say the inconsistency is more in saying that those characters are within human limits, exaggerated to be sure, but still close to human. But then in order to survive, they move at blur speed and literally dodge bullets. You can call it aim dodging but it's still vastly superhuman. They also seem to have a superhuman sense that they are about to be attacked.

I would not even say that opponents never tried to kill them in the old days. It's just that the increased character realism leads to a lesser willingness to suspend disbelief when the character does something vastly beyond his official abilities.

[Powerboy]

I did like Spiderman Annual 1 for a shared universe kind of thing but I also didnt like a couple ways they did it in that issue. The thing I didnt like. When Spiderman was on a flagpole reading a paper Thor flies by and knocks him off. Then later Peter sees Giantman and the Wasp stopping a theft. I mean New York is a huge place and he just happens to come in contact with two heroes in a short time.

What I did like. JJ calling the Fantastic Four for help when he is threatened by the Sinister Six. I mean they are the most well known team at the time so why not call them? the Reed called The Avengers to ask about Spiderman. Another thing I liked is after Spiderman defeats Electro Ironman shows up. That could happen, Ironman is always at Starks places because Hell he is Stark.

Interestingly, I heard that Stan Lee and Steve Ditko had a huge argument about something exactly like that. When it came time that the Green Goblin was going to be unmasked, Steve argued that it was a ridiculous coincidence that, out of a city the size of New York, that Spider-Man's arch -enemy would just happen to turn out to be Peter Parker's best friend's father. Heck, even in a small town of a few hundred people, that would be a wild coincidence. Stan argued that, yes, in real life, that would be a ridiculous coincidence. But this is a story. If the Goblin turns out to be some nameless schmuck that Peter never heard of, there's no drama in it and the readers would be going, "What the heck?" Readers would consider that to be ridiculous or at least a complete fizzle as an ending.

I mean, yes, Spidey running into all those characters on the same day by sheer coincidence is unrealistic. But Batman going on patrol and just happening to be right there when a street crime is committed is also a crazy coincidence. Any hero being at a certain place at just the right time is absurd. Star Trek characters just happening to arrive at a planet when it is at the biggest crisis in it's history and arriving at the exact place on the planet is absurd. But there does come a point where we get so locked into technicalities that we can't even enjoy a story.

[babyblob]

Interestingly, I heard that Stan Lee and Steve Ditko had a huge argument about something exactly like that. When it came time that the Green Goblin was going to be unmasked, Steve argued that it was a ridiculous coincidence that, out of a city the size of New York, that Spider-Man's arch -enemy would just happen to turn out to be Peter Parker's best friend's father. Heck, even in a small town of a few hundred people, that would be a wild coincidence. Stan argued that, yes, in real life, that would be a ridiculous coincidence. But this is a story. If the Goblin turns out to be some nameless schmuck that Peter never heard of, there's no drama in it and the readers would be going, "What the heck?" Readers would consider that to be ridiculous or at least a complete fizzle as an ending.

I mean, yes, Spidey running into all those characters on the same day by sheer coincidence is unrealistic. But Batman going on patrol and just happening to be right there when a street crime is committed is also a crazy coincidence. Any hero being at a certain place at just the right time is absurd. Star Trek characters just happening to arrive at a planet when it is at the biggest crisis in it's history and arriving at the exact place on the planet is absurd. But there does come a point where we get so locked into technicalities that we can't even enjoy a story.

Oh I still enjoyed the story. I just thought that having Thor Fantastic Four, Giantman and the Wasp, Ironman, Kind of overkill. I dont really get hung up on details like that. But once in a while I like to vent about pointless nerd things.