Examples of Good Cops and Examples of Police Brutality in X-MEN comics

[Steel Inquisitor]

Because our police handle things a certain way. Magneto and Xavier talked about building something new and their government is unlike the United States. Obviously, the United States is the not only country with racist police, but it is where the X-Men were established and police in the US are the impetus for the this discussion.

How does sanctioning letting Sabretooth off the leash to steal things any different then what human governments do? Or do Operation: Paperclip with people who destroy civilisations? Which make sense because these mutants are heavily impacted by America culture and government.

How are Krakoa's cops meant to be any better than what we have? What examples do we have that this is true? Do they even have a police force? Who's on it?

This conversation is about "good cops and police brutality in X-men comics," taking the X-men out would be omitting that they're actually cops. In Bishop's case, literally, since he joined the FBI.

I should have said justice system. Our laws can't account for someone suddenly developing powers and doing harm. As readers, we don't have insight in MU law, but if the cities and countries are based on ours the prison industry is likely just as damaging and racist.

We've seen their justice system in action, it's barbaric. No lawyers, it's a kangaroo court. It was Sabre tooth but even he should have the right to a proper trial. It's not a high priority for the Quiet Council to fix, like democracy. Saying things is not the same as doing those things.



Strict instructions? They knew what he was capable of and did it anyway. They're all culpable. The funny thing is in an actual court Sabretooth would have a good defense, since they knew who he was and they didn't have laws in place or restrictions (like nanites, that's what Rogues used to restrain him in Carey's run) or having a lawyer, period.

I don't know. The book isn't out, yet. I thought they would be more like social workers.

Social workers typically bring on people like Daken for violence encounters? I don't think so. That's his role on the squad, the creators are up front with this. Not that the team is helpless without him: they have Polaris, Northstar, Rachel Summers and Prodigy - all are former super-heroes who are powerful and can look after themselves in a fight and they will fight. This is a super-hero team book, so expect action.

[Zelena]

Funny enough, the position that's been argued for a long time now is that it should be social workers who intervene in a lot of cases instead of having the police automatically called on to do so. Hell, superhero universes in general could use more concern for the personal and social welfare of their inhabitants, things like therapy and other forms of social or psychological intervention, so there would be less damaged, maladjusted individuals with outsized ability to harm themselves or others on account of also having superpowers.

Social workers? Intervene? How could social workers always know what kind of situation they will find?
Not the same work, I think.

[BroHomo]

We've seen their justice system in action, it's barbaric. No lawyers, it's a kangaroo court. It was Sabre tooth but even he should have the right to a proper trial. It's not a high priority for the Quiet Council to fix, like democracy. Saying things is not the same as doing those things.

I mean is it any more barbaric than ours? Nah...From the mighty number of TWO instances KraKoa justice was served. Ive seen no signs of barbarity. Posting what you think about a comic is not the same thing as what is going on in the comic lol

Strict instructions? They knew what he was capable of and did it anyway. They're all culpable. The funny thing is in an actual court Sabretooth would have a good defense, since they knew who he was and they didn't have laws in place or restrictions (like nanites, that's what Rogues used to restrain him in Carey's run) or having a lawyer, period.

Huh...But In an "actual Court" he would have a lawyer...there would be laws. How is "they knew whAT I was capable of" a good defense? If I a convicted criminal is arrested for another crime , blaming the justice system on failing to keep the offender locked up wouldnt be the way way to keep him from getting locked up again. lol

Social workers? Intervene? How could social workers always know what kind of situation they will find?
Not the same work, I think.

I'm assuming...as are most people that it would depend on the case and the history of the individuals involved. Soooo for example Robbery in progress?...prob call the cops, non violent drug user caught with drugs? Prob call his soc worker

[marhawkman]

Huh...But In an "actual Court" he would have a lawyer...there would be laws. How is "they knew whAT I was capable of" a good defense? If I a convicted criminal is arrested for another crime , blaming the justice system on failing to keep the offender locked up wouldnt be the way way to keep him from getting locked up again. lol

Also when the tribunal is composed of Magneto, Apocalypse, Exodus, Sinister, Mystique, Nightcrawler, Jean Grey, Storm, Emma Frost and Sebastian Shaw, threats are not a good option as a defense.

[Huntsman Spider]

Social workers? Intervene? How could social workers always know what kind of situation they will find?
Not the same work, I think.

As BroHomo mentioned below, if it's just someone on a bad trip from drugs --- or as I would add, having a mental health crisis --- it would probably be better to have social workers and therapists, along with other kinds of counselors who work and/or live in the community intercede in such situations instead of the police.

I mean is it any more barbaric than ours? Nah...From the mighty number of TWO instances KraKoa justice was served. Ive seen no signs of barbarity. Posting what you think about a comic is not the same thing as what is going on in the comic lol


Huh...But In an "actual Court" he would have a lawyer...there would be laws. How is "they knew whAT I was capable of" a good defense? If I a convicted criminal is arrested for another crime , blaming the justice system on failing to keep the offender locked up wouldnt be the way way to keep him from getting locked up again. lol
I'm assuming...as are most people that it would depend on the case and the history of the individuals involved. Soooo for example Robbery in progress?...prob call the cops, non violent drug user caught with drugs? Prob call his soc worker

Thanks for the assist, and as for your other point, I would say that's also the problem with the superhero genre in general. Because of the tendency to recycle well-known and/or popular villains as opposed to being able to make new ones, superpowered criminals and terrorists never stay locked up for long even if they are apprehended by superpowered crimefighters and counterterrorist forces. This usually gets blamed on the superheroes for not just "permanently" dealing with those guys, i.e. extrajudicial killing, but the justice system in comics is an all-around failure when it comes to keeping superpowered offenders imprisoned. Then there's the issue that a lot of the time, said justice system has a heavier-handed focus on extralegal arbiters of justice, i.e. superheroes, than it does on those who use their powers to directly harm and kill the innocent, i.e. supervillains.

[Steel Inquisitor]

I mean is it any more barbaric than ours? Nah...From the mighty number of TWO instances KraKoa justice was served. Ive seen no signs of barbarity. Posting what you think about a comic is not the same thing as what is going on in the comic lol

Yes. You're ok with the fact they have no signs of law enforcement and their "court" is laughable inept? This is what's known as a kangaroo court. Two instances in a country of how many? There should be numerous crimes in Krakoa at any given time.

Huh...But In an "actual Court" he would have a lawyer...there would be laws. How is "they knew whAT I was capable of" a good defense? If I a convicted criminal is arrested for another crime , blaming the justice system on failing to keep the offender locked up wouldnt be the way way to keep him from getting locked up again. lol

Sabretooth showed they do have a court but no lawyers, and no-one was getting him one, and the Quiet Council isn't a great idea to have as a judge and jury. That should be a separate entity. You're not that concerned how he had no access to a lawyer. Everyone should have the right to defend themselves, even Sabretooth. Because they exploited him as a weapon and they knew what he was going to do and did it anyway. They're the ones who gave him a pardon and set him loose. He broke no Krakoa laws, those were made after his mission - and the courts need far more than three vague laws in a functioning court system. Krakoa hasn't got a justice system, it's a kangaroo court held together with duct tape. What if this had happened to Cyclops instead?

I'm assuming...as are most people that it would depend on the case and the history of the individuals involved. Soooo for example Robbery in progress?...prob call the cops, non violent drug user caught with drugs? Prob call his soc worker

You don't send the national guard for all of them, and this team are not lightweights in terms of power or skill with violence.

The fact this comment was avoided speaks volumes.

How are Krakoa's cops meant to be any better than what we have? What examples do we have that this is true? Do they even have a police force? Who's on it?

[coveredinbees]

You know, I'd always thought of them as different from other heroes, but you may be right. They are like police. Moira permanently detained mutant prisoners on Muir Island without charging them. This is very similar to the fake trial of Sabertooth.

Hopefully, they will become less villainous as Krakoa proceeds. How can the X-Men become less like police and more useful like activists?

What do you think? Maybe now they can uplift mutantkind as a whole while rather than uplift just themselves at the cost of perceived ‘bad’ mutants.

[Huntsman Spider]

You know, I'd always thought of them as different from other heroes, but you may be right. They are like police. Moira permanently detained mutant prisoners on Muir Island without charging them. This is very similar to the fake trial of Sabertooth.

Hopefully, they will become less villainous as Krakoa proceeds. How can the X-Men become less like police and more useful like activists?

What do you think? Maybe now they can uplift mutantkind as a whole while rather than uplift just themselves at the cost of perceived ‘bad’ mutants.

That's kind of the point of Krakoa in the first place. The X-Men being the "good mutants" who'd fight the "bad mutants" on behalf of protecting humanity didn't work, because humanity as a whole saw all mutants as bad and never meaningfully deviated from that position, lumping the X-Men in with the Brotherhood, the Acolytes, and the Mutant Liberation Front alike as rival mutant gangs fighting it out for dominance over the planet. Hell, what was the response once the X-Men were presumed dead and gone? Wholesale genocide, whether by pushing the vaccine to negate the X-gene before it ever manifested in children and young adolescents or just killing mutants in the streets, with nary a word of protest from the rest of the 'verse.

[Frontier]

That's kind of the point of Krakoa in the first place. The X-Men being the "good mutants" who'd fight the "bad mutants" on behalf of protecting humanity didn't work, because humanity as a whole saw all mutants as bad and never meaningfully deviated from that position, lumping the X-Men in with the Brotherhood, the Acolytes, and the Mutant Liberation Front alike as rival mutant gangs fighting it out for dominance over the planet. Hell, what was the response once the X-Men were presumed dead and gone? Wholesale genocide, whether by pushing the vaccine to negate the X-gene before it ever manifested in children and young adolescents or just killing mutants in the streets, with nary a word of protest from the rest of the 'verse.

Well, setting aside whether it made any lasting impact, I think it "worked" in the sense of saving people and preventing more harm then there would have been otherwise. I don't think the X-Men did anything wrong.

But I guess there's only so much mileage you can get out of "moral victories."

[Veitha]

The fact this comment was avoided speaks volumes.

Lol you were trying to pass X-Factor as their police force in the first place. No one answered because we haven't seen a police force nor the need for or the will to create one. They don't even have a human-like education system right now, they will probably not establish any police but let people manage certain areas by themselves, kinda like their doing with education and like the New Mutants do in The Sextant. If you remove the need for money or property, give proper telepathic and empathic counseling to people who require help and take similar approaches with other issues, you might come to a point where you don't need a specific police force. And besides, Krakoa is a fairly new establishment and they're adding stuff as new comics come out, so we might see something else to deal with "problematic" people like we saw in Hellions.

[numberthirty]

Lol you were trying to pass X-Factor as their police force in the first place. No one answered because we haven't seen a police force nor the need for or the will to create one. They don't even have a human-like education system right now, they will probably not establish any police but let people manage certain areas by themselves, kinda like their doing with education and like the New Mutants do in The Sextant. If you remove the need for money or property, give proper telepathic and empathic counseling to people who require help and take similar approaches with other issues, you might come to a point where you don't need a specific police force. And besides, Krakoa is a fairly new establishment and they're adding stuff as new comics come out, so we might see something else to deal with "problematic" children like we saw in Hellions.

Just to point the obvious out...

The statement in question is busy disagreeing with itself.

Past that, it's just odd to assume that you know a lot about any book that isn't even on the stands yet.

[numberthirty]

Past that...

Based on the very small amount that we actually might be able to get out of what we know so far?

Insurance adjusters/investigators is about the closest thing to the role the team might be playing.

[Ferro]

Just to point the obvious out...

The statement in question is busy disagreeing with itself.

Past that, it's just odd to assume that you know a lot about any book that isn't even on the stands yet.

that's steel inquisitor in a nutshell, they want to disagree and be the defenition of contrarian, but never really create a statement that makes sense or that manages to not contradict itself.

Also in a world with telepaths that can get the absolute truth from your head, the justice system becomes not a matter of inocence or not, but what punishment is fitting.
no amount of lawyers can stop a telepath from seeing what actually happened, their intentions, feelings and desires during the situation, he was guilty and a punishment was given.
In creed's case he was given amnisty and given a task, he is very much capable of acting nice when it fit's him, he didn't any telepath can go into his pea brain and see so.

[Ichijinijisanji]

that's steel inquisitor in a nutshell, they want to disagree and be the defenition of contrarian, but never really create a statement that makes sense or that manages to not contradict itself.

Also in a world with telepaths that can get the absolute truth from your head, the justice system becomes not a matter of inocence or not, but what punishment is fitting.

A world of telepaths can also create intent and obfuscate truth. There are some things hidden from even the best telepaths when it becomes a matter of how good and sophisticated their blocks are and how much damage you'd have to do to use telepathy to get to that truth.
Just a general idea, not particularly related to sabretooth

[Ferro]

A world of telepaths can also create intent and obfuscate truth. There are some things hidden from even the best telepaths when it becomes a matter of how good and sophisticated their blocks are and how much damage you'd have to do to use telepathy to get to that truth.
Just a general idea, not particularly related to sabretooth

i mean sure in theory, but when it comes to jean, xavier, paris and emma in a room I seriously doubt there's anything outside their reach