Create a street level event.

[Huntsman Spider]

What he’s been doing with tax payers money, perhaps? Laundering off to several businesses (could lead to some of these gangs being a part of that so feeling personally invested in shutting it down themselves)

That could work.

[DrNewGod]

Great ideas all, especially the last one, which is incredibly topical in light of resurgent anti-Asian prejudice in the real world. My only question about the second idea is that Wilson Fisk is a known criminal mastermind already and still got elected mayor, so what could have gotten leaked about him that was so bad in comparison to everything that was already known about him?

First, thank you for your flattering comments. Second, unflattering comments about the current corrupt administration are leaking left, right and sideways. In an adminstration that's paranoid about leaks. Don't think that plot idea is a credulity stretch.

[Tien Long]

Hearing lots of great ideas here. Some of the themes that I dig the most are factions, martial arts tournaments, and international scope. Though I'll always love NYC, I agree, maybe the next big street level event takes place outside of it, or at the very least, is not the only location.

For me, I'd turn the concept of superhero street level characters on its head. The heroes are not fighting against the gangs. Rather, the heroes ARE the gangs. I can envision a story where the street level heroes start to become clannish and form their own territories across the New York City. They keep the crime in those areas in check, but they start to have friction with one another over how best to deal with the crime. Additionally, when crime spills over into the other's territory, conflicts ensue. Indeed, I can see Daredevil and Elektra head up a Hand faction in Hell's Kitchen. Iron Fist and Pei set up a "Little K'un Lun." Shang Chi controls the Chinese areas of Chinatown, Flushing, and Sunset Park. Luke Cage sets something up in Harlem while a newly resurrected Hector Ayala with the other White Tigers and Black Tarantula establish a hold in the South Bronx. Brooklyn is off limits as Ghost Rider's territory. There are free agents like Punisher and Cloak and Dagger while there are those who want to unite everyone together again like Misty Knight, Colleen Wing, and most importantly of all Spider-Man. And through it all, Mayor Wilson Fisk and his official task force launch an official campaign to the stamp out the street level characters. He presents himself as the savior when in reality he sees a golden opportunity to reclaim power in the city.

Yeah, sorry, there are a lot of weird pieces in there, some that don't fit properly under present Marvel Universe circumstances.

Following along with the idea of other cities, I could see a street level event that's global in scope. I could definitely see an old criminal organization, whether it be Zheng Zhu's or the Maggia, extending its reach to cities all over America and all over the world. Factions, led by appointed villains, start to spread not only in American cities like Philadelphia, Chicago, Los Angeles, and Houston, but also international cities like Shanghai, Tokyo, London, Paris, Mexico City, Sao Paolo, Madripoor etc. It's low level enough to not attract the major heroes, but a huge threat that street level heroes have to go across the globe to stop it. Basically, it's just a excuse to see our street level heroes fight on another street.

Egads, let's just say there's still some fine tuning with my ideas .

[Huntsman Spider]

First, thank you for your flattering comments. Second, unflattering comments about the current corrupt administration are leaking left, right and sideways. In an adminstration that's paranoid about leaks. Don't think that plot idea is a credulity stretch.

You're welcome, and good point.

Hearing lots of great ideas here. Some of the themes that I dig the most are factions, martial arts tournaments, and international scope. Though I'll always love NYC, I agree, maybe the next big street level event takes place outside of it, or at the very least, is not the only location.

For me, I'd turn the concept of superhero street level characters on its head. The heroes are not fighting against the gangs. Rather, the heroes ARE the gangs. I can envision a story where the street level heroes start to become clannish and form their own territories across the New York City. They keep the crime in those areas in check, but they start to have friction with one another over how best to deal with the crime. Additionally, when crime spills over into the other's territory, conflicts ensue. Indeed, I can see Daredevil and Elektra head up a Hand faction in Hell's Kitchen. Iron Fist and Pei set up a "Little K'un Lun." Shang Chi controls the Chinese areas of Chinatown, Flushing, and Sunset Park. Luke Cage sets something up in Harlem while a newly resurrected Hector Ayala with the other White Tigers and Black Tarantula establish a hold in the South Bronx. Brooklyn is off limits as Ghost Rider's territory. There are free agents like Punisher and Cloak and Dagger while there are those who want to unite everyone together again like Misty Knight, Colleen Wing, and most importantly of all Spider-Man. And through it all, Mayor Wilson Fisk and his official task force launch an official campaign to the stamp out the street level characters. He presents himself as the savior when in reality he sees a golden opportunity to reclaim power in the city.

Yeah, sorry, there are a lot of weird pieces in there, some that don't fit properly under present Marvel Universe circumstances.

Following along with the idea of other cities, I could see a street level event that's global in scope. I could definitely see an old criminal organization, whether it be Zheng Zhu's or the Maggia, extending its reach to cities all over America and all over the world. Factions, led by appointed villains, start to spread not only in American cities like Philadelphia, Chicago, Los Angeles, and Houston, but also international cities like Shanghai, Tokyo, London, Paris, Mexico City, Sao Paolo, Madripoor etc. It's low level enough to not attract the major heroes, but a huge threat that street level heroes have to go across the globe to stop it. Basically, it's just a excuse to see our street level heroes fight on another street.

Egads, let's just say there's still some fine tuning with my ideas .

Yeah, but it's got promise, which is the important thing, I think.

[DrNewGod]

You know, half the fun in this would be watching Daredevil, Cage+Iron Fist and The Daughters Of The Dragon carry the load while The Avengers and FF are cluelessly trying to figure out WTF is going on.

Nice meta on class divide in that.

[pageturner]

Hearing lots of great ideas here. Some of the themes that I dig the most are factions, martial arts tournaments, and international scope. Though I'll always love NYC, I agree, maybe the next big street level event takes place outside of it, or at the very least, is not the only location.

For me, I'd turn the concept of superhero street level characters on its head. The heroes are not fighting against the gangs.
Egads, let's just say there's still some fine tuning with my ideas .

Back when the book Marvel Knights was coming out I though the team could be close to this concept.

Luke Harlem
Shang Chi Chinatown
Moonknight Lower Manhattan
Daredevil as always Hells Kitchen such as it is.
White Tiger could cover the bronx
Brooklyn Used to be home to Cap but I dont see him used like this. Maybe Hawkeye.
Misty could be the big picture person
They cover their areas day to day and come together as needed for bigger threats gangs etc.

[Vanguard]

Blade is gonna get lowballed.

[Huntsman Spider]

You know, half the fun in this would be watching Daredevil, Cage+Iron Fist and The Daughters Of The Dragon carry the load while The Avengers and FF are cluelessly trying to figure out WTF is going on.

Nice meta on class divide in that.

Oh, definitely. Could throw in Spider-Man for commentary, as he's had a foot in both worlds over the course of his published existence.

[pageturner]

Oh, definitely. Could throw in Spider-Man for commentary, as he's had a foot in both worlds over the course of his published existence.

Cage too considering his time on the FF, Defenders and Avengers

[Huntsman Spider]

Cage too considering his time on the FF, Defenders and Avengers

Good point there.

[Zero Hunter]

Hearing lots of great ideas here. Some of the themes that I dig the most are factions, martial arts tournaments, and international scope. Though I'll always love NYC, I agree, maybe the next big street level event takes place outside of it, or at the very least, is not the only location.

For me, I'd turn the concept of superhero street level characters on its head. The heroes are not fighting against the gangs. Rather, the heroes ARE the gangs. I can envision a story where the street level heroes start to become clannish and form their own territories across the New York City. They keep the crime in those areas in check, but they start to have friction with one another over how best to deal with the crime. Additionally, when crime spills over into the other's territory, conflicts ensue. Indeed, I can see Daredevil and Elektra head up a Hand faction in Hell's Kitchen. Iron Fist and Pei set up a "Little K'un Lun." Shang Chi controls the Chinese areas of Chinatown, Flushing, and Sunset Park. Luke Cage sets something up in Harlem while a newly resurrected Hector Ayala with the other White Tigers and Black Tarantula establish a hold in the South Bronx. Brooklyn is off limits as Ghost Rider's territory. There are free agents like Punisher and Cloak and Dagger while there are those who want to unite everyone together again like Misty Knight, Colleen Wing, and most importantly of all Spider-Man. And through it all, Mayor Wilson Fisk and his official task force launch an official campaign to the stamp out the street level characters. He presents himself as the savior when in reality he sees a golden opportunity to reclaim power in the city.

The problem with that is it is just the same old same old hero vs hero troupe that Marvel has beaten to death the last 20 years. Plus if not handled perfectly it will damage the characters long term.

[DrNewGod]

The Dispossessed:

A new criminal entity - The Dispossessed - begins to make a push into Organized Crime across the entire US. Almost Hydra-like, The Dispossessed is distinguished in seeming almost completely decentralized. They are also unique in being made up largely of Latin American and African immigrants, although a substantial minority of their ranks include native born American citizens of color. As the event unfolds, it becomes apparent that all members of The Dispossessed are, or are descended from people who had to flee persecution in their native lands.

The Dispossessed aren't like the gangs they seek to supplant. Aside from feeling more like a movement than an organization, they are as likely to covertly fund protest movements and civic programs as they are to run criminal operations, and they rigidly refuse to move drugs within their own ethnic and racial communities. In fact, some of their most intense battlegrounds with other gangs are not to take over drug trade, but to eliminate it. All that said, they are running rackets of all kinds, real estate swindles, identity theft, prostitution, kiddie porn, extortion, murder for hire... the list is endless.

The Heroes reacting to this are the usual suspects: Daughters of the Dragon, Cage+Iron Fist, Spider-Man, etc., but one extremely surprising character, The Black Panther. T'Challa's stake in all of this is as mysterious as The Dispossessed’s origins. The only one that seems to have some notion of what's what is Daredevil, and for some reason, he's not talking.

In the end, it’s revealed that Wakanda has a direct role in the roots of The Dispossessed. Klaw, it turns out, didn't just walk into Wakanda way back in the day when he killed T'Chaka, he had help. A cabal with members from all of the Wakandan tribes had colluded to aid Klaw in hopes of creating enough unrest to depose the existing order. The putsch failed, and there was a pogrom of these insurrectionists (in which more than a few innocents were swept up). The children of the traitors were driven out of the country, almost all of them on a ship bound for New York, where they grew up in squalor, surviving as best they could.

T’Challa, still being a child, was told none of this by the Wakandan council that exercised regency until he was of age, and they concealed it for some time, even after his coronation. This was one of the main reasons The Black Panther came to the US to join the Avengers, not just to spy – as he allowed others to believe – but to have a discrete base of operations from which to find as many of the lost children as he could. This is why, for a time, T’Challa adopted an alias and worked as a school teacher. This is also why The Black Panther would periodically return to the Avengers for no other discernable reason, to continue his search.

Early attempts proved that such a large number – particularly of second generation children – could not be repatriated. Being Wakandan is about more than birth, entailing many ritual rights-of-passage that earn one a place in the society. Instead, Wakanda set up a program to provide relief and aid for the exiles, and their children. Lawyer Matt Murdoch had been the program’s attorney and steward for several years (it gets overlooked a lot since the 1970s, but BP and DD had almost as tight a relationship as BP did with Captain America).

Thing was, The Black Panther was not the only one seeking these displaced children, so was Erik Killmonger. Exploiting their oppression by the powers of both their ancestral and current lands, Killmonger helped the children organize The Dispossessed. If The Dispossessed succeed, and create a power-base within America, that’s all well and good with Killmonger. Should they fail, he means to use their origins to turn the entire world on Wakanda.

Like the Triad idea I proposed, this one is tricky, requiring a very culturally aware pen, but it also offers some real dilemmas for Cage, Misty, The Falcon, Battlestar, Ms. Marvel and a several others as the nature of The Dispossessed are slowly exposed. The sympathies of some of the heroes could swing more than once, and there’s an opportunity for a real collision between Cage and The Black Panther. Writing the gang members and BP would be the key. The Dispossessed, have genuine grievances, want a better world, and are looking for a place in the world that was stripped from them. BP is trying to honor his obligations to the Wakandan-descended among them, but he can't countenance their crimes, nor can he take responsibility for their non-Wakandan members. Above all, he must protect Wakanda, not only diplomatically, but what it means to be Wakandan.

[DrNewGod]

Hearing lots of great ideas here. Some of the themes that I dig the most are factions, martial arts tournaments, and international scope. Though I'll always love NYC, I agree, maybe the next big street level event takes place outside of it, or at the very least, is not the only location.

For me, I'd turn the concept of superhero street level characters on its head. The heroes are not fighting against the gangs. Rather, the heroes ARE the gangs. I can envision a story where the street level heroes start to become clannish and form their own territories across the New York City. They keep the crime in those areas in check, but they start to have friction with one another over how best to deal with the crime. Additionally, when crime spills over into the other's territory, conflicts ensue. Indeed, I can see Daredevil and Elektra head up a Hand faction in Hell's Kitchen. Iron Fist and Pei set up a "Little K'un Lun." Shang Chi controls the Chinese areas of Chinatown, Flushing, and Sunset Park. Luke Cage sets something up in Harlem while a newly resurrected Hector Ayala with the other White Tigers and Black Tarantula establish a hold in the South Bronx. Brooklyn is off limits as Ghost Rider's territory. There are free agents like Punisher and Cloak and Dagger while there are those who want to unite everyone together again like Misty Knight, Colleen Wing, and most importantly of all Spider-Man. And through it all, Mayor Wilson Fisk and his official task force launch an official campaign to the stamp out the street level characters. He presents himself as the savior when in reality he sees a golden opportunity to reclaim power in the city.

Yeah, sorry, there are a lot of weird pieces in there, some that don't fit properly under present Marvel Universe circumstances.

Following along with the idea of other cities, I could see a street level event that's global in scope. I could definitely see an old criminal organization, whether it be Zheng Zhu's or the Maggia, extending its reach to cities all over America and all over the world. Factions, led by appointed villains, start to spread not only in American cities like Philadelphia, Chicago, Los Angeles, and Houston, but also international cities like Shanghai, Tokyo, London, Paris, Mexico City, Sao Paolo, Madripoor etc. It's low level enough to not attract the major heroes, but a huge threat that street level heroes have to go across the globe to stop it. Basically, it's just a excuse to see our street level heroes fight on another street.

Egads, let's just say there's still some fine tuning with my ideas .

I kept re-reading this because it sounded familiar. It's got a bit in common with Moore's Twilight of the Superheroes proposal to DC from the late 1980s.

[Huntsman Spider]

The Dispossessed:

A new criminal entity - The Dispossessed - begins to make a push into Organized Crime across the entire US. Almost Hydra-like, The Dispossessed is distinguished in seeming almost completely decentralized. They are also unique in being made up largely of Latin American and African immigrants, although a substantial minority of their ranks include native born American citizens of color. As the event unfolds, it becomes apparent that all members of The Dispossessed are, or are descended from people who had to flee persecution in their native lands.

The Dispossessed aren't like the gangs they seek to supplant. Aside from feeling more like a movement than an organization, they are as likely to covertly fund protest movements and civic programs as they are to run criminal operations, and they rigidly refuse to move drugs within their own ethnic and racial communities. In fact, some of their most intense battlegrounds with other gangs are not to take over drug trade, but to eliminate it. All that said, they are running rackets of all kinds, real estate swindles, identity theft, prostitution, kiddie porn, extortion, murder for hire... the list is endless.

The Heroes reacting to this are the usual suspects: Daughters of the Dragon, Cage+Iron Fist, Spider-Man, etc., but one extremely surprising character, The Black Panther. T'Challa's stake in all of this is as mysterious as The Dispossessed’s origins. The only one that seems to have some notion of what's what is Daredevil, and for some reason, he's not talking.

In the end, it’s revealed that Wakanda has a direct role in the roots of The Dispossessed. Klaw, it turns out, didn't just walk into Wakanda way back in the day when he killed T'Chaka, he had help. A cabal with members from all of the Wakandan tribes had colluded to aid Klaw in hopes of creating enough unrest to depose the existing order. The putsch failed, and there was a pogrom of these insurrectionists (in which more than a few innocents were swept up). The children of the traitors were driven out of the country, almost all of them on a ship bound for New York, where they grew up in squalor, surviving as best they could.

T’Challa, still being a child, was told none of this by the Wakandan council that exercised regency until he was of age, and they concealed it for some time, even after his coronation. This was one of the main reasons The Black Panther came to the US to join the Avengers, not just to spy – as he allowed others to believe – but to have a discrete base of operations from which to find as many of the lost children as he could. This is why, for a time, T’Challa adopted an alias and worked as a school teacher. This is also why The Black Panther would periodically return to the Avengers for no other discernable reason, to continue his search.

Early attempts proved that such a large number – particularly of second generation children – could not be repatriated. Being Wakandan is about more than birth, entailing many ritual rights-of-passage that earn one a place in the society. Instead, Wakanda set up a program to provide relief and aid for the exiles, and their children. Lawyer Matt Murdoch had been the program’s attorney and steward for several years (it gets overlooked a lot since the 1970s, but BP and DD had almost as tight a relationship as BP did with Captain America).

Thing was, The Black Panther was not the only one seeing these displaced children, so was Erik Killmonger. Exploiting their oppression by the powers of both their ancestral and current lands, Killmonger helped the children organize The Dispossessed. If The Dispossessed succeed, and create a power-base within America, that’s all well and good with Killmonger. Should they fail, he means to use their origins to turn the entire world on Wakanda.

Like the Triad idea I proposed, this one is tricky, requiring a very culturally aware pen, but it also offers some real dilemmas for Cage, Misty, The Falcon, Battlestar, Ms. Marvel and a several others as the nature of The Dispossessed are slowly exposed. The sympathies of some of the heroes could swing more than once, and there’s an opportunity for a real collision between Cage and The Black Panther. Writing the gang members and BP would be the key. The Dispossessed, have genuine grievances, want a better world, and are looking for a place in the world that was stripped from them. BP is trying to honor his obligations to the Wakandan-descended among them, but he can't countenance their crimes, nor can he take responsibility for their non-Wakandan members. Above all, he must protect Wakanda, not only diplomatically, but what it means to be Wakandan.

Sounds like the makings of an incredible street epic, though when you bring up Spider-Man, I could see Miles Morales taking point here, as he'd arguably have more reason --- personally and/or culturally speaking --- to take a stand in what's happening with the Dispossessed than Peter Parker would, even if Peter would still attempt to intervene out of the goodness of his heart.

[Tien Long]

The problem with that is it is just the same old same old hero vs hero troupe that Marvel has beaten to death the last 20 years. Plus if not handled perfectly it will damage the characters long term.

You're welcome, and good point.



Yeah, but it's got promise, which is the important thing, I think.

I kept re-reading this because it sounded familiar. It's got a bit in common with Moore's Twilight of the Superheroes proposal to DC from the late 1980s.

No problem. All critiques are welcome. Yes, the idea has potential, but it certainly has been done in other ways.

The Dispossessed:

A new criminal entity - The Dispossessed - begins to make a push into Organized Crime across the entire US. Almost Hydra-like, The Dispossessed is distinguished in seeming almost completely decentralized. They are also unique in being made up largely of Latin American and African immigrants, although a substantial minority of their ranks include native born American citizens of color. As the event unfolds, it becomes apparent that all members of The Dispossessed are, or are descended from people who had to flee persecution in their native lands.

The Dispossessed aren't like the gangs they seek to supplant. Aside from feeling more like a movement than an organization, they are as likely to covertly fund protest movements and civic programs as they are to run criminal operations, and they rigidly refuse to move drugs within their own ethnic and racial communities. In fact, some of their most intense battlegrounds with other gangs are not to take over drug trade, but to eliminate it. All that said, they are running rackets of all kinds, real estate swindles, identity theft, prostitution, kiddie porn, extortion, murder for hire... the list is endless.

The Heroes reacting to this are the usual suspects: Daughters of the Dragon, Cage+Iron Fist, Spider-Man, etc., but one extremely surprising character, The Black Panther. T'Challa's stake in all of this is as mysterious as The Dispossessed’s origins. The only one that seems to have some notion of what's what is Daredevil, and for some reason, he's not talking.

In the end, it’s revealed that Wakanda has a direct role in the roots of The Dispossessed. Klaw, it turns out, didn't just walk into Wakanda way back in the day when he killed T'Chaka, he had help. A cabal with members from all of the Wakandan tribes had colluded to aid Klaw in hopes of creating enough unrest to depose the existing order. The putsch failed, and there was a pogrom of these insurrectionists (in which more than a few innocents were swept up). The children of the traitors were driven out of the country, almost all of them on a ship bound for New York, where they grew up in squalor, surviving as best they could.

T’Challa, still being a child, was told none of this by the Wakandan council that exercised regency until he was of age, and they concealed it for some time, even after his coronation. This was one of the main reasons The Black Panther came to the US to join the Avengers, not just to spy – as he allowed others to believe – but to have a discrete base of operations from which to find as many of the lost children as he could. This is why, for a time, T’Challa adopted an alias and worked as a school teacher. This is also why The Black Panther would periodically return to the Avengers for no other discernable reason, to continue his search.

Early attempts proved that such a large number – particularly of second generation children – could not be repatriated. Being Wakandan is about more than birth, entailing many ritual rights-of-passage that earn one a place in the society. Instead, Wakanda set up a program to provide relief and aid for the exiles, and their children. Lawyer Matt Murdoch had been the program’s attorney and steward for several years (it gets overlooked a lot since the 1970s, but BP and DD had almost as tight a relationship as BP did with Captain America).

Thing was, The Black Panther was not the only one seeing these displaced children, so was Erik Killmonger. Exploiting their oppression by the powers of both their ancestral and current lands, Killmonger helped the children organize The Dispossessed. If The Dispossessed succeed, and create a power-base within America, that’s all well and good with Killmonger. Should they fail, he means to use their origins to turn the entire world on Wakanda.

Like the Triad idea I proposed, this one is tricky, requiring a very culturally aware pen, but it also offers some real dilemmas for Cage, Misty, The Falcon, Battlestar, Ms. Marvel and a several others as the nature of The Dispossessed are slowly exposed. The sympathies of some of the heroes could swing more than once, and there’s an opportunity for a real collision between Cage and The Black Panther. Writing the gang members and BP would be the key. The Dispossessed, have genuine grievances, want a better world, and are looking for a place in the world that was stripped from them. BP is trying to honor his obligations to the Wakandan-descended among them, but he can't countenance their crimes, nor can he take responsibility for their non-Wakandan members. Above all, he must protect Wakanda, not only diplomatically, but what it means to be Wakandan.

.....I'm digging this. Initially reading it, I felt a little nervous. Displaced immigrant groups, decentralized movements, themes of race, I don't think I have to tell anyone that this is very serious stuff, especially now. But, it definitely touches on things that have always been part of urban settings. Though I still love the idea of heroes battling organized bad guys, that story can only be told so much. And perhaps the story has to change. In the 70s, 80s, and 90s, heroes handled crime by being tough on criminals. Now we're starting to realize that the "criminals" aren't the bad guys at all, just folks caught up in systemic racism and a lack of opportunity. (Honestly, that's how a lot of gangs started out, right? Especially here in America. Just a group of poor and disenfranchised people who banded together because the other groups treated them like #$^$.)

I could see there being divides among the street level heroes. Punisher and Moon Knight are less tolerant on this than Luke Cage and Shang Chi. Misty Knight would feel differently on how the police could handle this than Iron Fist. Daredevil believes in a fair law system while Falcon and Battlestar know that isn't always the case. You have the young kids, Pei, White Tiger, and Power Man who feel their own ways on the matter. Spider-Man's in there just to make sure everyone gets along. And then you have Black Panther and Kilmonger trying to win hearts and minds. (Throw the Kingpin in there too, just to make things more interesting.)

Wow, this is really good stuff!